Stoffregen Motorsports Posted May 13, 2023 Report Share Posted May 13, 2023 Most times it's just the solenoid. If you have a rebuilder nearby, have them rebuild the starter instead of buying another junk reman starter. My local guy charges less than a chinese rebuild, and has the knowledge to upgrade things like bearings and such. Quote Link to comment
d.p Posted May 13, 2023 Report Share Posted May 13, 2023 1 hour ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said: Most times it's just the solenoid. If you have a rebuilder nearby, have them rebuild the starter instead of buying another junk reman starter. My local guy charges less than a chinese rebuild, and has the knowledge to upgrade things like bearings and such. I don’t buy this mentality cause the local “alternator” guy never could rebuild any of the alternators I took him. I had better luck buying new then him. if I buy a starter it’s going to be an Ermish or the ones Hainz was posting about. No reman’d. Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted May 13, 2023 Author Report Share Posted May 13, 2023 Well I went the remanufactured route since it was free.... got it this morning already installed... Spins the engine faster than the old one.... 1 Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted May 28, 2023 Author Report Share Posted May 28, 2023 Well I think my new starter has a bad solenoid.... Ahh the fun of the autozone remanufactured lifetime warranty... I'm still gonna make sure the start cable is good but when it does catch it spins the motor way faster than before, so I really dont think it's a voltage issue.... I dont think it needs the hot start relay because I already have that and I can hear that relay and the solenoid click when it tries.... not sure when I'll see if they will swap it out again... I also ran into a wierd issue last weekend, the old starter case was actually smaller than the new one. With the new starter my socket got stuck on the bolt.... I managed to half ass tighten things with a wrench, but this weekend I decided to fix that.... Old bolt.. New shoulder bolt... 2 Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted May 29, 2023 Report Share Posted May 29, 2023 A 280zx gear reduction starter is a direct fit for any L series, and one cool feature of that starter is that it shares architecture with many muscle car starters, meaning that there are dozens of good quality aftermarket motors available to fit that nose piece. I just checked Rockauto and they list the starter, but it doesn't look exactly like the original unit. If you can find a junkyard unit, that's the one. 1 Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted May 29, 2023 Report Share Posted May 29, 2023 Here's an OEM gear reduction starter. Smaller, modern motors bolt to that nose piece. 2 1 Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted May 29, 2023 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2023 2 hours ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said: A 280zx gear reduction starter is a direct fit for any L series, and one cool feature of that starter is that it shares architecture with many muscle car starters, meaning that there are dozens of good quality aftermarket motors available to fit that nose piece. I just checked Rockauto and they list the starter, but it doesn't look exactly like the original unit. If you can find a junkyard unit, that's the one. Unfortunately my only choice is to try again at autozone with the lifetime warranty... money is a bit tight at the moment.. 1 Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted May 29, 2023 Report Share Posted May 29, 2023 I have the same but from an '84 Maxima. If you have the oil pressure sender for a gauge it's... tight, and take the battery cable off 1 Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted May 29, 2023 Report Share Posted May 29, 2023 Nissan Motorsports used to sell a smaller motor that fit the nose piece. It looked like a '90s Toyota starter. Very compact. Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted May 29, 2023 Author Report Share Posted May 29, 2023 I put a voltmeter on the output side of the solenoid and nothing comes through when it clicks.... Voltage from the battery is fine, so I can only assume the solenoid is faulty.... I cleaned and reseated the connections just to be sure.... if the problem continues I'll head to autozone this week.... 1 Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted May 31, 2023 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2023 (edited) Regarding the starter.... I'm sure we can all agree the solenoid is the weak link.... The starter I have has an intermittent issue with the solenoid but spins the motor over nice and fast when It actually works.... I thought about picking up a universal external Ford starter solenoid... My thought is if the problem goes away I can confidently say the solenoid is in fact bad.... I could probably even wire them together with a bypass switch on the trigger.... that way I have an instant back up.. I'll probably see what autozone says about it first but I'd hate to replace it again only to realize its not the starter... Edited May 31, 2023 by Crashtd420 Quote Link to comment
Ooph! Posted May 31, 2023 Report Share Posted May 31, 2023 (edited) The ford uses a non solenoid starter. A lot of racers use them as a starter relay and I've heard people say they use them because of exhaust heat soak, but if the solenoid on the vehicles starter does not work nothing will change. If it spins the motor but doesn't push the gear out it still won't. Edited May 31, 2023 by Ooph! Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted May 31, 2023 Author Report Share Posted May 31, 2023 39 minutes ago, Ooph! said: The ford uses a non solenoid starter. A lot of racers use them as a starter relay and I've heard people say they use them because of exhaust heat soak, but if the solenoid on the vehicles starter does not work nothing will change. If it spins the motor but doesn't push the gear out it still won't. I think I said motor referring the actual engine not the starter motor... I think my wording was a little off... When the starter works it engages the engine every time and spins the engine nice and fast... When I doesn't I can hear the solenoid click but no power passes through... With your comment about the vehicles starter solenoid why do think if that one doesn't work an external one won't work either? I think that goes back to my poor wording..... Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted May 31, 2023 Report Share Posted May 31, 2023 Using the Ford style relay is common, but you need to make a jumper from the batt side of the starter to the solenoid terminal for it to work. It might work, even with a weak solenoid, because of the increase in available voltage. I'm sick today and my head is kinda foggy, but I think you'll understand what I mean. 1 Quote Link to comment
