Fisch's 1959 Datsun 1000 project! Peeking in the oilpan!

[fisch]

Thanks dudes! E-maing with MKlotz, I think I let the starter fluid wait too long before I cranked her. I didn't realize it evaporated so fast. There could have been 20 seconds between me spraying and cranking. If I get a spare second today i will give Mike a call, he is a phone guru!

 

Hey if I pull the valve cover, do I need to replace the gasket if it stays in one piece? I mean, I suspect I should if I were really running it, but for testing purposes?

 

I will try again and maybe get some gas from a can routed. The fuel pump has a priming ring right on it! (Which now that I think about it, was probably helpful for hand cranking!)

 

Man I wish I didn't need to work today!

 

Mag58, dude you are getting me all excited!!!! This is great to know! Have a slave cylinder for the clutch? I'd love a bolt spacing measurement on it! And I would be very curious about that mini windshield! Where are you at in Indiana? I have family in Terre Haute. (Any chance you are up for trading parts for Datsun art prints some time?)

[Ant-dat]

tried putting a little fuel down the carb? see if you get any fire

[mklotz70]

Your recommended doula is MKlotz. :D

 

.....so you're saying I'm a woman of service, assisting with the labor and birth?? :blink:

 

I'm not a doctor, but I think this '59 is crowning :)

[fisch]

.....so you're saying I'm a woman of service, assisting with the labor and birth?? :blink:

 

I'm not a doctor, but I think this '59 is crowning :)

 

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:

 

Question, is it normal to hear kind of spoogy squishy oil noises from the filter when you let off the ignition? As if oil had been slurped up and then when you let off, was returning? It is probably nothing, but I am paranoid at every noise I hear!:lol:

 

When I drained the oil there was some really goopy/snotty thick stuff in the bottom of the pan and I imagine there is still some of that sludge in the system.

 

Should I take off the valve cover and hand crank is slowly to make sure the oil pump is getting oil up to the top? Or is that being over cautious.

 

 

Ant-dat I went right to the starter fluid. I had never tried it before. I will try the gas route next.:)

[Ant-dat]

don't put loads in just a little see if it fires

[]2eDeYe]

That was an awesome video. I was thinkin "c'mon, c'mon fire up" :D

 

The noises were probably the oil settling back down. You might want to try some type of engine flush once you have it running. Or maybe a few quick oil changes after running it a while.

[420n620]

I wonder if you pour some diesel in the oil pan and slosh it around can get some or all of that goopy/snotty thick stuff in the bottom of the oil pan out of there. I have heard of people putting a little diesel in with the oil can help clean up the inside of engine. I can't remember but I think 1/2 a quart of diesel is what they used.

[Charlie69]

The check valve ball mite be stuck causing the oil to drain back into the pan. A good motor flush will probably fix it. I have run a 50 50 mix of diesel and oil in old motors to desludge them. Now I do not run them hard just let them idle till they reach operating temp and then shut them down. That was back when oil was 49 cents a quart. I honestly beleive the best way is to pull the pan and clean it out. After I reinstall the pan, change oil filter, I add 1 quart of either automatic transmision fluid or Marvel Mystery Oil and top of with regular motor oil. I run this mixture for 2000 miles. This has worked well in the past on sbc motors with stuck hydraulic lifters as it breaks down sludge and varnish deposits.

Edited November 18, 2009 by Charlie69

[420n620]

Charlie, just wondering, do you think the sulfur will hurt them old bearings..

[Charlie69]

Great point,:eek: Yes that is a very good possibility with the new high sulfer diesel fuels. I DO NOT recomend this method with the new diesel fuels USE a good quality motor flush as recomended earlier by ]2eDeYe. Thank you 420n620 for speaking up and asking that question, I should not post when I am sick and have not slept in days!:lol::lol:

[fisch]

Right! I will forget the diesel thing! Except if i remove the pan and just want to wash it out. But Marvels shouldn't hurt on the next fill, right?

[420n620]

I'd do as ]2eDeYe & Charlie said, hate to see anything happen to the engine. Marvel is some good stuff and I know it won't hurt anything.

 

get well charlie, drink lots of fluids and stay in bed ~ thats if you have your computor with ya.

