Original Air Cleaner on 78 Pickup with 32/36 Weber ??

[difrangia]

I'm getting around to an upgrade on our 1978 'Bulletside' in this lull between Christmas and New Year's about 7 years after acquiring a Weber 32/36 for the pickup. I gathered up the carb, the carb adapter, and an adapter to use the original air-cleaner. All are 'Redline' products (carb is Spanish manufacture). The two-piece adapter to mate the carb to the manifold is about 3/4" thick. Problem that I've run into is when I test fit it all together, it's about 1 3/4" taller than the original Hitachi carb with air-cleaner (a-c = air-cleaner going forward) adapter. 

 

I put half a dozen balls of modeling clay about 5/8" diameter at spots around the top of a-c close to the outside diameter of the housing and also on the a-c snout. I then stuck 1" squares of plastic film cut out of a baggie on top of the clay balls so it wouldn't stick to anything coming in contact. I shut the hood and push down a bit over the a-c and opened the hood. Looks like the closest that the hood and it's structure come to the a-c is around the back of the housing and the clay was crushed to about 1/8" thick. That's too close and I'm sure that when the engine torque rotates a little when under load the a-c will contact the hood. 

 

I really don't want to use the thin rectangular chrome a-c that goes with the Weber carb. Has anyone done this carb swap and used the original a-c and, if so, can you contribute any tricks to make it happen ? Also can anyone who's made the swap from original carb to Weber on an L-Series engine tell of their change in performance and fuel mileage. Thanks in advance. 

 

Steve in OK

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

I've posted a couple pics of a simple air cleaner mod. Other guys have too @mklotz70?

 

 

Edited December 27, 2022 by Stoffregen Motorsports

[difrangia]

 

Thanks, Matt. I do recall you posting this, I believe, in a 320 thread. I'll definitely take a look at my air-cleaner and evaluate that as an option. I've been looking at making a low profile carb base adapter like I did for the E1 in the 320 to fit the Weber on it. I measured the two-piece Redline adapter and it stacks up 13/16", a little over 3/4". 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

I don't think machining the adapter will do the trick, because of the shape of the air cleaner base. The adapter puts the base on top of the air horn of the Weber.

[datzenmike]

 

This is the way I would go. Stealth Weber install. Bigger and cheaper air filter. You get to keep the ATC and the valve cover vent hose original and functional.

[difrangia]

That's what I'm shootin' for; keep the original air cleaner canister/assembly. The adapter that I was referring to machining a custom for is the one that adapts the carb to the manifold. I can knock off about half an inch there but not sure that is enough. There's not much leeway above the carb. The most I can gain up top is about 1/8" without open-choke interference.

 

On the 320 I made an adapter under the carb and modified the Redline adapter for the air-cleaner to smaller snout size for the smaller air-cleaner housing base diameter. The Redline air-cleaner adapter adds over 1 1/2" above the top deck of the 32/36 carb. The 320 had more vertical room to work with. Here is a pic of the Weber with the modified a-c adapter on the E1 in the 320. This allowed me to keep the original 320 a-c and original look.  

[yenpit]

2 hours ago, difrangia said:

 

Thanks, Matt. I do recall you posting this, I believe, in a 320 thread. I'll definitely take a look at my air-cleaner and evaluate that as an option. I've been looking at making a low profile carb base adapter like I did for the E1 in the 320 to fit the Weber on it. I measured the two-piece Redline adapter and it stacks up 13/16", a little over 3/4". 

 

I might have a spare 620 stock air filter assembly...........I would probably sell just the bottom half, if you wanted a spare to mess with, before cutting up your original!  PM if interested!

 

TJ

[difrangia]

Piddlin' around on this and I'm over the hump now. Couple of weeks of spare time and I think I've tinkered up something that will work on this project. The 620 is limited in head-space in the engine room as vehicles were getting lower and wider in the late 50's - early 60's. If I'z guessin the L-Series OHC  engine family was canted over to the right to lower the hoodline in the cars that the designers would turn out (example: Chrysler Slant-Six). Otherwise the Z-Cars would have had a big hood hood bubble that would spoil the artistic lines that it emerged as. Had to hammer the carb down to the minimum and keep the top part as low as possible. Here's a couple of pics of the mess kinda going back together.

 

Made a baseplate to mate the top flange of the Webber to the circular underside of the original air- filter housing. Figured out how I'd secure the two parts together and came up with six aircraft nutplates riveted to the baseplate. Everything fits together nicely and I have a minimum of 5/8" - 3/4" at the closest point to the hood. I think that as long as the motor mounts are solid and in good shape, I'll be OK. The air-cleaner housing was originally angled down in the front about 13 degrees and I was unable to do that with the flat top of the Weber and casting design around the fuel-intake port and changed the angle of the intake snout down by 13 degrees and am able to use the original plastic fresh-air bellow.

 

Fired him up, warmed up, and twisted the carby screws/needles a little and I can say that, just sitting static in the shop, the start-up, warm-up, acceleration and running during warm-up are miles better than the original carb. Can't wait to get out on the road for a try-out and see if MPG improves. Gonna replace the brake master reservoirs while I'm in there.

 

 

[datzenmike]

YES!!! Hate the Weber air filter look. Stealth is much better and the replacement filter is larger and cheaper, you get to keep the AIS and the cold air inlet.

