d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Decided to try and put a EI dizzy in my 521 but ran into an issue. First off the base for the distributor was too tall so I had to used the L16 base and do some file work to get all the bolts to fit. Once I got it in I cant get it to start. It gets good spark but it seems very very out of time. No matter what way I turn the dizzy I cant seem to get it any where close. Cant even get the rotor to line up with the #1 position on the dizzy cap. How would I remedy this? My dad who is the one who I am relying on for help is saying I need to drop the oil pump and turn something but wont explain further. By dropping the oil pump would it allow me to turn the dizzy drive line so that I can get the rotor to line up with #1 while on TDC on compression? Quote Link to comment
bub510 Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 im sure theres a link on her some where but go to olddatsuns.com and read link to jason greys distributer writeup Quote Link to comment
datsunaholic Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Well, the first thing is that you have to have the correct pedestal. Reman EI dists don't come with a pedestal, and the points ones aren't aligned the same way. You'll never get it to time, unless you go to the extreme of changing the drive spindle timing. Quote Link to comment
d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 The pedestal from z20e doesnt fit, its too tall. If I try to use it theres like a half inch or better between where it slips into the motor and the bottom of the flange that has the bolt holes in it. This is the pedestal that came with the dizzy directly off of the block. that yellow paper represents the hole the dizzy slides in it. It bottoms out before fitting all the way in. Quote Link to comment
kelowg Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 180 degree out, done 3 conversions, all where like that Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Try rotating the dizzy and get the rotor under one of the wires on the cap. Any one. If you can, make this the new #1 and move all the wires around to fit it 1 3 4 2 in a counter clockwise rotation. Below the dizzy is a spindle driven off the crankshaft. It also reaches down and turns the oil pump. With the motor at TDC, the dizzy out, the top of the spindle will look like this down in the hole.... With the motor at TDC if you can't get the rotor under any of the wires in the top of the cap you will have to unbolt the oil pump and lower it and the spindle. Turn the spindle one tooth either way and put back in with the oil pump. Looking at the top the spindle should be turned to 11:30 or perhaps 11:20 and now when the dizzy is installed the rotor will be much turned to right or left and should now be under one of the wires in the dizzy cap. If so this becomes #1 plug wire and move the others in order around it. Quote Link to comment
wayno Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 It's always easier when someone else explains it,:lol: and with Oics. is even better.:thumbup: Quote Link to comment
d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 I'm a very visual learner so that helped a lot, also after reading JG's stuff it seems that the NAPZ pedestal never was supposed to work I need the pede off of an Lmotor 280zx or I need to modify the timing plate that came from the napz and use the stock pede. Quote Link to comment
Jayden71 Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 I had same problem with my EI conversion. 180 out, pissed me off!! I was able to use the L16 pedastal with the EI dizzy. Drilled a new hole and it works great now. I set my dizzy up with the matchbox pointing toward the radiator, just didn't want that at the back right by the exhaust mani :D Quote Link to comment
d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 So how did you fix the 180 out problem? Quote Link to comment
Jayden71 Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Took valve cover off and no. 1 plug to make sure engine at TDC. Took oil pump off and lined it up with the timing mark that is on it. Just like the oic shows the pump shaft should point to like 1125. Slap it back together carefully Quote Link to comment
d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Alright so it looks as if I am going to need to set motor at TDC tomorrow and if I cannot get the rotor lined up with a wire while at TDC I'm either going to try and move the spindle to get them lined up. Quote Link to comment
Jayden71 Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Ya, it can be frustrating fo sho. I got mine all put together and was couple teeth off :angry: . Just take your time and try not to get in hurry. You will be happy with the results :D Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 The drive on the crank is a worm gear so when inserting the spindle it will rotate as it goes up into place. If you have someone watch from the dizzy side you can save time. I had to lightly bolt the oil pump in place to hold it and climb out from under the truck and look and go back and forth. Since there are twenty teeth you hasve twenty possible positions. Everyone tries to follow the 11:28 position at TDC but in reality anywhere will work as long as the dizzy can be rotated around the rotor to get it under one of the four plug wires and still get it timed properly. Quote Link to comment
