US Health Care

[ppeters914]

x3 on locking this thread. Future political/religious postings should get one warning, then permanent ban.

[hughdogz]

^^^ Huh? The forum description says "Talk About Anything". It isn't in the Ratsun rules that state that political or religious topics cannot be discussed (a different forum I can think of has this rule though). One of the reasons I like Ratsun is that we can talk about almost anything :)

 

I doesn't quite make sense to me that we can have threads discussing T & A but when there is a thread that talks about real issues that can and will affect us all, people get all uptight.

 

It seems pretty civil so far, I'm not sure why people are offended... :huh:

[67411sss]

When you don't/can't take care of your old and young you have to ask yourself how good is this system? Do people really think they are losing their freedom by reforming a health care system that doesn't give a shit about them?

[ppeters914]

^^^ Huh? The forum description says "Talk About Anything".

Hmmmm....it does say that, doesn't it? Well, THAT WAS STUPID!!!! j/k :lol:

 

When you don't/can't take care of your old and young you have to ask yourself how good is this system? Do people really think they are losing their freedom by reforming a health care system that doesn't give a shit about them?

Excellent question. Too bad the spin artists keep that question and calm, logical, thoughtful discussion buried. What we get are sound bites repeated by uninformed sheep.

[INDY510]

[nismo dr]

If you want this thread locked maybe you should stop posting in it.

[hang_510]

 

 

look how homey played it... checkin to see if his buddy would get help from obamacare and a free amberlamps ride

 

 

breakfast 24/7 at the box, fuckin clown shoes indeed!

[nismo dr]

At 11:56 a.m. this morning, President Obama signed the health care legislation into law, turning one-sixth of our economy over to the federal government.

[hughdogz]

Instead of paying $20 for a bandage through private health insurance, now we'll only have to pay $0.20 like you would at the local pharmacy (hopefully) :lol:

[INDY510]

At 11:56 a.m. this morning, President Obama

 

 

At 12:47 he ate a philly cheese steak sandwich....

 

 

 

 

At 1:37 he got into his helicopter

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

At 5:27 he was body surfing in the bahamas:

 

[nismo dr]

:rofl:

[Figbuck]

As much as the term Obamacare bothers me, there were some deals cut there. The big drug companies got off the hook on this one. He has done a lot of good stuff but still single payer wasn't delivered. He kept some of his campaign promises, like going to war in Afghanistan, but... Barack... come on single payer is why so many people voted for you. It seems like big business thinks the Rrepublicans are just nut cases and the Democrats are the new conservatives. The board rooms looked at the Dems and said, " You know, at least we can deal with these people. They want something so let's do business. That's American, we can throw them a bone and continue to rake in profit." The Democrats are the new corporate sweet hearts. I hate to say it but things are starting to smack of fascism.

 

There are a lot of fat-assed people, but it is just ignorance. Go into any fast food restaurant and watch obese people pack their mugs with junk. Who doesn't know they blend fat back into ground beef to make it taste good. I want to take a camera into McDonalds and do a photo essay of pigs packing their snouts. In their defense, people are bombarded with marketing from big corporations to the point where they think Whoppers and Big Macs are the way to eat. I have a friend that just died from diabetes because he was poor and couldn't afford more than tacos and Wendy's burgers. Here was an otherwise brilliant and educated guy. It costs money to eat well and if you don't have a job maybe all you can afford is fast food. You could survive on food stamps, but you would have to know how to cook and eat. Most people don't know how to avoid high fat, high salt, high carb foods. It's ignorance and some of it is stupidity. My friend wouldn't exercise or quit smoking, that is stupidity.

 

Doctors and hospitals for the most part are in the business of treating disease, not health care. You get and stay healthy by diet and exercise. Lot's of people refuse to do the work. If we paid for doctors to go to school instead of graduating doctors a half million bucks in debt, maybe they would be more inclined to administer preventative health care instead of cutting on people and prescribing expensive drugs that deal with symptoms not healing causes.

 

"At 11:56 a.m. this morning, President Obama signed the health care legislation into law, turning one-sixth of our economy over to the federal government."

 

So? Educate us. How much of GNP gets turned over to the Pentagon. How come nobody bitched as the Bushies pissed away money on stupid war that was never funded from the budget, but from executive order. How much did that cost? Where did that money for that come from? What did it get us except profit for weapons manufacturers, oil companies, defense contractors like Black Water, Haliburton? Fuel burned by troops in Afghanistan costs $450 a gallon by the time contractors deliver it. How long will it take to pay for that... and we can't fund single payer health care??

 

How come nobody is outraged by the racist, homophobic crap that was being spewed by the brain dead Tea Baggers outside the Capital Sunday. How come you don't hear about the Republican legislators egging them from the balcony on the corporate news outlets? How come there was no decorum in the House Chamber? Remember Cindy Shehan getting escorted out by police, not because she said a word, but because she had a T-shirt on with a number on it. The number of war dead. What is our government coming too?

