destruction of america

[IZRL]

10 minutes ago, tr8er said:

The Church at times past would not allow the Bible to be translated.  It was in Latin, and no layman was versed in Latin barring rare exception.  They did not want their congregation to be able to read it themselves.  It allowed the church to control the narrative, and empowered the priests to be the arbiter of truth.  Knowledge is empowering.  And even if the report only tells some of the story, I assure you, that is the part that you are not hearing enough about if you are primarily tuned into conservative media/friends.  Trump demonizes the FBI, the Media, the "Deep State", etc. etc. etc..  There is an old adage that says if all of your relationships don't work out, start to look at yourself as the possible common denominator.     

 

Are you actually saying that the FBI isn't a crooked, lying, pile of shit that has been caught twisting, turning, and withholding information for decades? That they are clearly doing the left's dirty work? Friend if you believe the FBI to be an honest institution that doesn't deserve to be criticized and possibly even abolished, in 2024, you and I have nothing to talk about 🫡.

 

And you were right in saying that Kamala wasn't as stupid as pile of rocks. Saying that would be an insult to the pile of rocks. Is dementia contagious?

 

 

[tr8er]

1 hour ago, IZRL said:

 

Don't believe everything you read or hear from the gov or the media. 

 

Still waiting for you to sell me on voting for the left. 

 

I advise you to take bathroom breaks cuz you may be waiting a while.  

 

There is absolutely no part of me that is interested in participating in campaigning for the left.  I'm just seeing an echo chamber here and wanted to give you gents an opportunity to hear your counter.  

 

And on a personal level, a family member of mine is a Ranger who was almost retired when the trump document scandal started to impact our agents abroad.  He was pulled from his new desk job and has been on multiple rescue missions over seas to extract/find compromised agents.  You may or may not choose to believe that he sold/traded state secrets, but I'm not confused about the fact that they got out and compromised out intelligence agencies to a degree previously unseen.  Look at his staff.  Manafort is just the start of it.  Not allowing notes in his meeting with Putin.  It's a fucking joke.  

 

So I have my issues with the Left.  But Trump will not have my support.  If you asked me a year ago, I would have thought I'd be voting republican.  I figured the right would not be dumb enough to run a dead horse again.  And I couldn't see myself voting for Biden due to his age.  I want you to vote for the candidate that you feel will best lead the United States military, and the United States government.  And if you believe that is trump, I genuinely defend your right to be wrong.  But I would prefer that you come to the decision with all of the information available to you.  

[tr8er]

1 minute ago, IZRL said:

 

Are you actually saying that the FBI isn't a crooked, lying, pile of shit?

 

 

Not really what I was saying.  I'm more interested in why your conviction is so pronounced.  They are tasked at the highest levels to investigate the kinds of crimes we are discussing.  And I find it interesting that Trump regularly demonizes and weaponizes his base to not trust and even attack those who we pay to keep him honest.  

 

If you had your way, Trump would have no checks and no regulating authorities.  Do you honestly have so much trust in a guy you've not met?  You sound young.  

[john510]

1 hour ago, tr8er said:

The Church at times past would not allow the Bible to be translated.  It was in Latin, and no layman was versed in Latin barring rare exception.  They did not want their congregation to be able to read it themselves.  It allowed the church to control the narrative, and empowered the priests to be the arbiter of truth.  Knowledge is empowering.  And even if the report only tells some of the story, I assure you, that is the part that you are not hearing enough about if you are primarily tuned into conservative media/friends.  Trump demonizes the FBI, the Media, the "Deep State", etc. etc. etc..  There is an old adage that says if all of your relationships don't work out, start to look at yourself as the possible common denominator.     

