TimGreen Posted May 3, 2018 Report Share Posted May 3, 2018 We recently purchased a '82 B210 race car with a stock 1.4L engine. It is grossly underpowered, we were passed by every car this weekend at Blackhawk Farms Raceway. I am looking for recommendations, is there a cam that will help, better valves, stroker kit, etc. This is our first Datsun. Thanks, TimG Quote Link to comment
captain720 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Stock carb? How much do you want to spend.?.?.?.?. Quote Link to comment
flatcat19 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Knowing what you have to start with would better help us help you. The trick with a 210, keep it wound out. Let the R's fall, and you fall behind. 1 Quote Link to comment
TimGreen Posted May 4, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 I believe it is a totally stock engine EXCEPT; it has a two-barrel downdraft Weber carb, headers, no muffler, and no fan. I don't want to spend a fortune but it would be nice if he could keep up with the crowd. Quote Link to comment
flatcat19 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Is this a crowd of other 210s? Or similar cars? I'd be willing to bet their motors alone could feed a village. 1 Quote Link to comment
racerx Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 I believe it is a totally stock engine EXCEPT; it has a two-barrel downdraft Weber carb, headers, no muffler, and no fan. I don't want to spend a fortune but it would be nice if he could keep up with the crowd....what's a fortune? Quantify? Quote Link to comment
TimGreen Posted May 4, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 $500 to $750 is my first guess Quote Link to comment
mhub91 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 If you've only got $500 - $750 to spend I'd start by selling the B210 to fund something else. Not kidding. I spent over $500 on just my B210 radiator. I'm not rich either, don't get the wrong impression. 3 Quote Link to comment
flatcat19 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Fast 210s are bloody expensive. But so fucking cool. Does your division of racing let you do motor swaps? We're missing so much info to make this a real conversation. 1 Quote Link to comment
racerx Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 What's the condition of the engine? Compression? 1 Quote Link to comment
Morrisun Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 You state that it is a 82 B210, probably not. They stopped make B210 in 1978. The significance difference is the A14 in the B210 had oval port heads and flow fairy well. The later A 14's in the the 210's had a much different head design, were H95 casting on the cylinder head located near the front under the rocker shaft. You may be able to see the casting number by removing the oil fill cap in the rocker cover shine a light in there and see what cylinder head you have?? H95 cylinder heads are/were shit! They have shrouded castings in the intake valve runners that severely restrict the air/fuel mixture, it was a smog head. It is possible that the car may have come across the boarder and have a different cylinder head. An H89, also oval port head, was the choice in the JDM for the A14/15 they have good flow characteristics. Sound like all the bolt on's are enough, a better cylinder head and a more aggressive camshaft will diffidently help. Because of the age of the car, many thing may have been swapped in/out of the car. 4 speed cars came with 3.90 rear gear ratios and 5 speed cars had 3.7 sometimes! IF it was a flat lander car 3.54 are possible, and that would hurt your acceleration. Don't get discouraged, do some investigating and see what you have to work with. 3 Quote Link to comment
KoHeartsGPA Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Fast and cheap is not reliable. Cheap and reliable is not fast. Fast and reliable is not cheap. 2 Quote Link to comment
racerx Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 My 510 is reliable but its not fast. I like it that way. 3 Quote Link to comment
Dolomite Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 My 510 is reliable but its not fast. I like it that way. My 510 is reliable but not fast...It’s depressing. I want it to be at least as fast as my Crown Vic. 2 Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Fast 210s are bloody expensive. But so fucking cool. Does your division of racing let you do motor swaps? We're missing so much info to make this a real conversation. Sounds like a car you drive to the track and 'race' rather than a race car. Another carb and a header is just scratching the surface and you'll need thousands to catch the other guys. Just ask them what they did to their cars to be so fast and you'll see. This is not to say that 'getting there' isn't fun though. You can have a lot of fun building it up in the off season and dreaming about it. 1 Quote Link to comment
metalmonkey47 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Reach out to the folks at Tomei, they've been building and racing A series motors for decades. They've developed a fair amount of parts over the years, although I doubt many are still available. Making power in an A-Series is expensive but rewarding. Also, are you competing in a particular series with restrictions on modifications? If engine swaps are possible, because you have a B310 (210) you can swap L-Series in fairly easily by utilizing the A10 chassis 510's front crossmember. IIRC it bolts directly into the 210. Quote Link to comment