 

So, I had to go to the VA hospital yesterday. I dread going there. The smell brings back memories of time I spent in Army Hospitals. There are all these young kids... they look like kids... young guys that don't have hands or arms, or legs or no arms or legs. There are guys in wheel chairs drooling over themselves with young wives towing kids, pushing them around to clinics. It's tough man. I want to throw up. I get so upset. I can't even tell you. I cried driving home.

 

The thing is that most of these young cats are smiling and trying to make it. They are just dealing with the shit they got dealt. I was sitting in a clinic about a year ago and was reading Fine Woodworking Magazine. I guy started talking to me about woodworking and ask me what I did for a living. I said, I build furniture and stuff. He said, cool, I like that and would like to be a carpenter. I said, well I was a carpenter and a contractor for 29 years. I used to make a decent living and had employes that I paid well and gave them good benefits. He ask what happened. I said, the economy was destroyed around here and I lost the business, so I'm trying to reinvent myself and move on.

 

I ask him what he did. He hesitated and said, well I don't have a job... I guess I'm in the Oregon National Guard. I ask if he had been deployed. He said, yeah, three tours in Iraq, regular Army. He wanted to get out when his enlistment was up half way through the last tour, but because of Stop Loss, they wouldn't let him out. I ask him what his job was and he was and E6 Infantry Sgt. I ask, did all your guys come back? He said, well we did great until right before we were suppose to come back this last time. We drove a patrol down this road 356 times, did what ever we needed to do, and came back to base every night. On the 357th day we came up on a woman in the middle of the road. She just stood there and so they stopped and waited. The lead vehicle radioed, Sarge what should we do? He said let's wait. They waited and she didn't move. Finally the lead guy said, lets light her up Sarge. He said no let's wait. Finally she walked away and they proceeded with caution. Two vehicles passed the place where she was standing and when he got there a device blew them up. He lost his three best friends and his hearing for months.

 

He said that when he came back, he couldn't find a job to save his life and was going to loose his house, cars, couldn't support his wife and three kids. He re-enlisted and his unit was going to Afghanistan in two months for a tour. He got called to see the doctor and we said goodbye and good luck.

 

I have thought about that cat every day since. I wish like hell I would have got his info so I could write him. I wonder if he is back yet, what happened to him.

 

We can pay for imperialistic war to further corporate interest, but how are we going to pay to help these guys that are cannon fodder? How much is that going to cost? At least Obama is doing it on the budget. But come on, we can fund that and not fund single payer??

 

Somebody please hijack this thread with witty banter about Tiger Woods or Jesse James and Saundra... you know, the stuff that America really cares about.

 

Oh yeah, thanks again everybody for paying for my health care with a little chunk or every hour you spend at work. I'm truly grateful from the bottom of my heart.

[INDY510]

Somebody please hijack this thread with witty banter about Tiger Woods or Jesse James and Saundra... you know, the stuff that America really cares about.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[thisismatt]

Figbuck -

 

Although I don't agree with everything you've written, those are good posts for thought. I don't think you can blame anyone but the individual or, especially, his/her parents for his/her eating lifestyle. Parents these days take very little interest in their children, or their well-being, and it's reflected in every facet of life - health and education come to mind. I think it's a failure at home, of the family unit in our society. Maybe hard economic times are partially to blame, but I think parents could do a better job with their kids. If not, then I think people shouldn't have kids whom they are ill-prepared for. Eating healthy is not hard, it just takes a little time and understanding; understanding that should have been bestowed by parenting. I would even say it's cheaper, fiscally, to eat healthy (and by healthy I don't mean paying a premium for "organic" foodstuffs). A fast-food "meal" can easily cost $8, but even if you could get by with maybe $2 for the value menu burger and a small drink, you could still be making a better, healthy meal for that price (eg spaghetti w/red sauce, a vegetable, and even some lean beef in the sauce could all be had for a meal under $2 per meal).

[nismo dr]

Under a national law, companies and local governments must now measure the waistlines of Japanese people between the ages of 40 and 74 as part of their annual checkups. That represents more than 56 million waistlines, or about 44 percent of the entire population.

 

Those exceeding government limits — 33.5 inches for men and 35.4 inches for women, which are identical to thresholds established in 2005 for Japan by the International Diabetes Federation as an easy guideline for identifying health risks — and having a weight-related ailment will be given dieting guidance if after three months they do not lose weight. If necessary, those people will be steered toward further re-education after six more months.

 

To reach its goals of shrinking the overweight population by 10 percent over the next four years and 25 percent over the next seven years, the government will impose financial penalties on companies and local governments that fail to meet specific targets. The country’s Ministry of Health argues that the campaign will keep the spread of diseases like diabetes and strokes in check.

[nismo dr]

But critics say that the government guidelines — especially the one about male waistlines — are simply too strict and that more than half of all men will be considered overweight. The effect, they say, will be to encourage overmedication and ultimately raise health care costs.

