"HEAD" question???

[banzai510(hainz)]

Dirttrack

This is just my opinion here so dont to much offense.

Spending that much on Rods ia a waist of money and cound be spent elsewhere.

I would PM Byron510 or Bertvorgen on the Realm and see what they use.

Stock rods are fine. get them magnafluxed and shot peened.weighed and think youll be fine. Plus youll be hard pressed to get 140hp to the ground anyways.

Bertvorgen on the Realm has 240hp out of a L motor turbo so find out what his bottom end is.

 

There was a test of L series Rods long ago in the old SportCompactCar. They say they are = to chevy LS1 rods.

They are using L seires cranks in Cosworth motors in Australia cause the ae alot cheaper and stronger that the stock ones.

 

Are those Carillo rods forges or Cast??????? Castings are lighter.

 

get ARP Bolts and studs.

 

Personlly alot of L20s are cracking now (of age/stress)between the center water passages . hate for you to spend all this money and it dont last long. I bought a 80K mile L20 and it was cracked.

 

wait for used rods to come up if you just gotto have a Carillo rods. A guy at work had soem for cheap back in the day

[Dirttrack510]

This is gonna be an L16 engine build, and I want it to safely spin as high as 8k, not to mention on a dirt track there is a lot of hard abuse from the wheels bouncing and grabbing on the dirt, creating huge jumps in revs, up and down. As far as Horsepower numbers go, according to the numbers we've crunched It looks like we'll be in the 175HP range when all is said and done. That's just enough to get me some wins at the track. :D

[banzai510(hainz)]

L16 with huge valves might hit side of block just a reminder if I hadnt said this already.

They have to be notch or eyebrowed. But I assume you know this already.

This happen to Datdougs friends 510 bigger cam hit. bent valve. I cant see how myself as I have a L16 with a 460 and another a 475lift. can and they are not notched. But stock size 42/30 and 42/38 on another head

[ggzilla]

This is how it can happen: 46mm valves and .513 lift.

[EricJB]

L16 with huge valves might hit side of block just a reminder if I hadnt said this already.

They have to be notch or eyebrowed. But I assume you know this already.

This happen to Datdougs friends 510 bigger cam hit. bent valve. I cant see how myself as I have a L16 with a 460 and another a 475lift. can and they are not notched. But stock size 42/30 and 42/38 on another head

 

 

I saw that motor that the valve hit the piston. An easy way to check for that is to put clay on top of the piston, mock assemble and rotate engine. Take it apart and measure the thickness of the clay. Notch pistons accordingly.

As far as hitting the side of the bore, that would involve some math.

 

And I agree, stock rods with good bolts will take 8k easy.

 

I wouldn't be worried about the rods coming apart with the traction going away and suddenly biting back. Drivetrain damage is the issue there. Buy a good rev limiter. IMO

[docbainey]

What he said... lol... It was $92.00 plus shipping, I'm just hoping it's not back ordered and unavailable. :unsure: I already have the shims for the cam towers too. :D

 

As far as rods go, I'm considering the Pauter X-Beam rods, they're about $900.00. I'm also looking at the Carillo H Beam rods, around $1000. I haven't decided yet. Both are great quality parts. I'm gonna try to make this engine so it can really spin and not go... BANG!!!

 

It looks like your dumping a ton of money in it. I take it your running dual mikunis?

 

Are you going to put the motor together? Do you have a reputable dyno service that you are going to use? With that kinda cash outlay, you need to make sure everything is spot on, especially cam timing & jetting. Using factory timing marks, without verifying them with a degree wheel is the surest way to disaster.

 

Our DP 2000 would run to 9500, fully counter weighted polished, cross drilled crank, carillo rods, domed pistons, 12.5 to 1, lightened and swirl polished valves, lighteend steel retainers, matched and optimized rockers, 8lb flywheel with twin disk clutch, of course everything fully balanced, magnufluxed, clearenced etc, cam dialed in, block oiling optimized, and it was still only good for a 186hp @ 8500 on the dyno. We probably could have done more with jetting, and porting, but at 100/hr for dyno time in 1979, we were happy. In that day Tilton would build a U motor for $5K if we supplied all the hard parts, good for 200hp dyno sheets included. He said, a race motor is nothing more then a bomb, how much horespower you want, determines the length of the fuse!

[Dirttrack510]

My machine shop guy will check all my clearances. He doesn't want much to do the assembly, so I'm gonna let him do it. As far as carbs go, I'm gonna be running dual side draft SU's, because my motor has to be "stock" :rofl: in my racing class. :no: (just like everyone else)

 

At least it will appear to be stock :rofl:

 

As far as ignition goes, I'll be using a MSD box with an adjustable rev limiter under my "dash" so it won't be visible.

