Compression in my J13 engine

[320 Newb]

Puking out radiator fluid came first, then I discovered moisture on a spark plug. For some reason water never turned up on the dipstick. 

 

As long as your head/block aren't warped or cracked I'd stick with your J engine. Parts are easy to get. 

 

Pulling the head off is not too big of a project and you can just replace your headgasket while you're in there. There's even a good video on youtube about adjusting the valves on a J engine. I did mine recently and it was maybe a 5 hour project. And I work slow. 

[Rusty Dawg]

I was going to have someone do this work, but I've decided to take it on myself.  I will have the head tested for a crack(s) and if it's in good shape I will just replace the head gasket.  Does anyone know what part # I should order from Moss Motors to replace my gasket?  I have found a Datsun head gasket as well as a complete kit for my J13, but I would rather get a gasket from Moss Motors.

 

Also, where might I find a valve cover gasket?

 

Regards,

Roman

Edited March 18, 2021 by Rusty Dawg

[difrangia]

If your rocker cover is secured with the two rocker shaft studs, I'd get the silicone gasket for the Britt MGA/MGB. At about $22 it sounds crazy !! I went through three cork gaskets and couldn't end a small leak. Don't know if the silicone gasket is made for the cover with six screws.

[Rusty Dawg]

3 hours ago, difrangia said:

If your rocker cover is secured with the two rocker shaft studs, I'd get the silicone gasket for the Britt MGA/MGB. At about $22 it sounds crazy !! I went through three cork gaskets and couldn't end a small leak. Don't know if the silicone gasket is made for the cover with six screws.

My engine only has 6 screws holding down the valve/rocker cover.  I cannot recall which model car I should look under to get my gaskets.  Gaskets for a MGA and MGB are different, correct?

[difrangia]

I have virtually zero British car knowledge but I believe the MGA and early MGB are same/similar. Datsun built Austin/Morris cars under license in the 1950's and used a lot of that engineering when they struck out to break into the world automobile industry in late 1950's. I believe most, if not all, of the Britts had the two rocker stud retained cover.

 

My pickup is a mixed group of parts, either at build or per previous owners. Pickup is a 63 build/64 cowl tagged NL. Has spin on oil-filter & two-stud rocker cover. I've got three oil pressure relief valves; one in back left of cylinder block, one in oil filter housing, and one in the oil pump. I doubt that I'll ever have an excess oil pressure problem. I added an early MGB finned-polished alloy rocker cover and the two big knurled chrome thumb-nuts to secure it; and also the silicone gasket. 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

It appears the E and J heads are the same, or at least interchangeable.

Edited March 18, 2021 by Stoffregen Motorsports

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Here is an old thread discussing parts interchangeability. It is not super thorough, but there are some highlights.

 

One major point of confusion for me is, the J motor vs the E motor. Are the E1 and J series engines so close that parts interchange, or are they a completely different animal? Steve has an E1 I believe and his valve cover has two studs, while the J motors have six bolts through the gasket. That's one major difference I have spotted. But then I hear people say that the MG manifolds bolt onto both the E and J cylinder heads.

 

A few years ago, there was another thread with pretty comprehensive parts lists from MG to Nissan. Does anyone remember that thread? Was it even here on Ratsun? I did find a thread on britishcarforum.com titled Nissan Engine/Head Equivalent ??? Datsun B-Series?

[Rusty Dawg]

I am certain my rocker cover just has the 6 bolts and from what I've read the MGB is very similar to the J13, but not an exact copy.

[Rusty Dawg]

17 minutes ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

It appears the E and J heads are the same, or at least interchangeable.

I believe you are correct, although I would guess that if my head is cracked, it will be even more difficult to locate a head from an E vs. a J engine to replace.  Not many guys around anymore that can repair cast iron heads.

[banzai510(hainz)]

if it runs and not over heating I would just drive it

[datzenmike]

Gaskets blow. Not always the fault of a warped or cracked head.... unless you obviously drove it 30 miles without water.

 

That looks like a J series valve cover, perhaps the J was transplanted??? Look on the side of the block on the spark plug side for J13

 

 

E series (first gen) '58-'60

310 Bluebird

222 truck

 

E1 series '60-'65

311/312 Bluebird

320 truck

 

J series

'65-'67 411

'65-'69 520/521

 

[Rusty Dawg]

41 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

Gaskets blow. Not always the fault of a warped or cracked head.... unless you obviously drove it 30 miles without water.

 

That looks like a J series valve cover, perhaps the J was transplanted??? Look on the side of the block on the spark plug side for J13

 

 

E series (first gen) '58-'60

310 Bluebird

222 truck

 

E1 series '60-'65

311/312 Bluebird

320 truck

 

J series

'65-'67 411

'65-'69 520/521

 

It is a transplant and I have already identified it as a "J1300" engine by looking under the manifolds.  I will have the head checked and I will have it resurfaced since it will already be at the machine shop.  Not sure that any valve work will be needed.  I went ahead and ordered from Moss Motors a new head gasket, valve cover gasket and manifold gasket so I'm ready to go.  I ordered as if I had a 1962-1980 MGB. 