The church story is cute. It describes the J6 committee/report to a tee. It allowed the committee to control the narrative. Nine people, all on the same page (hate Trump) No Republicans that didn't hate Trump allowed on the committee because of Nancy Pelosi (hates Trump) Until somebody called them out on it and released all of the video evidence. In this case knowledge wasn't empowering. That committee and their case are gone like a fart in the wind. At least you admitted the report only tells some of the story. How could we possibly NOT hear enough about that committee when it was in the news every single day for a long time. The media loved pushing that story. They don't now for some reason. It's nearly election time and they won't touch it. As far as conservative media goes what is there anymore ? Fox is all over the place which is fine but I really don't watch much TV news. The media is pathetic and I don't trust them to be honest about much at all. I don't blame Trump for hating them. 

[john510]

1 hour ago, tr8er said:

I advise you to take bathroom breaks cuz you may be waiting a while.  

 

There is absolutely no part of me that is interested in participating in campaigning for the left.  I'm just seeing an echo chamber here and wanted to give you gents an opportunity to hear your counter.  

 

And on a personal level, a family member of mine is a Ranger who was almost retired when the trump document scandal started to impact our agents abroad.  He was pulled from his new desk job and has been on multiple rescue missions over seas to extract/find compromised agents.  You may or may not choose to believe that he sold/traded state secrets, but I'm not confused about the fact that they got out and compromised out intelligence agencies to a degree previously unseen.  Look at his staff.  Manafort is just the start of it.  Not allowing notes in his meeting with Putin.  It's a fucking joke.  

 

So I have my issues with the Left.  But Trump will not have my support.  If you asked me a year ago, I would have thought I'd be voting republican.  I figured the right would not be dumb enough to run a dead horse again.  And I couldn't see myself voting for Biden due to his age.  I want you to vote for the candidate that you feel will best lead the United States military, and the United States government.  And if you believe that is trump, I genuinely defend your right to be wrong.  But I would prefer that you come to the decision with all of the information available to you.  

I'll call bullshit on that. A family member is telling you about his rescue missions overseas to find compromised agents ? and it all has to do with Trump selling state secrets ? Nonsense. An army Ranger wouldn't be telling anybody but those involved about that mission. Sorry can't believe that. And you just blabbed it on the net ? 

[tr8er]

14 hours ago, john510 said:

The church story is cute. It describes the J6 committee/report to a tee. It allowed the committee to control the narrative. Nine people, all on the same page (hate Trump) No Republicans that didn't hate Trump allowed on the committee because of Nancy Pelosi (hates Trump) Until somebody called them out on it and released all of the video evidence. In this case knowledge wasn't empowering. That committee and their case are gone like a fart in the wind. At least you admitted the report only tells some of the story. How could we possibly NOT hear enough about that committee when it was in the news every single day for a long time. The media loved pushing that story. They don't now for some reason. It's nearly election time and they won't touch it. As far as conservative media goes what is there anymore ? Fox is all over the place which is fine but I really don't watch much TV news. The media is pathetic and I don't trust them to be honest about much at all. I don't blame Trump for hating them. 

what video negates the report?   The report details the planning and orchestration of the events on January 6th.  Those involved in bringing it together.  And the events surrounding the failure to deescalate the “peaceful organization of obviously peaceful patriots”?  Are you suggesting that guards not standing their ground in the face of the “super peaceful aggressors” is evidence of the j6 report being fabricated?   Show your videos.  I gave links.  

[gh0stwerx76]

21 hours ago, frankendat said:

It was the correct action in 1775, it was the correct action at Kent State and it would have been the correct action on Jan. 6th and the BLM riots. Your appreciation, support or condemnation of an action may change with  the passage of time or the current social standards, but not correctness of an action based on fundamentals spawned in western civilization and, arguably, correct for the world. (those of us in the west, do not believe there is an argument) 

More so, than the government of the United States and acknowledging I stand in opposition of some higher minds, notably, Sam Harris, I believe in the ultimate freedom of the individual, but I am not a libertarian. I understand and support limited government, with freedom comes responsibility. More so, than either the left or the right, I give no quarter for ignorance. If someone is so easily catfished into physical acts of revolution, be it Jan. 6th or the BLM riots, then they have the freedom to engage and suffer the consequences. The consequence for revolution, physical treason, is death. 

