The 'Perfect' Family car

[nukeday]

I've had an idea rattling around in my head since I learned we are going to have our 4th child this summer. Our minivan is at 212K and beginning to cost more in repairs than it's worth. I'm unemployed, and searching for a vehicle that will do more things than anyone else seems to want. Aside from another minivan, I can't find a vehicle in this niche that doesn't get 9mpg. What happened to a car that seats 6, and will pull a trailer?

 

My criteria is relatively simple:

 

-Seats 6 comfortably, with two of the six being in monstrous child seats.

-Has easy entrance, and low access for children

-Will pull a small trailer without frying the transmission

-Gets 20 mpg plus or minus

-Handles like a car, not a truck

-I can repair myself

 

So, what I'm actually considering is putting a Chevy 3+3 cab on a disc brake Datsun 620 chassis. Seems like I could put just about any Nissan/Datsun engine in without having to cut anything up. A/C, cruise, tilt, PS, even fuel injection would be available with this setup. Since it would be body on frame, and not used as a 'truck', I think a trunk of some sort could be welded right to the back of the cab, I'm thinking late '80's Cadillac. Maybe a cross bed style toolbox. The idea is to have some storage that is protected and lockable outside the cab, even if it's only big enough for 5 or 6 grocery bags.

 

Anyway, I know it sounds crazy, but I don't have $10K to go buy a new minivan. I am committed to being debt free (not counting my mortgage), and Datsun parts are relatively cheap and plentiful here in the PNW. I found two GM 3+3 cabs within 100 miles for less than $200 each. Oregon allows an 'assembled' title under these circumstances, and the paperwork is no different than swapping an actual Datsun cab to the frame.

 

Anyone happen to have one of each to do some measuring?

 

Am I nuts?

[motavated]

You can save money and buy a old 4runner?

 

How cheap are you?

What my parents did was buy a small truck and they added a camper... They bolted down bench seats down into the bed with out belts. Enough for a family of six I guess. Luckily we didn't crash and we came out ok. Some even Fuse the camper with the indoor cabin by removing the rear glass area. That is getto cheap.

[mike]

Early datsun 810... I dont know about the seating 6 comfortably though...Maybe 5...

 

My friend went through this same deal, I told him to sell some of his kids to a good home and take the money and buy something cool :lol: ...He laughed... His wife didnt... especially when I said they could always adopt the redheaded one back... he now drives a kia minivan that he says is cool because he can take the seats out and stick a couple 4x8 sheets of plywood in.

 

Look for an old turbo 4 cyl chrysler minivan with a 5 speed... You can make them scoot and still haul the kids and their friends...

 

I think if I had a bunch of kids Id look for an old FJ55 and stick a 4bt/nv4500 in it. One of those old 4x4 yota minivans would be ugly as hell but cool and functional also. Ive got a softspot for the old 67-72 burbs too and if built right you can get 20 mpg out of a SBC... but itll cost you...

[nukeday]

You can save money and buy a old 4runner?

 

How cheap are you?

What my parents did was buy a small truck and they added a camper... They bolted down bench seats down into the bed with out belts. Enough for a family of six I guess. Luckily we didn't crash and we came out ok. Some even Fuse the camper with the indoor cabin by removing the rear glass area. That is getto cheap.

 

I've looked at the camper idea, not quite the way you describe, but a similar idea. The problem is that a standard 620 with a tall camper gets top heavy, and hard to handle in the wind. It doesn't meet the 'easy in, easy out' idea either. There is also the safety aspect to consider.

 

I'm not 'cheap' in the traditional (negative) sense of the word. I consider myself frugal. Not spending what I don't have to. If I can't fix it, I try not to buy it. That includes stuff like my lawnmower, my PC, my dishwasher and even my house. I could probably afford $200-250 a month for a car payment, I just don't want to be saddled with a 7 year loan on a depreciating 'investment'. Besides, qualifying for a loan while unemployed is nearly impossible.

 

Look for an old turbo 4 cyl chrysler minivan with a 5 speed... You can make them scoot and still haul the kids and their friends...

 

I actually owned a 4cyl/5speed Caravan for awhile, the wife's primary complaint was access to both sides of the rig to retrieve kids. I probably should have added '-4 or more doors' to my criteria list.

 

Maybe the way to do this is to just buy a short bed Chevy truck and put the 3+3 cab on that. That solves the steering and fuel tank issues. I can buy drop spindles for it and dearch or pull a leaf in back. Maybe a rear axle out of a full size Impala. It needs to fit in a normal sized parking spot, otherwise I'd just buy a crew cab crummy and be done with it.

