grenaded my l18 now i want to build an lz22

[dr.feltersnatch]

so last sat i was on my way to meet some local 510 guys and i pull over to get gas. as i leave i notice it feels like my e- brake is on, i check and nope its off. 2 blocks later my gear shifter starts to rattle. wtf, so i pull up the rubber boot to listen better and something let loose. i pull over and when i pushed my clutch in it vibrates in and out like a half inch and with the clutch in the noise gets way worse. at first i thought i exploded the clutch i put in a few months ago. but after turning the motor over by hand its FUCKED! i pulled over and called for a ride. the noise was BAD. i will pull the motor this weekend and gut it to find the failure

my old 510 had an lz and i have been wanting to build another, so now is my chance!

i have found 2 z22 blocks and am now kinda torn. one is a junkyard short block that needs a rebuild, it was overheated and smoked un known mileage, asking price of $200

the other is a running complete motor a guy pulled out of a wrecked truck with 167000 miles. he says it ran good before he pulled it. 

so being a broke ass i am torn, do i go for the full rebuild and have everything new or do i save a few bucks and just re ring the runner. its also got a bunch of parts that i dont need and can maybe off for a few bucks. 

now obviously i am not rich so i dont want to waste money, but i also dont want to half ass things. so what would you do?

200 short block and full rebuild or 400 runner and possibly re ring it and run the shit out of it?

i 

[jastrunk97]

Spend 400 for the runnner

[dr.feltersnatch]

i plan to run my u67 and at least new timing chain, gaskets etc.

[datzenmike]

What happens when you turn the motor by hand???

[dr.feltersnatch]

it turns the motor over about 1/4 rev and you feel a sudden stop. turn it back and its the same. put a pencil down #4 hole and it doesnt move when you turn the crank. 

[MicroMachinery]

I would recommend going for the LZ23.. I did that immediately after my LZ22. I'm way happier. I run 87 octane with more advance and there is no pinging(I had to run premium with alot less advance, and I'd still get pinging sometimes if I didn't ease into the pedal), plus I am able to run a closed chamber head, which is way nicer than the U67. I used D21 Z24 pistons.

 

Grab the Z22 that needs to be rebuilt. Even if you re-ring the $400 runner, that still means doing a full rebuild(if you're doing it properly).

[dr.feltersnatch]

how much did you pay for your machine work?

[MicroMachinery]

I think it was $10 a hole for boring and honing.

[datzenmike]

it turns the motor over about 1/4 rev and you feel a sudden stop. turn it back and its the same. put a pencil down #4 hole and it doesnt move when you turn the crank. 

 

You try that with the clutch pedal down? The trans may be pooched.

[dr.feltersnatch]

i havent yet but i will. 

[Jester]

I'm with Micro, just do it and get it over with. You will be much happier knowing that everything is right.

[RTB]

Build a l20 stroker.

[metalmonkey47]

I couldn't be happier with my Z20 block, Z22 crank, 86mm piston LZ22 setup. Parts were easy, and there was no modifying the gaskets to match coolant ports for the block to head. With an A87 peanut I run a 9.4:1 on 93 with no issues, and it's tough as nails. 

[hang_510]

the dead short block will need the same as the runner.

rings, bearings, hone, head work...

 

$200 is worth saving to not have to pull the motor again in 6mos.

 

you should negotiate a better deal too.

i got a complete Z22 for $150

[dr.feltersnatch]

just a little update

bought the z22 block its now at the machine shop 

 

and found out what happened to my l18, the fuckin crank snapped in half! right at the #4 piston. when i pulled it out the flywheel moved back and forth like it wanted to fall out. that explains why i felt it in the clutch and tranny.

[datzenmike]

Impressive. Imagine what it takes to twist that apart.

[dr.feltersnatch]

i am collecting parts and pieces and was wondering what kind of assembly lube you guys use.

 

[Jester]

I really like Lubriplate #105. I have used it for years without failure.

https://www.lubriplate.com/Products/Automotive-Lubricants-Motor-Oils/Lubriplate-No-105-Motor-Assembly-Grease.aspx

[smoke]

Impressive. Imagine what it takes to twist that apart.

No shit. I have busted a couple in a similar way as that, but it was usually on some monster I was abusing the hell out of.

[datzenmike]

I snapped a 350 crank once.

[dr.feltersnatch]

ok picked up the block from the machine shop today. i had them bore it .030 over, polish the crank, install arp bolts and re condition the rods, and re surface the flywheel. currently waiting on the bearings and gasket set to arrive then i can start assembling the bottom end.

all i had time to do today was paint the block. i am on the fence with going for a new ka oil pump or picking one up from a junk yard. everything else is new so i dont want to go cheap on an oil pump but i saw a couple last time i was at the yard that looked pretty decent, and i am a broke bastard so...

[dr.feltersnatch]

and the fram is just there to mask the filter mating surface. i have had it on the shelf but i am not going to run it so at least it is serving a purpose!

[dr.feltersnatch]

i went to jays automotive in everett, on the advice of 67_1600. his brother works there. they are an old school shop and did a great job and gave me a hell of a deal! i am fully pleased with the job they did! even came in on a saturday to finish up my stuff.

[Cardinal Grammeter]

Its hard to think that was the result of HP. 

 

When you get it out, carefully look at the fracture surface.

 

I'm guessing a crack initiated and propagated from vibratory stress - probably a poorly effective harmonic balancer.

 

The crack will slowly spread until the section becomes so small it finally fails in ultimate.

 

Now here is the cool part, the propagating portion takes many cycles to spread which means there is relative motion between the crack surfaces which polish that portion of the crack.

 

A purely ultimate failure results in a complete jagged fracture surface.

 

I broke an axle  where it looked like you cut it on a band saw.  A crack initiated and then slowly propagated across 90% of the axle cross-section until it finally had an ultimate brake.  The jagged surface associated with the ultimate failure was a very small portion of the cross-section.  In fact, it was such a small percentage, it was not obviously visible.

 

Look carefully in the fillets and intersection between the oil holes and bearing surface.

[Suspect]

I revved the crap out of a tired L16 for 5-6 years, it never broke.  I finally had to pull it, couldn't destroy it, must have had a billion miles on it.  I have no idea what kind of abuse you would have to do to a L motor to get the crank to break or even throw a rod.  They seem indestructible to me.