[MAG58]

Which style? Does your master sit vertically or horizontally? I.e. Is it like a mini or an MGB?

 

And I live about 90 minutes away from Terre Haute.

 

Trade for Prints may be very necessary, I have too many brit car parts and too many white walls! :lol:

Edited November 18, 2009 by MAG58

[Charlie69]

Marvel is best used after the flush is done. Marvel would be very slow in breaking down the mass amount of sludge.

 

Yhank you 420n620 for the kind words.

[fisch]

Which style? Does your master sit vertically or horizontally? I.e. Is it like a mini or an MGB?

 

And I live about 90 minutes away from Terre Haute.

 

Trade for Prints may be very necessary, I have too many brit car parts and too many white walls! :lol:

 

Excellent! Interestingly I am headed to Terre Haute this weekend for T-day. Are you east, north or south? And if you find that windshield and can measure it for me, that could be awesome!

 

The slave runs horizontal. I think this pictured one might work. But am not 100% sure. Mine is missing in action so I don't know what it actually looks like!

 

Where mine goes (the plunger is part of the fork.):

[MAG58]

Heh, I think I have a few laying around, that looks to be a standard mini slave with what appears to be the standard non-cooper S push rod (the cooper S was shorter, iirc). I'll go paruze the shop come turkey day and see what I can come up with.

[fisch]

Alrighty I grabed the wife at lunch so she could turn the car over and found out pretty quick even w/ new starter fluid that we are no getting spark.

 

So this afternoon I had 10 minutes while waiting for my daughter to get off the bus and took the 58-68 Chiltons ont to the garage.

 

I hooked up a remote starter switch for the first time (So cool to not need another person!)

 

1st test- hold a spark plug wire 1/4 inch from the spark plug end. Crank. No spark.

 

2nd test- remove dist cap and rotor, make sure points are closed. Turn on key. Hold lead from coil to 1/2 above engine (ground) then slowly open points by hand. (I used a pencil so it couldn't conduct. Being sure to only touch the arm.) And observe spark from coil lead. No Spark! Manual says this means the coil is bad?

 

Sound about right to y'all?

 

I will check if it takes any sort of special coil next. I've never replaced a coil so I am not sure!

[MAG58]

Did you have B+ to the coil and are the points all good?

 

If so and the coil wasn't dead there should have been a pretty cool spark across the points as well. That said anything british derived from that era eats coils like Barry Bonds inhales the roids, hell I have two spare sitting in the mini for just such an occasion.

[fisch]

That said anything british derived from that era eats coils like Barry Bonds inhales the roids, hell I have two spare sitting in the mini for just such an occasion.

 

:lol::lol: Barry Bonds!

 

I am pretty sure everything is hooked up right. Mike Klotz walked me through the system with a test light a few weeks ago. I had to replace a little wire inside the distributor that was dead, but the test light lights up all the way to the points.

 

Good to know these things eat coils! I know the japanese improved on a few things when they made this engine based on the B1500. I hear it won't leak oil like the BMC's will. But the electronics largely look to be Lucas. Even if they are branded Hitachi!!

 

Man MAG, with all your background in English stuff, you should get one of these!:D Best of both worlds!

Edited November 18, 2009 by fisch

[datsun65]

BTW: A photocopy of the parts manual for a 1960/61 SPL212/SPL213 (With an Early E Engine) is up on ebay. Many of the diagrams may help...

 

http://tinyurl.com/spl212

[fisch]

Thanks for the pointer Datsun65!

 

So it looks like a ton of coils will work. I cross referenced what Rock Auto said a Nash Metropolitan with the same basic engine would use, and that part crossed to a TON of other vehicles including most old VW stuff. (Gotta love Rock Auto from a research standpoint!!) Below is a list.

 

It only list a an 84 Nissan for some reason? But I'd bet the one in the 521 would do the job. I have a 12v coil that says for 'electronic ignition'. For an eventual EI swap, but I shouldn't use that on the 59, right?

 

And just so I am sure, the positive ground aspect of the 59 won't effect the coil right? But I need to wire the negative from the coil to the Distributor, correct?