 

For this 'project' the real trick is weight to power. It's not going to be a 'truck', so the ideal drive train involves looking at power needs, weight to power ratios, gear ratios and primary use. There are a ton of minivans out there with 4 bangers in them, and there are two wrecked late model Nissan trucks for sale locally, and an L24E.

 

I love the old Suburbans, FSJ's and Travellall's, but they are way too much rig to consider for a DD. I don't need full time AWD and a V8.

 

See? Isn't this a fun mental exercise? Bleah.

Edited December 14, 2009 by nukeday

[izzo]

what i plan on doing with mine, i have a 720 KC, it comes with rear slider. Putting a canopy on it with a slider obviously. Seats in the back, with seat belts. Heater to keep em warm, and maybe a tv with xbox or something to keep em busy.

 

king cab will seat 4 right there. Two adults and two kiddies all with seat belts, just need to bucket seats in the back with seat belts. Pretty simple

[Jason]

Nuke, see if you can find an older, first generation Honda Odyssey, built on the old Accord platform, 4 cylinder, seats 6 safely. Downside is that it can't tow much, maybe a class one hitch is all. In the newer stuff I can only find something like a Mazda5.

 

If a RHD vehicle is considered, there is the Subaru Domingo, 1.2L 4 cylinder, seats 7, again can't tow squat ...

[MikeRL411]

Don't know what they go for today, but check out the Nissan Quest minivan or the rebadged Mercury version.

[67411sss]

I reckon a long wheel base FJ landcruiser would be the perfect family hauler, 6 cylinder, 4wd(when you need it), great towing , don't know about the easy in and out but i have a hard time putting the baby in my wife's avalon(that's low) than my 4 runner. A diesel one would be nice (don't know if they came out here with the diesel option) Good resale and handy for other things too.

Here's one in the bay area http://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/cto/1502739712.html

Edited December 14, 2009 by 67411sss

[DRIVEN]

Late '80s-early '90s Volvo 740/760 turbo wagon:

-Many had 3rd row seating option (considered 7 passenger)

-Nice and low/easy access

-Can pull a small trailer (plus a roof rack for the overflow)

-25-30MPG

-Handles like a car

-Easy to work on and plentiful parts (wrecking yards are packed with 'em)

With a minimal amount of upkeep these can be expected to last 300K+! With a little time spent shopping you should be able to find one with full power and leather in the $1500 range.

 

I know it's not a custom built "Suburimpalatsun 3+3" but with 3 kids and one on the way plus being unemployed (I know about this one), it may make more sense.

[DanielC]

I would think that by the time you put a home brew hybrid together, you will easily spend your budget of $10K, and have something less reliable, and less safe than what you have now.

I would suggest you look into a rear wheel drive "midi van", Ford Aerostar, Chevy Astro, GMC Safari.

I have about 169500 miles on my Aerostar, a lot of that pulling my boat, a 1997 Ski Nautique. The boat is 19' 6" and weighs about 3000 pounds to 3500 with the trailer. The van will seat 7. Take the rear seats out, and I can fit 4' x 8' sheets of plywood in the back. I can put several 10' 2 x 6 boards in it by putting them between the front seats.

 

I know it is hard, but set aside some money each month for a newer car now.

 

This is personal, and I know children are a gift from God, but you should also consider maybe some way of limiting future child creation, until your employment situation improves.

[BJW's FiveTen's]

Volvos kick ass. Cheap strong and relilable. I tow a 8' utility trailer, have been up and down the i-5 corrodor for years now. Part are cheap, easy to work on and yes PAP has lots of them. Also they are a non interference motor, so if you don't change the t belt you are not fucked. I have 3 240 wagons, everyone in my family has a volvo. Allof them are 200K and up also. I get 18-20 around town, I drive aggressive. and 24-27 on the road. Also I was in a nasty head on in my old turbo 2yrs ago and was just fine, Broke my middle finger when I was tryng to avoid gettin hit.

[DRIVEN]

Forgot to mention that cops can't see 'em:thumbsup:.

[nukeday]

Late '80s-early '90s Volvo 740/760 turbo wagon:

-Many had 3rd row seating option (considered 7 passenger)

-Nice and low/easy access

-Can pull a small trailer (plus a roof rack for the overflow)

-25-30MPG

-Handles like a car

-Easy to work on and plentiful parts (wrecking yards are packed with 'em)

With a minimal amount of upkeep these can be expected to last 300K+! With a little time spent shopping you should be able to find one with full power and leather in the $1500 range.

 

I know it's not a custom built "Suburimpalatsun 3+3" but with 3 kids and one on the way plus being unemployed (I know about this one), it may make more sense.

 

I'm not sure how I overlooked these, as I've owned Saab's forever. The 8 passenger versions are getting harder to find, but they do meet all of my requirements.

 

I priced parts on the LandCruiser and ouch!

