2 inch exhaust on my 210

[sunny310]

So I want to get a custom 2 inch exhaust made for my 79 210. I just got a 2 inch SS magnaflow muffler for it. Does anyone have an idea how much it would cost to get an exhaust made for a 210? One guy quoted me $600 which I find really spendy. I cost less than half that to get true duals in my C10 truck

[datzenmike]

It's going to cost at least half that for any exhaust that's put on. Doesn't have to be 2" you can use an expander to match the muffler. One and three quarters would be more than enough for an A14 or 15 engine. $600 is a lot for something that isn't going to make any difference to performance anyway. You sure about the 'magnaflow'? A 2" generic quiet muffler would also be lower restriction. If you're going with the 'magnaflow' you might want to plan on running a straight through 'glass pack' ahead of it for a resonator. I think you'll get tired of the 'magnaflow' noise. 

[banzai510(hainz)]

aluminized pipe and 1.75 inch is more than enough for a Toy motor.

 

take the muffler back for cash back.

 

$ 300max as your not going to see power increase with this, Getting a weber car will be more power if you don't have one already

[datzenmike]

I should have invested in 'Magnaflow'. They charge good money for basically a loud hollow pipe. Genius!!!

[sunny310]

That's what I was thinking...it cant cost more than $300 for that exhaust. I was trying to choose between Flowmaster and Magnaflow. I have Flowmaster 40s on my C10 and they sound pretty good but I've heard how good the Magnaflows sound too. I got a Magnaflow muffler w/ twin tips (part#14815) on my BMW E39 530 and its got that nice throaty sound...I really dig it. That's why I decided to try the Magnaflow(part#12224). They don't have any Flowmasters or Magnaflows under 2 inches. I did have a Cherrybomb turbo muffler for it but the shop I took it too couldn't get it to fit in the stock location. I'll try it and see how it sounds...if I don't like it I can always try something else. My car has an A14 with a 32/36 Weber btw...and is a 4 speed manual. Currently it has the stock exhaust with the cat removed

[datzenmike]

Well your BMW had a much larger displacement engine and probably 2 or 4 more cylinders. Your A14 will sound buzzy I think.

 

Shops used to have a 'recipe program' and bent their own exhaust systems. Some shops use pre made pipes and fit and join them.  Others will make a system more or less by eye, but here you need a skilled bender to make it fit and look nice. It's practically an art.

[pdp8]

I had a 1.75" system hand-built for under $300, 2" is just silly big for an A-series motor, at least a naturally-aspirated one. 

[sunny310]

So I just looked online n there are 1.75 inch magnaflows smh. But I will still use the muffler I have and take you guys advice n go with 1.75 piping. I cant wait to get this done!

[datzenmike]

https://www.4wd.com/p/magnaflow-exhaust-stainless-steel-exhaust-pipe-expander/24209

 

It's what I used. I have 1.75" exhaust and put a 2" or 2 /18" inlet muffler on by using one of these and a couple of muffler clamps. And by muffler I mean garden variety muffler. It's about an inch larger than the stock one it replaced so flows better. No tail pipe just a 45⁰ downward bend. You can hear it but it doesn't destroy the sound system or the pleasure of driving. 

 

Generally the exhaust pipe size is matched to the engine displacement by the factory. It's, again, probably slightly smaller than needed to save cost and it's quieterand for the average driver, it's good enough. A smaller pipe is more restrictive and the engine has to work to push the exhaust out but this is only at very high RPMs and to be frank no one drives or revs long enough for it to make much difference. At all lower speeds the exhaust wants OUT! and it goes. Engines also rely of the speed of the exhaust to scavenge the cylinder it left by keeping the pipe small enough. During valve overlap when intake and exhaust are both open the fast moving exhaust helps produce a small vacuum behind it which helps empty the cylinder and draw intake air in. Without this the engine would waste some power having to do it itself. If you go too large on an exhaust pipe the exhaust slows down and you loose this small gain. That said, if the engine is sufficiently modified it will need more flow and the gains outweigh the losses. 

 

Always increase a pipe size moderately. This is because doubling a pipe diameter does not increase the flow by twice. It actually increases it by 4 times!! To double the flow of a 1 3/4" pipe you only need a pipe just under 2.5". I would keep to 20-25% increase. If 1.75" now going to 1 7/8" is just under 20%. A 2" pipe is an increase of 56% or enough for a 2 liter engine.

 

 

 

 

[az_rat210]

On 2/28/2020 at 7:36 AM, banzai510(hainz) said:

aluminized pipe and 1.75 inch is more than enough for a Toy motor.

 

take the muffler back for cash back.

 

$ 300max as your not going to see power increase with this, Getting a weber car will be more power if you don't have one already

He may not have more actual power, but increasing the exhaust size does allow the engine to breath better.  Going to a 1.75 exhaust on mine improved throttle response and acceleration dramatically as I was no longer holding up traffic accelerating onto the interstate.

 

p.s. A resonator before the muffler helps deepen the exhaust tone nicely.  I paid $160 when I had mine done back in 08 which included piping, muffler and resonator (hope this helps with some idea of pricing as $600 is just licensed theft).

Edited April 7, 2020 by az_rat210

[sunny310]

Took my car to a shop today to get an estimate. Waiting for him to call back with a price. The guy seemed kinda fascinated by my car as he never seen a 210 before lol. I’m kinda thinking it would be about $180-$200. I also got one of those Pacesetter monza resonated tips from a friend of mine. Maybe it’ll help it quiet down a bit

 

[afracer]

2" is just fine, if it's crush bent tubing, which 99% of muffler shops do, it'll neck down around the bends to probably 1.75 or smaller, essentially turning your 2" system into whatever the smallest restriction is around a bend. The factory had mandrel bent tubing so it would've been 1.5" all the way. My 2.5" mandrel exhaust with Borla muffler and resonator isn't loud at all behind the A15.

