Janksun Posted January 6, 2014 Report Share Posted January 6, 2014 So I pulled the old head off and noticed there were 3 washers on one of the head bolts. Put the new head on and put the three washers back just like it was, it went in just fine but when I went to torque it down, I stripped a little, so pulled the head back off, cleaned out the threads and tried to chase the threads with a chaser and it wouldn't go in. I tried the bolt again and it's definately stripped. Soo I need a helicoil, but Idk which one to use. Any info on what I should do? Quote Link to comment
Draker Posted January 6, 2014 Report Share Posted January 6, 2014 google timesert head repair kit. its much better than a helicoil.. 2 Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted January 6, 2014 Report Share Posted January 6, 2014 Agree 100%. Don't mess with a helicoil. They suck for that application. 1 Quote Link to comment
Janksun Posted January 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Pulled the head off today and found out that the hole has already been helicoiled. Any ideas of what I can do? Fixable? Not fixable? Quote Link to comment
MikeRL411 Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Read posts 2 and 3. 1 Quote Link to comment
Cpl620 Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Timesert makes standard size, and over sized applications for fixing problems just like that... Quote Link to comment
Janksun Posted January 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Looked it up but didn't see any oversize kits? All I've found is just their regular m10x1.5 kit. Do you happen to know a link for the specific kit? I'm going to call them tomorrow. Edit- found the kit, bottom of this page, http://www.timesert.com/html/universalheadbolt.html Part# 7580BS. Is this the right one? Quote Link to comment
Cpl620 Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 I dont know the pitch and size on the L engines, but youre in the right area. Quote Link to comment
Janksun Posted January 7, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Holy dick and balls the whole kit is $400 or more! Quote Link to comment
Cpl620 Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 I think everyone will tell you its well worth the peace of mind. That shit will probably be stronger than the block it self. and you just saw first hand what can happen to helicoils....unless you can get a whole replacement engine for cheaper. go for that! Quote Link to comment
Draker Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 I'm not sure you would need an oversize kit since you essentially need to drill it out bigger anyway. Of course the company should be able to answer that for you. But yes.. I agree that $400 is steep for this application. You could buy two complete L20's for that money. On the other hand.... you can repair lots of L20's with this kit. 1 Quote Link to comment
bananahamuck Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 $400.?? I have seen a few Time-sert kits with a like eight inserts for something like $75. on Ebay a couple weeks ago. They had drill bits, taps and what looked like everything to do the job. Quote Link to comment
wayno Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 Can't you just put another helicoil in, did it strip out what held the helicoil? What I did was have a helicoil put in by my machinist, then I bought an ARP stud kit(202-4201), have not had an issue since. http://www.ebay.com/itm/ARP-HEAD-STUD-KIT-202-4201-NISSAN-DATSUN-L20-SERIES-4-CYLINDER-12-POINT-NUTS-/380791769659?pt=Motors_Car_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item58a8f54a3b&vxp=mtr 2 Quote Link to comment
EricJB Posted January 7, 2014 Report Share Posted January 7, 2014 The old air cooled VW's had problems with head studs pulling out of the magnesium case. There was a steel threaded sleeve called a case saver that could be threaded into an oversize threaded hole in the block. They were cheap. Then we would just run the stud into that. They came in m10, which I think is the size and pitch of the bolt or ARP stud kit that Wayno is suggesting. I would also recommend it. Not fucked at all. Quote Link to comment
hang_510 Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 fucked. but fixable. replacing the block is cheaper and less work. it was for me. Quote Link to comment
kelowg Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 Maybe helicoil wasnt inserted fully. Could try another helicoil but held in with jb weld, like using loctite but different. If old one wasnt done right it might been damage by the bolt itself(deformed/stretched). 1 Quote Link to comment
MikeRL411 Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 fucked. but fixable. replacing the block is cheaper and less work. it was for me. REPEAT! See posts 2 and 3 and get on with your life. Quote Link to comment
]2eDeYe Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-threaded-inserts/=q6cynk http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-threaded-inserts/=q6cz4g Quote Link to comment
Stoffregen Motorsports Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 I used to buy them from an engine parts distributor in the bay area so I can't advise on where to buy the same, but these from Mcmaster look nice. Especially these: http://www.mcmaster.com/#93715a625/=q6dfrn and these: http://www.mcmaster.com/#96676a320/=q6dhim Quote Link to comment
Janksun Posted January 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-threaded-inserts/=q6cynk Thanks redeye! I used to buy them from an engine parts distributor in the bay area so I can't advise on where to buy the same, but these from Mcmaster look nice. Especially these: http://www.mcmaster.com/#93715a625/=q6dfrn and these: http://www.mcmaster.com/#96676a320/=q6dhim The first one looks nice, but it say in the product description that it's made for soft metals The second one is more what I'm thinking. Is there a reason that the tools to put them in are so expensive? Will a cheap tap the correct size not do the trick? And for the tool to install the insert, why couldnt I just use a bolt? Quote Link to comment
EricJB Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 If the drawing is accurate, the 2nd one looks to be a buttress thread. The angles of the thread are 7 degrees and 45 degrees. This makes for a strong, pull resistant thread, but requires a special tap. Make sure you get the tap too. I have used the 1st one in aluminum, and those tangs can be a bitch. Quote Link to comment
]2eDeYe Posted January 9, 2014 Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 Not sure why my second link went weird... This one has standard threads outside. http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-threaded-inserts/=q6i3g0 PS I love McMaster Carr :D Quote Link to comment
Janksun Posted January 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2014 Not sure why my second link went weird... This one has standard threads outside. http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-threaded-inserts/=q6i3g0 PS I love McMaster Carr :D It's still showing the same page as before?? Quote Link to comment
difrangia Posted January 10, 2014 Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 Holy dick and balls the whole kit is $400 or more! Check out 'Keenserts'. The tooling department where I work use them all the time (SAE but metric is available). They are solid and have little tangs on the periphery that drive in after inserted to lock the insert from backing out. Here's a starting point: http://www.repairengineering.com/keensert.html https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyCTh23Z6o0 http://www.mcmaster.com/#key-locking-threaded-inserts/=q6n0m2 The keenserts have a standard thread on the OD. The hole is just tapped with the proper tap and the insert is screwed in. then the tangs are driven to lock her up. Also, Heli-Coil makes a coil for cases where the original heli-coil strips out. They are called 'Twin-Serts', I believe. Steve Quote Link to comment
Janksun Posted January 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2014 Check out 'Keenserts'. The tooling department where I work use them all the time (SAE but metric is available). They are solid and have little tangs on the periphery that drive in after inserted to lock the insert from backing out. Here's a starting point: http://www.repairengineering.com/keensert.html https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyCTh23Z6o0 http://www.mcmaster.com/#key-locking-threaded-inserts/=q6n0m2 The keenserts have a standard thread on the OD. The hole is just tapped with the proper tap and the insert is screwed in. then the tangs are driven to lock her up. Also, Heli-Coil makes a coil for cases where the original heli-coil strips out. They are called 'Twin-Serts', I believe. Steve Hey thanks Steve! I was looking at those but because the description said they are for soft metals, I didn't want to go with them. I may end up going with them as they are within my price range. Quote Link to comment
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