TimGreen Posted May 4, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Lets start over - I bought this car for my 23 year old grandson to start racing, I have been a road racer since 1984 my 914-6 is way to expensive to start racing in so when we found the '82 Datsun 310 it seemed to be a great choice for him to learn in. I have no experience in the Datsun world so acronyms don't mean anything to me (yet). He will only race this year in a local race group called Midwestern Council of Sports Car Clubs (MCSCC) at tracks like Blackhawk Farms Raceway, Road America, Milwaukee Mile and Autobahn Country Club. Because the car was converted from SCCA ITC class to Chump Car and much of the interior was removed he will be in a class made up of Chump and Lemon Cars that MCSCC calls "ITJ". Because we bought this car as a beginner car I don't plan to invest $1,000's but would be willing to spend a 'reasonable' amount to become more than an moving chicane. If changing the head and adding a cam results in a better solution I am interested in that kind of improvement. If changing to a different engine makes more sense we can consider that. I also see the possibility for a group of us to use this car in endurance racing (Chump or Lemons) so I definitely don't want to build a grenade (i.e. 10 hour motor). The car came with 3 differentials, we haven't looked at them yet - perhaps we have the wrong one in the car for the local tracks. I hope all this helps get a better idea of what we are doing. By the way he had a great time racing last weekend regardless of the problems we had. 4 Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Does your class allow dual carbs? Or do you need a stock intake manifold? If it's a vintage class, likely you are allowed dual carbs. A dual carb A14, in fully built spec, will churn out roughly 160hp, and rev to about 10K, but that motor has a dry sump oiling system, crank-fire ignition, dual Mikuni 44's on an expensive intake manifold, mounted to a very worked over head. The bottom end will consist of Carrillo rods, forged pistons and a knife edged and nitrided (if not billet) crank. Cost for this motor? About $10K. Compression ratio and head flow will be your major areas of gain. Get a mildly worked over cylinder head and a set of custom pistons and increase to about 120hp for roughly $2000. If I had a $500 to $750 budget, and had to spend it on the engine, I'd buy a cam and valve springs from Rebello and have the Weber DGV race modified and then hog out the bowl of the intake manifold. You'll be looking at minimal gains, but your budget is tight. Don't forget to re-curve your distributor and learn how to jet the carb for the race venue. If you can master the art of carb tuning, you will be so much further ahead of the rest of the guys in the pits. 3 Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Has anyone mentioned the GX head? They are rare, but if you can find one, it's an easy way to get larger ports. 1 Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 510s were not design to be FAST so a 210 would be double negative on that. and if automatic minus another 15-20% power loss I have a Mikuni 210 sidedraft carb set up 40mm set but no manifold. But I took a inner airhorn out. so its not complete I think dual carbs would be the way to go.but not cheap unless you find a setup soemones is selling ready to go 1 Quote Link to comment
TimGreen Posted May 4, 2018 Author Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Lets be clear - THIS IS A RACE CAR, not street legal. 4 speed trans - not automatic It came with the Weber downdraft carb, intake manafold and K&N filter. It has a 8 gallon fuel cell, electric fuel pump at the cell, large fuel filter and regulator at the engine firewall set to 3.5 pounds. It has a Fram HP-1 oil filter and Accusump for high speed cornering - no oil cooler. It has an aluminum race radiator with electric fan, new water pump and the center of the thermostat has been removed. Anything that was not necessary to racing has been removed. 2 Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 Go to post #18 and 19. all has been answered 3 Quote Link to comment
metalmonkey47 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 OP, I think a lot of what you're looking to learn can be found in the Datsun1200.com wiki. (linked below) Some of this might help you better understand what some of the acronyms people are using mean. General Engine Modification: http://datsun1200.com/modules/mediawiki/index.php?title=Category:Engine_Modifications Distributorless Ignition: http://datsun1200.com/modules/mediawiki/index.php?title=EDIS Fuel System: http://datsun1200.com/modules/mediawiki/index.php?title=Category:Fuel_SystemBest place to start looking is valvetrain. Cams, valve springs, maybe even some port work just to help it flow. It probably has a Weber 32/36 carb on it. That's a progressive carb made by weber for economical performance. Weber makes a 38/38 synchronous carb that is a bit larger, would work well with a bit bigger cam and supply more than enough air for a high revving A-series engine. I ran one on my 2.2 stroker years back and loved the response, it wasn't nearly enough carb for me, but it'll be more than enough for an itty bitty A-series engine. 2 Quote Link to comment
datsunfreak Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 It has an aluminum race radiator with electric fan, new water pump and the center of the thermostat has been removed. This was a bad idea. They need the thermostat. Preferably a stock 192 (or higher) if you have an aluminum radiator. They run best around 200 degrees and that radiator will likely keep you about 1 degree above whatever the thermostat is. $500 to $750 is my first guess This is what $4000+ looks like. And that wasn't tough to spend... :rofl: Balanced A15 bottom end, mild cam (street car), heavily ported early (non-smog) A14 head with bigger valves, double valve springs and BProjects rocker spacers, dual 40s (choked down to 28mm), Nismo big tube header into 2" exhaust, 11 pound flywheel, Centerforce clutch, beefier 63A dogleg 5 speed, etc. And I could have gone faster by spending maybe 2/3 of that on an L16/L18 engine, so... :P To make the A breathe, you really need to do this to the head. They respond best to a lot of porting work... 1 Quote Link to comment
Ranman72 Posted May 4, 2018 Report Share Posted May 4, 2018 500 to 750 you need to add a zero to either number to make an a series race fast datsun power is made with rpm and head work the lower ends are pretty solid as they are 1 Quote Link to comment
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