Nissan IDx (new 510?)

[paradime]

Well, I'm going to take the dog for a walk and the garage isn't warmed up yet, just barely fired up the wood stove.  I may try and do some photoshopping after lunch.  I have some ideas that would make it better, perhaps if I submit them visually, Nissan will get a clue.

 

Hopefully includes cleaning up that C pillar and giving it a subtle sonic line.  B)

[captaingamez]

Gamez, you're threadjacking, this is about how to fix the IDx.  Paradime, you're encouraging further trolling by gamez.  Stop it you two, keep this thread on track!

Point taken.

 

If they make it less than 3000 lbs I will be more excited about it. Switchable body panels would be cool But those headlights have to go.

[captaingamez]

Hopefully includes cleaning up that C pillar and giving it a subtle sonic line.  B)

Or they could get rid of it entirely like a Hakosuka....... That would be totally sweet.

 

Edit: whoops thats B pillar, duh, it is pillarless, lets hope it stays that way.

[datzenmike]

I can't believe 9 pages or that this is called a 510. Nissan is probably lurking and rubbing their collective hands. Honda and Toyota to a lesser degree.

[HRH]

Here's some food for thought.  I've been looking at new cars just for giggles, to see what I could afford.  By far, the most realistic option I have, which isn't really that cheap, is the Miata.  The new ones are starting to look even better than the originals I think.  More importantly, where are you going to find a modern car that weighs in around 2300 pounds?  It's damn near as light as the 510, yet has modern crash-worthiness and it's definitely a stronger chassis.  Go figure what 40 years will get you.  Base Miata runs 23k, club model which is where the limited slip starts is 26k.  Rather expensive for such a small vehicle, but if you want fun, handling, and reliability, the Miata is EXACTLY that.  I'd say it's one of the most reliable vehicles on the road today and as they tout on the website, the most raced car out there.  How could you NOT like that?

 

The important thing to remember is Mazda did everything they could to NOT increase the weight since the birth of the car in '90, where just about every other manufacturer hasn't made that a priority.  The Mustang is rather porky at 3600 pounds, but the V6 is 305 hp, which will move that weight quite nicely.  I suspect the BRZ/FRS is about similar weight, maybe a few hundred pounds less.  I don't care to go digging and find out at the moment.

[Son_of_a_Datsun_Guy]

BRZs weigh in at around 2800lbs. Light, but they're still heinously underpowered. 200hp and somewhere around 170 ftlbs of torque. In California it's a problem since we are literally unable to change anything about the power of the car without making it unsmogable. 

[HRH]

Okay, but given that power to weight ratio, it's the same as a 157 hp 510, give or take a few.  157 hp in a 510 is plenty fast!  I've heard it in all the magazines, everyone's saying it's too slow.  I still can't figure out how if it weighs only 2800 pounds.  One site I've found says 6.4 0-60 and a 14.9 quarter.  Okay, so it's not blisteringly fast, but it's still pretty good.  

[Fat510]

The section behind rear the tires should be longer

[Son_of_a_Datsun_Guy]

Okay, but given that power to weight ratio, it's the same as a 157 hp 510, give or take a few.  157 hp in a 510 is plenty fast!  I've heard it in all the magazines, everyone's saying it's too slow.  I still can't figure out how if it weighs only 2800 pounds.  One site I've found says 6.4 0-60 and a 14.9 quarter.  Okay, so it's not blisteringly fast, but it's still pretty good.  

 

My thoughts exactly. I've seen 510s with L20s and suspension run circles around them at autocrosses. 

 

My dad beat a couple in my wagon with the L16 last time we went. Should be doing circles around them with a torquey LZ and good suspension. 

[paradime]

Don't forget, these HP figures we're talking about here are bench measurements and not actual WHP. Depending on the rest of the drive train (trans, dif, axles etc.) there's a 15-30% loss. Real performance (0-60, 1/4 ml) is a combination of HP, torque, and power curve, or here that power is delivered at what RPM. Truth is claimed BHP is an arbitrary figure in gauging how well it will move weight around.

[HRH]

Okay, here's my shitty photoshop attempt.  I need to go work on my real 510 and I don't have more time to dick around on it.  Apparently I'm pretty rusty too.  The main thing is getting rid of that large frontal area, the hood line isn't that great, and the c pillar is gone, but I didn't add it back in.  Anyway, something to consider, someone else feel free to doctor it up.

 

 

After careful consideration, my original comments of cutting 4" out of the middle and mating the halves back together isn't accurate.  The overall body shape is okay, it's just someone thought the doors should extend to the driver's head, instead of giving us a nice large window to look out of.  Lower the door sill and front windshield area, hey, it's more aerodynamic and you get to get rid of the gigantically tall hood area.

 

As for visibility, it's a must.  Sit in a hardbody pickup or a 510 and look out.  You can see EVERYTHING!!!  Newer cars, like the Sonic and Yaris, you can loose an entire car in the opposite lane in the A pillar.  It's a wonder more of them aren't wrecked.  I'm positive you can make an A, B, or C pillar strong enough yet use Volvo's thoughts back in the day: "No pillar should be larger than the width between your eyes."

[REDnGOLD]

Why are you so angry we don't like it ??