Ooph! Posted June 1, 2023 Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 6 hours ago, Crashtd420 said: When I doesn't I can hear the solenoid click but no power passes through... With your comment about the vehicles starter solenoid why do think if that one doesn't work an external one won't work either? I think that goes back to my poor wording..... What I was trying to say is that even with the addition of another relay the starter still relies on the one in it. What Stoffregen Motorsports said is true, it MAY work with the additional current but then again it may not. The solenoid on the starter moves inside to shove the gear out but it also closes the contacts that energize the drive motor. Is it worth a try? sure why not. 1 Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted June 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 8 hours ago, Ooph! said: What I was trying to say is that even with the addition of another relay the starter still relies on the one in it. What Stoffregen Motorsports said is true, it MAY work with the additional current but then again it may not. The solenoid on the starter moves inside to shove the gear out but it also closes the contacts that energize the drive motor. Is it worth a try? sure why not. That clarified things for me.... I didn't realize the solenoid is doing both.... in my mind I thought it was just a big relay.... forgot about what activates the bendix gear.. 2 Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted June 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 Wait a minute.... If you have to activate the trigger on the starters solenoid to make the bendix gear engage then why does a screwdriver across the 2 larger terminals let you jump a starter..... A swear I have bench tested one with a jumper box by grounding the case and touching to large terminal (that would be the lug coming out of the solenoid and into the starter case).. ????????? Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 1, 2023 Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 (edited) a HOT START relay most time would accomplish this to work. as your giinv the selinoid more current or a stable voltage to the selinoid. the Stoffregen way is like a FORD RELAY with the big battary posts going in and out then to the starter lug on starater (then a jumper from the starter lug to the selinoid tap. as in photo.pu the cable to the hex nut side. your starter signal wire will be the orginal wire but go to the Ford relay. The Ford Relay will be grounded thru the case batter jumper.webp Edited June 1, 2023 by banzai510(hainz) Quote Link to comment
mainer311 Posted June 1, 2023 Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 I think it depends on the starter. In some cases, you might have to jump the batt and start terminals together, and then bridge the solenoid contacts. Or, have someone hold the key in the start position while you bridge the contacts. I guess I never realized this, but technically the plunger coil activates the gear into position before it even starts spinning. I always thought it spun before engaging. Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted June 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 I guess it's time for an experiment..... Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 1, 2023 Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 there is a certain point wear the copper contack just wear out or corroded and still may not work. I like the Nippondeso type or style) starters as one can change the contacks easy Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted June 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 3 minutes ago, banzai510(hainz) said: a HOT START relay most time would accomplish this to work. as your giinv the selinoid more current or a stable voltage to the selinoid. the Stoffregen way is like a FORD RELAY with the big battary posts going in and out then to the starter lug on starater (then a jumper from the starter lug to the selinoid tap. as in photo. your starter signal wire will be the orginal wire but go to the Ford relay. The Ford Relay will be grounded thru the case batter jumper.webp 45.73 kB · 1 download Most of my truck is not stock wiring so my starter was always setup with a hot start relay.... Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted June 1, 2023 Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 (edited) On 5/28/2023 at 2:03 PM, Crashtd420 said: Ahh the fun of the autozone remanufactured lifetime warranty.. I got 8 months to a maybe 1.5 yrs on a daily driver 521 had weak signal and I put a HOTSTART on my 521. My key switch was just wearing out. I also had a nissan NOS 280zx starter and put a new selinoid from Summit Racing on there If you think you have a LOW Voltage issue you can go direct from battery to the starter tab and see if starter works. this bypass all switches .If yyour starter is anygood really Edited June 1, 2023 by banzai510(hainz) Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted June 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 Just now, banzai510(hainz) said: there is a certain point wear the copper contack just wear out or corroded and still may not work. I like the Nippondeso type or style) starters as one can change the contacks easy This starter is honestly only a week old and has never worked properly..... Quote Link to comment
Crashtd420 Posted June 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted June 1, 2023 4 minutes ago, banzai510(hainz) said: I got 8 months to a maybe 1.5 yrs on a daily driver 521 had weak signal and I put a HOTSTART on my 521. My key switch was just wearing out. I also had a nissan NOS 280zx starter and put a new selinoid from Summit Racing on there If you think you have a LOW Voltage issue you can go direct from battery to the starter tab and see if starter works. this bypass all switches .If yyour starter is anygood really I actually got almost 4 years out of the last one.... and I drive the truck 5 to 6 days a week 8 or 9 months out of the year.... I already checked voltage to both the input and output lug on the starter and the trigger wire... If the solenoid passes power it works great... I honestly dont believe voltage is an issue with my truck.... Quote Link to comment
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