 

Coil swap list for AIRTEX Part # 5C1019:

ALFA ROMEO (1967 - 1983)

AUSTIN (1963 - 1974)

BMW (1966 - 1976)

CHRYSLER (1953 - 1955)

DODGE (1956 - 1958)

FIAT (1974 - 1979)

HILLMAN (1958 - 1966)

HONDA 1973

JAGUAR (1961 - 1971)

LOTUS (1966 - 1975)

MAZDA (1971 - 1973)

MERCEDES-BENZ (1960 - 1965)

MG (1956 - 1975)

NASH (1954 - 1962)

NISSAN 1984

OPEL (1968 - 1975)

PEUGEOT (1971 - 1974)

PLYMOUTH (1956 - 1959)

PORSCHE (1968 - 1975)

RENAULT (1968 - 1980)

SAAB (1959 - 1972)

STUDEBAKER (1956 - 1960)

SUNBEAM (1956 - 1961)

TOYOTA (1968 - 1969)

TRIUMPH (1962 - 1972)

VOLKSWAGEN (1963 - 1983)

VOLVO (1969 - 1973)

[mklotz70]

Double check that that the points are switching the grd to the coil with the test light. Put the test light clamp on the neg term(not grd) of batt and the point on the neg term of coil(has a neg sign and it's the one that connects to the dizzy) You should get a light when the points are closed and no light when open. Hit your remote start switch and see that it flashes when it rotates. If it does, then move the clamp for the test light over to the grd(pos) term of the bat and put the point on the pos(+) term of coil. It should light with the key on. Now.......make sure that it stays on when you crank it with the key and not the remote start switch. There's two different contacts in the ign switch. One to provide power in the ON position and another to provide power in the start(crank) position. I know we checked it in the ON position......don't know if we checked it in crank. If you have all of these, then you have a bad coil......but I thought got a spark out of it when we tested it before. If the light is not bright when doing the previous flashing test, run an extra jumper from the dizzy body to ground(pos term of batt) and see if it brightens up. If it does, recheck for spark.

 

Your coil may not be strong enough to jump the gap the book is describing. Put a spark plug in the end of the wire and ground the metal body of the plug and try their test.

 

You can borrow the coil from your truck. The pos ground won't change anything....hook it up the same as the stock one if you put it in.

[fisch]

Double check that that the points are switching the grd to the coil with the test light. Put the test light clamp on the neg term(not grd) of batt and the point on the neg term of coil(has a neg sign and it's the one that connects to the dizzy) You should get a light when the points are closed and no light when open. Hit your remote start switch and see that it flashes when it rotates. If it does, then move the clamp for the test light over to the grd(pos) term of the bat and put the point on the pos(+) term of coil. It should light with the key on. Now.......make sure that it stays on when you crank it with the key and not the remote start switch. There's two different contacts in the ign switch. One to provide power in the ON position and another to provide power in the start(crank) position. I know we checked it in the ON position......don't know if we checked it in crank. If you have all of these, then you have a bad coil......but I thought got a spark out of it when we tested it before. If the light is not bright when doing the previous flashing test, run an extra jumper from the dizzy body to ground(pos term of batt) and see if it brightens up. If it does, recheck for spark.

 

Your coil may not be strong enough to jump the gap the book is describing. Put a spark plug in the end of the wire and ground the metal body of the plug and try their test.

 

You can borrow the coil from your truck. The pos ground won't change anything....hook it up the same as the stock one if you put it in.

 

Guess what. The PO did not know this was a positive ground car and had the positive coil terminal wired to the dizzy and not the neg!

 

That said, I switched them back, wiring the neg from the coil to the dist. And it still failed your first test Mike. Test light from battery neg to coil neg lights up, but separating the points does NOT turn the light off.

 

Additionally test light from battery neg to positive on coil lights up too! With points either open or closed, it still lights up.

 

Does that mean a short inside the coil?

[bonvo]

did you replace the points? i would replace them along with the coil that way preity muc the entire ignition system is new makes things almost fool proof

[MAG58]

Does that mean a short inside the coil?

 

Depends. Easy way to check that is to put a volt/ohm meter across the leads to the coil. It should read aroundabouts 3 ohms. Next guess would be that the condenser relieved itself of duty.

 

 

And I'm only so much masochist. I kinda want to tube frame my mini and put a turbo rotary rwd in it. That said, I'd do naughty naughty things for an SPL311.