I have some sympathy for the sentiment of the Jan 6th crowd, politics is out of touch with the common man. I understand the feeling of insignificance and inability to shape ones destiny, a destiny often regulated and controlled to the determent of the individual, but I, like most Americans, lack sympathy for failure. They, much like the recent potential assassin, took a shot at the king and missed, if the same reward would have followed then I would not lose sleep.  

 

You've cracked your nut Mussolini. From this point forward if you say anything more about the infringement of your rights, dont forget you also said youd be "OK" with a government forgoing citizens rights to due process and skip straight to mass executions.  Also you should actually understand what an insurgency is before you are so quick to throw around the word the liberal media threw out to stir up shit and sensationalize the situation for political division purposes.  Guatemala, 1960–1996 Was an insurgency 200k dead, Greece 45-49, Indochina 46-54.  

Edited August 10 by gh0stwerx76

[tr8er]

9 minutes ago, gh0stwerx76 said:

You've cracked your nut Mussolini. From this point forward if you say anything more about the infringement of your rights, dont forget you also said youd be "OK" with a government forgoing citizens rights to due process and skip straight to mass executions.  

Now turn the lazy suzan.   Liberals are the J6 crowd with signs about hanging elected officials to stop the certification of Trumps victory.  There are dozens injured.  Guard is dead.  Do you think Trump would have sat back and let that happen?  Would that have been the right thing to do?  

[gh0stwerx76]

23 minutes ago, tr8er said:

Now turn the lazy suzan.   Liberals are the J6 crowd with signs about hanging elected officials to stop the certification of Trumps victory.  There are dozens injured.  Guard is dead.  Do you think Trump would have sat back and let that happen?  Would that have been the right thing to do?  

 Sure wish I knew what the fuck you are talking about. Whatever it is it has nothing to do with what I said to Frankentyrant. Belay that I actually dont care. I think you and him are both just pathetically gullible and equally susceptible to opposing propaganda. 

Edited August 10 by gh0stwerx76

[datzenmike]

Didn't the guard die of a heart attack? not directly from violence?

[frankendat]

2 hours ago, gh0stwerx76 said:

You've cracked your nut Mussolini. From this point forward if you say anything more about the infringement of your rights, dont forget you also said youd be "OK" with a government forgoing citizens rights to due process and skip straight to mass executions.  Also you should actually understand what an insurgency is before you are so quick to throw around the word the liberal media threw out to stir up shit and sensationalize the situation for political division purposes.  Guatemala, 1960–1996 Was an insurgency 200k dead, Greece 45-49, Indochina 46-54.  

I understand insurgency, didn't I say treason? It isn't important. The implication was rioters and/or looters should have been shot and it appears that was conveyed. Perhaps you sympathize with feeble minded felons and refuse to spank your spawn. As free American citizen I support your right, to do both, either, or neither. But, as it has been said, "(y)our right to swing your arms ends just where the other man’s nose begins.” During the Jan 6th event, or any protest that devolves into harm, and in effort to stop themselves or others from becoming victim to assault, battery, or to cease the riot destruction and looting of property, in my opinion the application of deadly force would have been or at least should have been lawful and employed.

 

Now, those arrested for participating in either of the aforementioned actions would be entitled to all the legal protections afforded American citizens. Only if a jury of their peers found them guilty of treason, would I endorse the death penalty and only then if egregious evidence was unearthed.

 

I take the rights and responsibilities of the Constitution seriously, as I do those who rise up, claiming those rights under the banner of lawful protest, but do harm. I do not view either of the aforesaid groups as errant children or misguided fools and give no quarter.

[john510]

3 hours ago, tr8er said:

Now turn the lazy suzan.   Liberals are the J6 crowd with signs about hanging elected officials to stop the certification of Trumps victory.  There are dozens injured.  Guard is dead.  Do you think Trump would have sat back and let that happen?  Would that have been the right thing to do?  

No guard died at that riot. You might want to brush up on the facts on this. He died from two strokes the next day. He was uninjured. You read about his death in J6 committee report didn't you ? One of the rioters died because she was shot. Her fault for being there. Was it unnecessary to shoot her ? Probably. I still pin that on her. Never push your luck with an armed cop at a riot.