[difrangia]

When it's all done and cleaned up, it'll take a real Datsun Nut to see it's not factory.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Wait, where are the pics of the inside of the air filter housing? I want to see how it bolts together.

 

Nice work Steve.

[difrangia]

4 hours ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Wait, where are the pics of the inside of the air filter housing? I want to see how it bolts together.

 

 

Here ya go, Matt. Popped this one in the midst of changing out the master reservoirs. I cut the original carb-top attachment out of the base and took all the pre-heat-air gadgets out. In the climate where I live and the amount and type of use that I employ the 'bulletside' for it's not necessary. From the topside, it'll look like it's all still there. The circular baseplate that I made from 1/16" steel with the six nutplates is made to just fit the flat underside of the filter housing directly under the filter lower seal. I match drilled the filter housing to the baseplate and dimpled the housing for 10-32 stainless flathead screws. Made a .100 thick high-density panelboard gasket to go between the baseplate and filter housing. I would like to have canted the front of the filter housing down in the front for a bit more hood clearance, but the structure of the Weber's fuel inlet caused a problem. I could have turned the carb around backward but didn't want to get into fabing a special throttle cable.

 

 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Pretty cool.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Oh, I hope you loctited the small 5mm studs into the carb top. Those are notorious for coming loose. The nuts too, but I use lock washers on those, instead of loctite.

[difrangia]

4 hours ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Oh, I hope you loctited the small 5mm studs into the carb top. Those are notorious for coming loose. The nuts too, but I use lock washers on those, instead of loctite.

 

Matt, thanks for the tip on those four carb-top bolts; I'll Lock-Tite em. Them little suckers would jump right down on top of a valve, for sure. When I acquired this 'Longbed' from the original owners in 2013 a cam follower had jumped off and gotten sideways between cam and valve stem and warped the hell out of a valve. Don't wanna go through that little exercise again. I haven't taken the 'Frog' out of the shop yet since fitting the carb. I'm in the middle of extending the brace from the intake manifold up to the front of the filter housing. Frog was the old guy's nickname who bought this 620 new in 78 He died in the 90's and now the 'Bulletside' carries his handle. I think I'm gonna love this upgrade !! 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Frog...

[datzenmike]

Right away....

 

 

[mklotz70]

Just came across a notice saying I was tagged in here.  Here's some info from when I put a stock air cleaner on a weber.  

 

 

I've had these templates on my site for years....
http://www.bluehandsinc.com/weber-adapters.html

 

 

[difrangia]

DZMike, 'That is not my dog'. We just watched the whole 'Pink Panther' Series last week. Picked up a boxed set several years ago. Nobody did it like Peter Sellers; kinda like Sean Connery as 007.

 

MKlotz70, If I'd been able to find your old thread before I started, it would have helped in the planning stage. 

 

I got the front bracket lengthened yesterday evening and primed up the bare spots. Gonna take it for a spin today & check hood clearance. When it's all proved out and I'm satisfied with it, it'll come off for a paint job in the sorta original color blue.

[datzenmike]

Did you get the frog reference? I was going to use  Poirot but probably over everyone's heads.(or maybe not)

[difrangia]

Inspector Closeau, Chief Inspector Dreyfus, Kato -'the loyal man-servant' & the rest of the crew. Some pretty neat vintage vehicles in that series of movies Yup, classics for sure !!

 

'When duty calls, You got Balls' !!

 

'Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid' another milestone comedy classic of ours.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Dead men don't wear plaid was great.

 

Eddie Murphy Raw too.

 

Poirot... I got it. I'm over 40.

[difrangia]

Oh Yeah !! Eddie Murphy. 'Nutty Professor; The Klumps' and 'Norbit'. Seen em both fifty times and they are still side-splitters. He's a master at those multi-character roles and hilarious in all of them.

 

Got the teeny bolts in the top of the Weber Loctited and everything cinched down and ready for a spin. It's drizzlin rain today so I'm not gettin the Frog out in it. Just static running, tweaking and playing around in the shop, I think I gonna develop some serious Spring-Fever for the 620 real soon. I might even have to invest in a tacho for the instruments. 

[wayno]

This is how I did one to my 320, first I used one of these spacers to clear the valve cover, I would never use any other adapter/spacer unless I had no other choice.

 

 

I cut out the middle of the air filter bottom just inside the rubber gasket sealing the air filter element in the housing and welded in the flat plate I made for the Weber Carb.

 

 

I cannot remember if the breather on the valve cover matched a hole in the valve cover housing or if I made a hole, but the valve cover vent and air filter housing are connected with this rubber hose piece.

 

 

I made and welded a bracket on the flat plate to hold the top of air filter housing in place.

 

 

Here is a better photo of the bottom plate.

 

 

Here is the inside of the air filter housing where the valve cover vent is, the air filter does not cover this hole.

 

 

I can just get the valve cover cap on and off, I likely would have made a spacer if I had to.

 

 

You can barely see the rubber vent piece beside the air filter in this photo.

 

 

Here it is with the top on it, someone in the past cut the snout.

 

Edited January 21, 2023 by wayno

[datzenmike]

Hose should be inside the filter or the filter will get oily but otherwise I like this way better than the Weber