[Rusty Dawg]

If anyone here has the torque specs and sequence for this J13 I would greatly appreciate it.  I have a spec sheet that gives me a range of torque in ft. lbs. for the head and the manifold, but I thought there is a set torque spec and I haven't been able to find a sequence.

[difrangia]

2 hours ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Here is an old thread discussing parts interchangeability. It is not super thorough, but there are some highlights.

 

 

 

Matt, this might be the interchangeable page that you were referring to;

 

http://www.farm.net/~mason/datsun/datsun-parts.html

 

Mostly internal engine stuff. As Rusty says, he verified that the case is a J by the casting lettering behind the fuel pump. Main difference in the E & J engine that I've seen is the stroke. They have the same pistons. A-1200 engine pistons will interchange with E-series, but they have a shallow dish in the crown that will lower the compression ratio just a tad.

 

I bought a number of NOS oversize pistons when I was in gathering mode for my rebuild and had a set of A1200 .5mm OS pistons. I did a dimensional comparison and the A1200 and E1 were same; dia., wrist-pin dia. & deck height, etc. I sold the A-Series pistons and still have two 1mm oversize E1 Repco pistons/rings/pins if anyone needs them.

 

Steve in OK

Edited March 18, 2021 by difrangia

[difrangia]

Rusty, since you're messing around inside that engine, here is link to factory parts & service manuals for the 320 in PDF. Look on about page 34 for head torque info. I've printed them out and put in three-ring binders. also saved the PDF's on computer & data storage. I also have parts manuals for the 520/521 pickups saved. The 520 had the J-Series engine. The first six months of 520 production had the floor-shift transmission that the late 320's had. Only place that I've found parts manual for that transmission.

 

http://www.nicoclub.com/datsun-service-manuals

Edited March 18, 2021 by difrangia

[bananahamuck]

https://ratsun.net/topic/61446-j13-engine-after-market-parts-and-all-other-520-521-cross-over-parts-with-mg-also/

[320 Newb]

8 hours ago, Rusty Dawg said:

If anyone here has the torque specs and sequence for this J13 I would greatly appreciate it.  I have a spec sheet that gives me a range of torque in ft. lbs. for the head and the manifold, but I thought there is a set torque spec and I haven't been able to find a sequence.

The sequence is criss-cross, inside out. This is a pretty good video that is especially helpful when adjusting your valves. He touches on torque sequencing. 

 

 

[Rusty Dawg]

Got around to removing the head and I will get it over to my local machine shop to check out.  I don't think the head gasket looked bad, so that's a bit concerning.  Maybe you see something different.  One of the pushrods came out and the tappet is now turned sideways....ugh!

 

 

[Rusty Dawg]

This is a better photo of the gasket.

[datzenmike]

Can you post a picture of the combustion chambers, please. Never seen one before.

[Charlie69]

I have several 320 & 520 Factory Service Manual PDFs that I would be willing to copy to a USB thumb drive and ship to any one interested at Your expense for the Drive and the shipping.

 

Or if someone has server space and would post this information up for people free of charge I would be willing to send the information to them for this purpose.

 

Here is a JPG of my 320 manuals folder.  Some are the same size as others probably the same manuals but these came from different sources so I kept them as I downloaded them.

 

 

 

I also ave several 520 manual PDFs that I am willing to share. 

[Charlie69]

I have a 520 service bulletin 52 May 1965 PDF that shows comparison of E1 and J13 engine parts. I would like to share all my manual PDFs with the Datsun Nissan world.

 

Edited March 23, 2021 by Charlie69

[Rusty Dawg]

13 hours ago, datzenmike said:

Can you post a picture of the combustion chambers, please. Never seen one before.

Not sure if you are kidding here🤔

[datzenmike]

I've seen several J13 engines but never worked on one. They were before I got my first 510 and 521. Have never seen a J head off. Just curious.

 

 

 

[Rusty Dawg]

5 hours ago, datzenmike said:

I've seen several J13 engines but never worked on one. They were before I got my first 510 and 521. Have never seen a J head off. Just curious.

 

 

 

Gotcha, I thought you we pulling my leg.  I'll get you a better shot.

 

I took my head to the machine shop and sure as heck there are several minor cracks.  He will clean it up and Magnaflux it to see if there are any major cracks.  He did say that the head was pretty warped and that this out of anything might have lead to water getting in my oil.  The cracks from what he can see seem to be minor and might not have been the root cause at this time, although he said it would eventually become a big problem.  Hopefully he can repair it since I am not certain I can find another head that is bolt on ready.