I see guys with race motors toss rods on this track on a daily basis, because of all the constant abuse of racing on a high bank oval, so that's why I think good rods are a good investment. And yes, I have access to a dyno when it's done. It's about $100 a run at this shop, maybe I can get some "free" runs if I put the shop on my car as a sponsor. ;)

 

186 Horsepower would be over my goal, so that would be awesome, I'm only shooting for 150-175 HP.

[EricJB]

Using factory timing marks, without verifying them with a degree wheel is the surest way to disaster.

 

 

 

 

x2

[banzai510(hainz)]

duals SUs????

You wont see near 175 hp with a L16 lucky if 133hp at wheel.

Byron 510 buld a junkyard Z22/L20 head with SUs and higher liftcam came out with 138RWHP with like 4.11 or 4.38 gear ratio.

 

bore out to 85mm save money buy not buying those rods.

 

but let us see the dyno specs.

[docbainey]

This is gonna be an L16 engine build, and I want it to safely spin as high as 8k, not to mention on a dirt track there is a lot of hard abuse from the wheels bouncing and grabbing on the dirt, creating huge jumps in revs, up and down. As far as Horsepower numbers go, according to the numbers we've crunched It looks like we'll be in the 175HP range when all is said and done. That's just enough to get me some wins at the track. :D

 

Don't take it wrong, I just don't see 175hp with SU's out of an L16.

[Dirttrack510]

I'm gonna be running the 46mm SU's, not the 38mm ones. Rebello or Z therapy is probably gonna do the SU carbs for me. Rebello was actually cheaper though, so that's probably where I'll send em'.

[Dirttrack510]

I was wondering... Does anyone know of anywhere I can get a stamped steel/explosion proof bell housing for an L series set-up?

[ggzilla]

L-series transmissions don't use bellhousings (except the rare 1969 5-speed), instead the front case bolts to the engine.

 

Can you wrap it in a blanket?

[Dirttrack510]

I didn't know if there was any L series with a removable housing, that's why I asked. What did the 5 speed come in? I might make a steel shield to put around the trans. it wouldn't be that hard to make, i don't think.

[ggzilla]

You could buy a 5-speed for early 240Zs (71A series 5-speed). It's unclear if they were fitted factory to any USA cars, but apparently were fitted to a few Japan-market S30s and could be bought from Datsun Competition. This was a roadster 5-speed (hence the separated bell).

[Dirttrack510]

You could buy a 5-speed for early 240Zs (71A series 5-speed). It's unclear if they were fitted factory to any USA cars, but apparently were fitted to a few Japan-market S30s and could be bought from Datsun Competition. This was a roadster 5-speed (hence the separated bell).

I have a 71 240Z trans, but I never really looked at it, other than pulling it from the rotted shell. Maybe I should check it. lol... It's probably a 4 speed though. :P

[datsunaholic]

If you're worried about needing a scatter shield, I'd seriously consider getting a kevlar blanket made. The boat racers running turbine engines wrap the hot section with those so they handle the heat just fine too. It would have to be custom made but it weighs a lot less than steel armor.

[Dirttrack510]

Does that stop a flywheel explosion?

[datsunaholic]

Well, it'll stop a PT wheel explosion on a 3000 HP Lycoming turbine from blowing shrapnel through the hull and onto the spectators, so stopping a flywheel on a < 200 HP engine shouldn't be a problem. To stop a flywheel with steel plate would probably need 1/2" thick plate.

[datzenmike]

Only way it might blow is trimming too much off it the lighten it. If you want light get an aluminum one. L flywheels aren't known for blowing up at any speed. Regular inspections would make this even more remote. Seems like over kill.

[docbainey]

I was wondering... Does anyone know of anywhere I can get a stamped steel/explosion proof bell housing for an L series set-up?

 

Why do you need that? Rules? If so, weld some 1/4" plate in the trany tunnel. The flywheel is way in front of chopping your feet off, anyways you should be running an aluminum flywheel one or steel, not the cast one from the factory. Or get a kevlar blanket and lay it on the tunnel as suggested.

[Dirttrack510]

It's not in the rules, I was just trying to be safe. Yes I'm going to run a lightweight aluminum flywheel. :D

[docbainey]

All the big bucks your puting in this would probably be better served by making hand grenade motors with stock parts.

[Dirttrack510]

All the big bucks your puting in this would probably be better served by making hand grenade motors with stock parts.

I realize it's a lot to spend on one engine, but I've been racing with engines like what your talking about and to be honest, you never end up with a good performance engine and it is really frustrating to constantly be pulling the engine for swaps, when I could be spending my time tuning the engine or improving suspension and handling. I've been racing for 3 years, this will be my fourth year and I just decided it was time to have a quality racing engine that would hold up for a long time and all it would need is a yearly tear down, inspection, and rebuild. I'm not someone who races once in a while, I race every Saturday and some Fridays for about 30 weeks a year. This should be money well spent in the long run. :D

 

not to mention... People get really pissed at you when you keep OILING UP THE TRACK :angry: with blown engines.

[Dirttrack510]

Ok, so i talked to Rebello about my carbs & they say i need dual 45mm webers, so i'll be selling off my SU stuff to help pay for the Weber set-up. UGH!!!