[BrandonS]

$300, give or take $50 a reasonable median for the price for standard tubing with their crush bent machines.  2" will do you just fine.  I went from a 1.75" to a 2.25" mandrel bent exhuast with a magnaflow on my 510 with an L18 and dual SU carbs.  I didn't notice any gains except that it got louder and the exhaust pipe would glisten in the sun.

[datzenmike]

This is because the original exhaust is just not really that restrictive. No one realizes that to get an improvement it has to be at some level of bad. Restriction to flow increases with the volume of flow so it's only at it worst when the engine is screaming. The rest of the time it's way more than good enough.  The cross sectional area of a circle (muffler pipe) increases four times when the pipe diameter is doubled. A 1.75" pipe has a cross section of 2.4 sq. in. When you switch to a 2 inch pipe that's only 1/4 inch larger, the cross section becomes 3.14 sq. in. That's an increase of 30%!!!!! capacity... 1/3!!!!. Just how much exhaust capacity do you really need???? For an L16 that's enough pipe for almost a 2.1 liter engine flow. Small increases equal BIG gains. You can also loose a lot of low and mid range torque from slowing the exhaust speed. Where does most of your driving happen above 5K or below 3K. Be conservative in pipe size increase it really doesn't do that much. 

[afracer]

...unless you have future plans for the car for more power or a bigger engine. When you're already going to spend a good chunk of change on a new exhaust, spending a tiny bit more but not having to replace it again any time soon would be wise. I built my entire stainless t304 2.5" exhaust by myself for about $300, and like I said it is not loud and I didn't lose any power, torque, or driveability. If I did lose any low end, its completely unnoticeable.

[datzenmike]

Then yes but 30% is more than enough for an A series. Two and a half inch pipe is 204% more flow that the 1.75" (assuming the 210 IS 1.75" pipe, I don't know it may be less) That's enough for two A15s and a waste unless swapping in a VG.   

[sunny310]

Well the 2 inch exhaust would come in handy cuz eventually I want more power. Still deciding whether to stay old school with a mild A15 or L20B or go new school with a KA, CA or SR

[pdp8]

On 4/9/2020 at 2:31 PM, sunny310 said:

Well the 2 inch exhaust would come in handy cuz eventually I want more power. Still deciding whether to stay old school with a mild A15 or L20B or go new school with a KA, CA or SR

Pretty good chance you'll be replacing a decent chunk of the exhaust if you are doing a motor swap anyway. 

I lost my mind and had a 2" system put on a medium-hot A14 and it's WAY too much and sounds like crap.  I wish I'd gone 1-3/4".

[sunny310]

I had the exhaust done last October and it sounds pretty good with the magnaflow muffler. Still quiet at idle. A lil bit drony on the highway. Still happy with it

[afracer]

If you spend money on a good muffler and resonator, you'll be far happier no matter the size. I'm using a Borla turbo muffler and a magnaflow resonator on my 2.5" exhaust. Like I said, not loud or droney. I put a dynomax race muffler on my dad's 1200 against my advice with 2.25" exhaust and it'd make your ears bleed. It now has a Borla muffler instead. 

[Stinky]

On a Ford Crown Vic....it has dual 2" pipes on it, for a 4.6.  There are some that think that 2" is fine, up to a 5.7.

 

DatzenMike is spot on w.his info.  Some boo.boo heads say that you need "Backpressure" for a motor to run right....dumb.  What is ur target rpm?  What is ur cam like?  For most motors, smaller exhaust (back pressure) helps below, and up to freeway rpm, as it keeps exhaust velocity (like DM said)....

 

All that said, 2" is way to big, for ur application.  1.5 would be better....unless you want it to bog like crazy to about 3K rpm.

 

Get 1.75

 

 

[afracer]

I suppose you've driven an A series powered car with 1.5, 1.75, 2, 2.25, and 2.5" exhausts and personally experienced a "bog like crazy" below 3000 rpm at anything larger than 1.5" piping? Its wierd, because I have actually driven with 1.5", 2", 2.25", and 2.5" exhausts on A series powered cars and absolutely none of them had any bog whatsoever no matter the exhaust size. The fastest and low rpm torquiest A series I ever drove had a 2.25" exhaust. I've never experienced low end power or torque loss going up in pipe size on a Datsun. 

[datzenmike]

Back pressure or resistance to flow, be it pipe diameter, bends or muffler will make the sound quieter. Lessen the back pressure and it gets louder.

 

You can tune the pipes/muffler so that resonance will cancel out the pressure waves but this only works best at a single frequency.

 

You can use materials that absorb sound but bulky and heavy.

 

 

If an engine is 'set up' to run on a 1.5" exhaust pipe at some point the out rushing gasses by their speed alone help pull exhaust out of the cylinder but as speed increases the resistance to flow leaves more and more exhaust in. If you suddenly go to a larger pipe this can disrupt this balance at low and mid range if you don't make allowances for this in your tuning. Generally heads with smaller port diameter make more low speed torque, but are terrible at high RPMs. A larger exhaust pipe will make more power top end up to a point where the increases aren't worth the bother unless you also start adding cam, valve size etc and increase the flow.

[OnlyifyouAhegao]

I have a 2.5" all the way back and blasted up the rear 😂😂, It cost me 100$, tucked up and hung perfect. The one that came with my 210 was probably gorilla glued, cuz my muffler came separated from the exhaust and just dangled and bounced of the road  till I stopped and ripped it off 😂😂