Probably because almost everyone is saying that its ugly. & on another statement "it looks more like a 610".  Thus, indirectly stating d 610s are ugly. 

[datzenmike]

Don't forget, these HP figures we're talking about here are bench measurements and not actual WHP. Depending on the rest of the drive train (trans, dif, axles etc.) there's a 15-30% loss. Real performance (0-60, 1/4 ml) is a combination of HP, torque, and power curve, or here that power is delivered at what RPM. Truth is claimed BHP is an arbitrary figure in gauging how well it will move weight around.

 

RWHP

L16...... 60- 67

L18...... 70-78

L20B.... 93

 

http://www.datsuns.com/Tech/datsundyno.htm

.

[HRH]

As for the BRZ/FRS, there's one who races in Tri-Cities and at our local autocross and he does quite well with it.  I haven't seen a 510 that would keep up with his times.  I'd say a lot of it is driver, or the hp claims are grossly exaggerated.  I just looked at this thread: http://www.subarubrzforum.com/36-subaru-brz-dyno-numbers-track-times/2894-dyno-numbers-thread-2.html

 

With the exception of a few, most are only hitting 140-160 at the wheels, which seems rather weak sauce.  160 is probably pretty accurate assuming a 20% drivetrain loss, below that isn't so hot.

[datzenmike]

I think a 30% drive train loss is just to inflate a poor dyno reading. The  L20B in my 76 is rated at 110 hp which back then is engine brake hp not rear wheel with all the losses removed. Later L20Bs are rated 93 hp I believe. Which is about 18% frictional and drive losses. This seems reasonable.

[REDnGOLD]

 

 

I would vote for the new concept over this one. This just looks like a sentra to me.

 

while everyone can agree this is a better 510 concept car, it isnt a ground breaking design (IMO). As someone already stated it here, this very well could be a 510 concept 10 years plus ago. 

[HRH]

Well I almost got my 510 engine bay stripped.  Did remove the battery tray with minimal effort.  Have one cut I have to weld up.  Need to get a few more wires off the firewall but she's coming along nicely.  As soon as I have the engine bay painted, then we'll go nuts on getting the motor in.

 

The above drawing is freakin' sweet.  It did give me an idea for the IDx, why not go with the '98 240sx style front headlights?  That would look much nicer than what's currently on there.  I figured out why I dislike it so much.  It looks like one of those shark-nose bosozuka cars with the 4 foot front lip.  Cool for a particular style, dead ugly for the prototype.

[desmo]

The French can screw up anything, wether its the Panama canal, world war ll or Nissan

[bananahamuck]

Dude you have unknowingly designed the new  retro Chevy 66 chevelle prototype

:D

 

 

 

Okay, here's my shitty photoshop attempt.  I need to go work on my real 510 and I don't have more time to dick around on it.  Apparently I'm pretty rusty too.

 

 

[HRH]

Huh, didn't know there was one!  Even my shitty photoshop looks better than the original though!  :)  They need to take some design cues from the new Corvette.  That thing is pure sex.  I would own one in a heartbeat, even with all the modern bullshit attached with it.  (GM eye in the sky invades all of it, very heavily computerized.)

[jrock4224]

 

 

I would vote for the new concept over this one. This just looks like a sentra to me.

 

 

 

this is the only version I can even get behind....... a revamped sentra se r rwd is better then that flaming ball of shit they have dubbed the I don't xare    IDx

[REDnGOLD]

Hate all you want.......
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7348/11046150443_7a06af0bc9_b.jpg

11046150443_7a06af0bc9_b.jpg

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

arghh!! why isnt d extension working?

[captaingamez]

I think a 30% drive train loss is just to inflate a poor dyno reading. The  L20B in my 76 is rated at 110 hp which back then is engine brake hp not rear wheel with all the losses removed. Later L20Bs are rated 93 hp I believe. Which is about 18% frictional and drive losses. This seems reasonable.

%18 is more reasonable for a rear wheel drive front engine car. %30 or more is on a 4wd car with a longitudinal front mounted engine.

 

The French can screw up anything, wether its the Panama canal, world war ll or Nissan

Amen to that!

 

Huh, didn't know there was one!  Even my shitty photoshop looks better than the original though!   :)  They need to take some design cues from the new Corvette.  That thing is pure sex.  I would own one in a heartbeat, even with all the modern bullshit attached with it.  (GM eye in the sky invades all of it, very heavily computerized.)

But somehow it still only has one cam......

 

At least they tried, that one time, with that one corvette, a long time ago, which had 4 cams.

[REDnGOLD]

lets try this again

 

 

dammit!!!  still didnt work

 

[TheShagginWagon]

Hey guys.  Was following news about the IDX concepts, was curious what you OG guys thought about it and started following your discussion.  Over at Zilvia, most of us are digging the new concepts.

 

I like the news that the cars are to feature interchangeable body panels and headlights to create different looks.  I think that will help make the cleaner look that some are hoping for.  But I love the fact the Nissan seems to be considering us guys who like customizing our cars with front-end swaps and widebody areo.

 

But just wanted to share a few photochops some Zilvia members cooked up showing the IDX's potential to see if you guys still hated it...

 

 

 

Not going to lie, This one looks so sick

 

Nothing like flares and some 17" Works