[frankendat]

19 hours ago, tr8er said:

  I want you to vote for the candidate that you feel will best lead the United States military, and the United States government.  And if you believe that is trump, I genuinely defend your right to be wrong.  But I would prefer that you come to the decision with all of the information available to you.  

That ship sailed a long time ago. I vote for the candidate who I believe will not further the gun control agenda. There are many other things that are important, some arguably as important, but over the years I have been forced to make compromise after compromise. Years back, I wrote out, what was important (that a politician could influence) and ranked them. It turned out similar to a Maslowvian pyramid, or a survival pyramid, the first level is "Safety". Self protection is highest order then protection of family, which might seem out of order, but the logic is-if you can't protect yourself, then you can't protect your family.

 

 

[tr8er]

1 hour ago, frankendat said:

That ship sailed a long time ago. I vote for the candidate who I believe will not further the gun control agenda. There are many other things that are important, some arguably as important, but over the years I have been forced to make compromise after compromise. Years back, I wrote out, what was important (that a politician could influence) and ranked them. It turned out similar to a Maslowvian pyramid, or a survival pyramid, the first level is "Safety". Self protection is highest order then protection of family, which might seem out of order, but the logic is-if you can't protect yourself, then you can't protect your family.

 

 

What sacrifice?  Genuine question., state level has seen some stupid laws, but on a federal level there has basically been the assault weapons ban which is gone for over ten years now.  No one is passing meaningful gun regulation anytime soon if ever under this flag.  But they weaponize the fear of it for sure.  There are some headline senators who will introduce legislation to say they tried, but even those attempts are not genuine.  The language isn’t even worked out cuz they know it’s not real.  

[IZRL]

23 hours ago, tr8er said:

I advise you to take bathroom breaks cuz you may be waiting a while.  

 

There is absolutely no part of me that is interested in participating in campaigning for the left.  I'm just seeing an echo chamber here and wanted to give you gents an opportunity to hear your counter.  

 

That's a weasely way of saying you know voting for the left is not the best option, but you're gonna vote for them anyways because of your TDS. 

 

23 hours ago, tr8er said:

So I have my issues with the Left.  But Trump will not have my support.  If you asked me a year ago, I would have thought I'd be voting republican.  I figured the right would not be dumb enough to run a dead horse again.  And I couldn't see myself voting for Biden due to his age.  I want you to vote for the candidate that you feel will best lead the United States military, and the United States government.  And if you believe that is trump, I genuinely defend your right to be wrong.  But I would prefer that you come to the decision with all of the information available to you.  

 

You couldn't see yourself voting for Biden because of his age ey? Is that the only reason? So the fact that this admin poured gas on the country and tossed a match on it, plays no part in your decision?

 

This comment makes no sense and makes it seem like you are living in bizarro world. Everything you said is completely twisted and backwards. Many of your comments seem to be this way. It's like you're taking the reality of the bad things the left is doing, and flipping it by saying that it's actually the right who's doing and saying these things. 

 

It's like the video I posted with the KGB agent. We're at that point where some people actually believe that black is blue and up is down if it helps justify their ideology/beliefs.

 

Not gonna waste anymore of my time breaking down why every point in your comment is backwards. Cause as I said black = blue with some folks. But I'll leave you with one. 

 

"I want you to vote for the candidate that you feel will best lead the United States military, and the United States government. And if you believe that is trump, I genuinely defend your right to be wrong." 

 

⬆️ Saying this is literally saying, "The left has gotten us to the brink of a nuclear war, we might already be in WWIII because of them and they've destroyed the economy. But if you want to vote for the lunatic Trump who didn't start any new wars and didn't worsen the economy, I'll defend the right for you to be wrong,"🤦‍♂️ 😆. 1 + 2 = apple ✅

️

Edited August 11 by IZRL

[frankendat]

1 hour ago, tr8er said:

What sacrifice?  Genuine question., state level has seen some stupid laws, but on a federal level there has basically been the assault weapons ban which is gone for over ten years now.  No one is passing meaningful gun regulation anytime soon if ever under this flag.  But they weaponize the fear of it for sure.  There are some headline senators who will introduce legislation to say they tried, but even those attempts are not genuine.  The language isn’t even worked out cuz they know it’s not real.  