[Figbuck]

Eating healthy is not hard but it takes knowledge and you have to make the choice to do it. I got Hepatitis when I was in the Army and the Doctor that treated me was a Vegetarian. Put me on a strict diet. No drugs, alcohol, no caffeine, coffee, tea, sodas, no fried foods, no fat, nothing hard for the liver to digest. I ate salads, whole grains, chicken, fish and rice and beans. I made it out of the Hep ward in record time. After I got out, I was a vegetarian and then went macrobiotic, no dairy, eggs. meat for many years. I had to learn how to shop for food, cook and eat all over again. I got into raw juice and organic gardening. I learned how to make Tofu and Miso. I made my own sea salt and harvested seaweed, grew sprouts. I ate so well and worked my ass off all day as a carpenter, all night as a musician. It was kind of expensive, took a lot of time, but I had so much energy and never got sick. I weighed 155 lbs. and was solid muscle. I am six feet tall, weigh 175 now and eat everything, but lots of veg, beans and rice, whole grains, no sugar, very little alcohol. Out side of injuries, I haven't been sick for fifteen or twenty years. Can't even remember being sick.

 

So I agree with you Matt and Hugh too. What it boils down to is ignorance. But stupidity too. Worse than ignorance. I have neighbors on food stamps and their family eats OK. They ain't livin' high on the hog and maybe the kids don't get filled up, but they are not starving and they sure aren't fat. She shops and cooks.

 

In one way I am very conservative. I chose not to have kids. One of the roots of all the problems in the worlds are too many people. The world sure doesn't miss little clones of me running around.

 

So you don't agree with every thing I say Matt... what part. Don't want to get into it huh? Nobody wants to tell me that I am full of shit here. The part of getting older is that I have been paying attention to stuff for a long time and you begin to see history repeat itself. Nobody knows how to think or write anymore?? I type so fast that I end up generalizing many times, can't shoot holes in my rhetoric??

 

Now a bunch of states attorneys generals are bringing suit with the fed? Yeah, good luck with that. the courts will throw that stuff out so fast, suing the wrong party.

 

If it wasn't such a serious situation it would be entertaining... speaking of which.... back to Tiger and Jesse... great photos by the way.

[HRH]

Judging by all that greenery you've eaten, I have no doubt you're full of shit! :rofl:

[I'm BLUE]

Judging by all that greenery you've eaten, I have no doubt you're full of shit! :rofl:

 

:w00t: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: Let's "archive" this thread shall we ? :D

[Guest DatsuNoob]

All I can say is, like with all things worth buying, you get what you pay for. Free health care is great for thos living under a bridge. You'll have the best shit you can get. But for the rest of us who already see a decline in the quality of health care, as well as the obligtation of doctors to do good work, this will only serve as a confirmation of many shit things to come. I've had bad experiences with health care. I was once on state medical coupons for my foot due to being unemployable, and since my surgeon only got a percentage of what a paying customer would've been required to pay, he did a hack job putting my foot back together. I still have problems today with swelling and difficulty walking for long periods of time, from my bones being relocated improperly. Last time I broke my arm was basically near the beggining of the recession. I overheard the doctor working on my arm in the other room talking with a receptionist. He told her to "double book" as many patients as possible. That way he makes everyone wait forever in the lobby, and once you do get seen, he nods without listening and gets you out as quickly as possible with a prescription, and without a thorough diagnosis. Last time I went to the dentist, they tried to double book me for the same procedure so they could charge me for 2 appointments! Guess what. I found a new dentist. Alot of doctors are little more than sleazy lawyers or car salesmen who went to school to learn how to fuck you in the ass. For those who think doctors arent in it to get rich, they're fulla shit. Isnt that why they went to school to begin with? It sucks to think we dont get the quality of care we deserve and so desperately need as human beings simply because the guy supposed to be giving it, looks at you with dollar signs in his eyes.

[elmerfudpucker]

I think a more effective way do reduce health care is to sterilize the welfare collecting, have a new kid every year to get more benefits, fucks that are drain to the economy. It pisses me off to no end to the sluts that have 3+ kids that dont even have the same father in common, bitching cause they think the state owes them. And the new health care bill opens the door to the illegals to get free health care now? WTF is with that?? I bust ass hustling for every dime I got just to give it away. I am so close to following my Grandfathers footsteps and move to Nova Scotia. We the American working class is getting assraped with no lube. First the War on Weed (failed) War in Iraq (turn the damn sandbox into a glass parking lot and let Allah/God/whoever sort them out),bank bail out, now the health care.. We are so fucked :angry:

[Guest DatsuNoob]

I here ya Don, I, like many other Americans are tired of having bills in place that promot e laziness for the unmotivated and leech off people who work for an honest living. When it comes to politics, I dont choose a party, I choose common sense. I'm not political, I'm just pissed off.

[Skib]

When it comes to politics, I dont choose a party, I choose common sense.

[fearincognito]

Thanks guys for all of this conversation. I was confused with what is actually happening in the states and i wanted to hear it from the people who are getting affected directly. Good topic.

[RadioRedline]

Thanks guys for all of this conversation. I was confused with what is actually happening in the states and i wanted to hear it from the people who are getting affected directly. Good topic.

 

Hear hear

 

Radio