Jayden71 Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Very true Mike. I had help when timing my L the first time after rebuild. Doing it alone after that really sucks!! Quote Link to comment
banzai510(hainz) Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 get the correct parts!!!!!!!!! get rid of point coil and get a MSD blaster 2 or 79 200 sx coil or from donar rig you got his from. Point coils cant handel full 12volts that why the ballast resisitor part 5 and 6 should cover it http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=8EF51386855F2B58 Quote Link to comment
d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 I have the Z car coil from one that had the same dizzy i am using. It's simple out of time and I need to figure out how to get it back in time. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Set TDC on compression stroke. Look through oil filler cap and check that both cam lobes on #1 are pointing upward. Use the timing mark on the crank pulley and set on the 0 (zero) on the timing plate usually bolted to the timing chain cover just behind the rear pulley on the alternator side. Once set at TDC remove the dizzy cap and see where the rotor is pointing. It has to point to any one of the spark plug wires on the cap when it's on. Twist the dizzy forward or back to get it near a wire. If this isn't possible you may have to remove the distributor and oil pump and let the drive spindle drop out. Turn it one or two teeth and put back in with the pump. When you install the dizzy it will now be in another position and likely within range of one of the plug wires in the cap. You are at TDC on the compression stroke so this plug wire now becomes #1 so rearrange the rest of the wires in the firing order 1342. Hook up everything and it should start. If it cranks jerkily and fights against the starter it's too advanced so turn the dizzy counter clockwise to retard slightly. If it turns very fast and fires but won't run without the starter it's too retarded so turn the dizzy clockwise slightly to advance the timing. Quote Link to comment
d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Lol I should have clarified myself Mike, I have to turn the dizzy drive line to get it to line up. I wonder though if it would line up properly if i put a different pedestal on there if that would allow me enough room to get it to align.... Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 It might. . Quote Link to comment
Sealik Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Very true Mike. I had help when timing my L the first time after rebuild. Doing it alone after that really sucks!! The pump and spindle have marks on them, if you line them up and slide the pump in...keeping the 4 mounting bolt holes in the pump aligned with the holes in the bottom of the TC...no problemo I'm batting 1000 on my last 3 (first attempt) installs.... :D Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Yup. That will give the 11:28 location for the spindle. Most dizzys if they come complete with the pedestal base and matching slotted plate should slip in and work, but there are mixed and matched parts too and not all rotors point in the same direction. I think the Z20E 4 plug dizzy has the rotor 180 different if mounted on an L20B. I put a matchbox on my L18 and there was no way it would or could be fitted and work. I pulled out all the bases I had and ended up cutting the adjustment slot out to get the adjustment. I should have dropped the oil pump and moved it a tooth or two. I think I used one from a Z24? Cut the slot.. See this thing? It was in the way of the vacuum advance so I took it out. (it allows EGR only when the motor is warmed up) I wanted to keep the 11:28 spindle position but it took a lot of custom work. If I did it again I would drop the pump and move it somewhere else. . Quote Link to comment
d510addict Posted February 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Woot I had to drop the oil pump the spindle was perpendicular to the 11:28 position and I ended up having to move it 2 notches. We timed it to 12 deg advanced, runs 1000000000 times better now. I guess the old coil connections were jacked up and very lose which was one of the problems i had with the old distributor so with the new one I made sure connections were clean and tight. The truck now starts and idles while cold no problem (probably still runs a bit rich need to adjust carb and regap plugs), there is no hesitation which I had randomly at all RPMs, I can actually go slow and not have to rev it all the time to keep the motor running and taking off from idle is now very smooth. While a lot of my problems came from loose connections and the spindle being in the wrong position which made it impossible to properly time, going through the process of replacing the dizzy is what allowed me to find and correct those problems and improve how the truck runs even further. Thank you for the help all!! Quote Link to comment
Jayden71 Posted February 27, 2011 Report Share Posted February 27, 2011 Awesome :thumbup: Glad to hear it!! Quote Link to comment
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