No hyperbole, there is an almost constant attack on the 2nd without regard to who is in office. Go to congress website search pending legislation for "gun" and read until your eyes cross. Yes, many are "headline" and I ignored, until the right overturned Roe v Wade. I knew many who sincerely believed that was not something to worry about. The left wants payback and passing gun control laws will suffice. Before you start with "a little gun control wouldn't be bad" remember, the left compromised it self out of Roe v Wade and now only rich people are guaranteed the option to abort. Many of the "gun control" laws focus on ammunition, safety, training, certifications (State approved) so the left (and sometimes right turncoats) can bat their eyes "What?" "We're not for gun control, we just want people to be safe." All the aforementioned take money, which raises the cost of gun ownership (for those of us wanting to avoid the anxiety of living outside the law). The goal for the left and at least some on the right, only rich people guaranteed the option of owning a gun. There is already precedent, a long form and a couple hundred dollars is required to own certain guns, with enough forms and enough money you can own a tank. It would not be hard to move the line. 

I have  already typed at length concerning the "recent" move to include some misdemeanors into crimes that accusation commands gun forfeiture and conviction entails loss of all 2nd Amendment rights. That happened, it is a battle lost and I have never even heard of a politician with the kind of sway to remove that depredation of Constitutional rights .   The war is never over, but enemy advancement paused while Trump was in office and it will paused if he is elected again, and that's good enough for me. 

[IZRL]

https://youtube.com/shorts/-CiYxuY5JgE?si=QZEktAUQZnYr5GH5

 

Edited August 11 by IZRL

[a.d._510_n_ok]

[datzenmike]

 

[frankendat]

Monday came and went without notification or destruction. All election "excitement" is over and we can return to our bunkers. In reality, there hasn't been and excitement, only reasons to bitch. Back to work.

[datzenmike]

I was slightly under the weather and too tired to argue much. Kayaked 12 miles, on the weekend and over did it.

 

Trump still continuously lying and going on about how intelligent and great he is, how his opponents are low IQ, playing the victim card, how he's going to get even. Not a word about how he's going to fix and repair and make America great again at all just bitching an whinging and not letting go. 

[frankendat]

27 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

I was slightly under the weather and too tired to argue much. Kayaked 12 miles, on the weekend and over did it.

 

Trump still continuously lying and going on about how intelligent and great he is, how his opponents are low IQ, playing the victim card, how he's going to get even. Not a word about how he's going to fix and repair and make America great again at all just bitching an whinging and not letting go. 

Lucky for Trump all he has to do is stop the stupid the Democrats have done/are trying and he can claim victory for saving America. He requires no intelligence. Only we goes off book, trying to think up his own stuff that it gets weird and problems arise. I used to talk how I would vote for a trained chimp over a Democrat, well I've done it twice, with the hope he was more than a trained chip, this time I will do it, with the hope he is only a trained chimp. 

[Ooph!]

1 hour ago, datzenmike said:

I was slightly under the weather and too tired to argue much. Kayaked 12 miles, on the weekend and over did it.

 

Trump still continuously lying and going on about how intelligent and great he is, how his opponents are low IQ, playing the victim card, how he's going to get even. Not a word about how he's going to fix and repair and make America great again at all just bitching an whinging and not letting go. 

 

1 hour ago, frankendat said:

Lucky for Trump all he has to do is stop the stupid the Democrats have done/are trying and he can claim victory for saving America. He requires no intelligence. Only we goes off book, trying to think up his own stuff that it gets weird and problems arise. I used to talk how I would vote for a trained chimp over a Democrat, well I've done it twice, with the hope he was more than a trained chip, this time I will do it, with the hope he is only a trained chimp. 