 

I would think that by the time you put a home brew hybrid together, you will easily spend your budget of $10K, and have something less reliable, and less safe than what you have now.

 

This is personal, and I know children are a gift from God, but you should also consider maybe some way of limiting future child creation, until your employment situation improves.

 

Couple of interesting points there, as I've been really struggling with the concept of 'false economy'. Even my free 521 has ended up costing me more in time and parts than it's worth.

 

As for the kids thing, my wife has been after me for nearly 2 years to have 'her' 4th. It's not a matter of economy, it's a matter of age. I decided when I turned 45, that I don't want to be 70 with a 15 year old...:lol:

 

Another factor here is deciding at which point my '00 Voyager becomes unworthy of further repairs. The transmission is bound to fail any day now, we drive it pretty easy, but the carrier bearings are surely worn. The bottom end has been rebuilt in the 3.0, but it still has blowby in the valve seats (a common wear area in the Mitsu engine). I've got about $3700 in it including the purchase of the van. I've gotten 40K out of it for that money. It badly needs shocks and struts. A set of Easy-Struts for the front runs about $700 if I install them myself. I do very little work on this van, as it's a cornerstone of our family transportation. I am slow, ill-equipped tool wise and impatient, so I pay to have it done by a mechanic I trust.

 

I sometimes get these hair brained ideas, thanks for all your input folks.

 

I've been told a hundred times that the cheapest car to own is the one you already have, if I keep hearing it, there must be some truth to it?

[City Hunter]

toyota le van from the 80s!

[moparvwfreak]

i got teh ULTIMATE family car. seats 8 but it doesn't get t required 20+ mpg. close but not quite, and yes it will pull a trailer if a hitch was installed. 86 caprice WAGON. and its for sale......

[Jason]

Mopar, that isn't a car, that's a low rider RV/Condo! An Abrahms Tank probably gets similiar gas milage!

[moparvwfreak]

somehting like that. its a beast but it looks oh so good. and drives even better.

[steve g]

i got teh ULTIMATE family car. seats 8 but it doesn't get t required 20+ mpg. close but not quite, and yes it will pull a trailer if a hitch was installed. 86 caprice WAGON. and its for sale......

OH my god i had one of those!!... broke down in my driveway the day i bought it... kicked the door in.... threw a cylinder head through the windshield and called the wrecker to come pick it up..... i had a temper back then.

[thisismatt]

What happened to a car that seats 6, and will pull a trailer?

 

My criteria is relatively simple:

 

-Seats 6 comfortably, with two of the six being in monstrous child seats.

-Has easy entrance, and low access for children

-Will pull a small trailer without frying the transmission

-Gets 20 mpg plus or minus

-Handles like a car, not a truck

-I can repair myself

:lol: I've got a car that suits all of the above. I forget the model, though - let me hop on my hoverboard real quick and go check.

[yello620]

Late '80s-early '90s Volvo 740/760 turbo wagon:

 

-Easy to work on and plentiful parts (wrecking yards are packed with 'em)

 

QUOTE]

 

There is a reason for this.:D:D

 

 

 

How many miles are on your 00' minivan.

 

You have a PM.

[nukeday]

PM'd you back yello620, thanks.

 

As for the hoverboard thing, my current van gets 25mpg on the freeway and 21mpg in town.

 

It's not an unreasonable target.

 

Rambler did it in 1950 with much looser tolerances, heavier materials and without overhead valves. They were still doing it in '62 with an OHV engine. And in the 70's...

 

I had a 73K one owner '85 Olds Custom Cruiser, but the wife wouldn't drive it. Had the extra back seat too. I guess she didn't dig the woodgrain. Sort of wishing now that I hadn't sold it. It got about 17 in town once I got the E4ME rebuilt.

Edited December 15, 2009 by nukeday

[MikeRL411]

Sorry to say, but with the exception of the 20 MPG, the 1970 Buick Electra which got at best 16 MPG [with ARCO Graphite motor oil, remember that?] comes closest to your dreams. With the air suspension [replacement rear air ride shocks available through Sears, coms with a replacement air hose that hooks right up to the Buick level sensor] it rides like a dream and has the room and seating you are looking for. The 455 engine is also the smoothest running V8 ever! Mine was a Limited [1970 Buick Electra LTD] ,so had every accessory except the tape deck. I used to leave Los Angeles at 6AM, drive to San Jose, eat lunch and make 1PM meetings.

[nukeday]

Well, it looks like you all have helped me figure this out. According to the criteria I set out, the perfect family car already exists. And I own it. Ours is a Chrysler, but any '96 - '06 Mopar 4 door minivan does the job.

 

The primary weakness in meeting my own criteria is actually just me. I guess I'll keep what I've got, and just learn how to work on it...