 

Ya he's so dumb that the only serious opponent hiding in her bunker co-opts his idea's ie: "no tax on tips, I'll be tough on the border"

[paradime]

On 8/10/2024 at 6:09 PM, frankendat said:

No hyperbole, there is an almost constant attack on the 2nd without regard to who is in office. Go to congress website search pending legislation for "gun" and read until your eyes cross. Yes, many are "headline" and I ignored, until the right overturned Roe v Wade. I knew many who sincerely believed that was not something to worry about. The left wants payback and passing gun control laws will suffice. Before you start with "a little gun control wouldn't be bad" remember, the left compromised it self out of Roe v Wade and now only rich people are guaranteed the option to abort. Many of the "gun control" laws focus on ammunition, safety, training, certifications (State approved) so the left (and sometimes right turncoats) can bat their eyes "What?" "We're not for gun control, we just want people to be safe." All the aforementioned take money, which raises the cost of gun ownership (for those of us wanting to avoid the anxiety of living outside the law). The goal for the left and at least some on the right, only rich people guaranteed the option of owning a gun. There is already precedent, a long form and a couple hundred dollars is required to own certain guns, with enough forms and enough money you can own a tank. It would not be hard to move the line. 

I have  already typed at length concerning the "recent" move to include some misdemeanors into crimes that accusation commands gun forfeiture and conviction entails loss of all 2nd Amendment rights. That happened, it is a battle lost and I have never even heard of a politician with the kind of sway to remove that depredation of Constitutional rights .   The war is never over, but enemy advancement paused while Trump was in office and it will paused if he is elected again, and that's good enough for me. 

 

No hyperbole? You regurgitate the myopic perspective of gun lobbyists as though it's gospel truth.  Saying there is a constant attack on the 2nd, the goal is that only rich people will own guns, and all it takes now is a simple accusation to enforce gun forfeiture is pure hyperbole.  What it actually takes for federally mandated gun seizure:

*A felony conviction

*Illegal drug use or addiction

*Has been found by a court to have a mental disability

*Not being a U.S. citizen and not in the U.S. legally; not having permanent resident status in the U.S.

*A fugitive from justice

*Dishonorably discharged from the military

*Has renounced their U.S. citizenship

*Is subject to a domestic violence protection order (DVPO)

*Has been convicted of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence (MCDV)

 

In 1996, it was the Rep held congress and senate that passed the federal domestic violence protection order (18 U.S.C. 922(g)(9) So if they take someone's guns who  batters their domestic partner, how is that a battle lost?

 

https://www.justice.gov/file/411656/dl 

 

 

 

It takes some special blinders not to see the outcome of "unimpeded" gun ownership. You're in the minority to accept the 115,552 people shot and 43,163 killed last year as normal. The rest of us see this freedom requires far more responsibility than it's being given. A recent Fox News poll makes clear that the American people support gun control Amed at violence prevention:

 

87% – Support Background Checks for Guns 

81 % – Enforce Existing Gun Laws

81 % – Legal Age 21 to Buy All Guns

80 % – Require Mental Health Checks on all gun buyers

80 % – Flag People Danger to Self or others

77 % – Require 30-day Waiting Period

61 % – Ban Assault Weapons

 

On the other hand, the gun lobby denies the catastrophic end result of their marketing agenda. According to them, more guns will made us safer. If true the US would be one of the safest countries on earth. In reality, we have a gun homicide rate 26x that of other 1st world countries. In fact, there is overwhelming evidence showing that guns make individual owners and US households at higher risk. No cherry picked anecdotal account of a gun being used for protection will change this reality. 

 

All that said, I learned gun safety at an NRA youth program, and I see no reason why passing a test shouldn't be mandatory for owning a gun.  I've been shooting since I was 12, I taught both my kids to shoot safely. Even though I'm legally blind now I'm still a responsible gun owner who keeps them locked in a safe. For protection I have an aluminum bat next to my bed.  

 

[Ooph!]

What Tim Walz supports