This is a stupid problem to be having

[metalmonkey47]

I'm working on making my car a DD so I have something between 2 jobs, right? So I get a thermostat housing gasket for my A15 since it was a little leaky, pulled the bolts and pulled off the housing. LOW AND BEHOLD a broken fucking bolt almost right on the head. Nothing left to grab onto with vice grips. So I drill into it and try and get it with an easy out, for removing broken bolts, and I've never had a problem with that.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Then....

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Snap. Now I have a hardened steel easy out drilled onto a bolt stuck in my head. What the fuck do I do now? Can't really drill and tap, since the easy out is slightly sticking out and way to tiny to drill off, can't get the easy out removed since there's not enough sticking out to grab it with a pair of vice grips.

 

Only solution would be to grind it off and drill it out, but I'm NOT grinding that close to a gasket surface on my head.

 

NOW since getting the car, 1st I broke the housing trying to check the status of my thermostat, now I break the bolts that hold it.

 

Suggestions?

 

 

I'm about to start whoring myself on on craigslist for a KA/VG if this problem isn't solved soon.

[thisismatt]

Could try holding a nut over it and through the nut hole weld the nut to the stud. Won't be a super strong weld most likely, but the concentrated heat may also help free the bolt.

[Jayden71]

Dude, I feel yer pain!! I had a valve cover bolt broken off right at the head, perfectly flush with it. My neighbor helped me and we were gonna ez out it. Ya right!!! Turned into a 4 hour nightmare! :o He broke the ez out in the bolt and then we decided to drill it out. Now I have a rather large bolt hole thats not really that round anymore with a heli coil in it. It is gunked up with a bunch of silicone t stp the oil leak. I was better off just leaving it the fuck alone!!

[metalmonkey47]

Could try holding a nut over it and through the nut hole weld the nut to the stud. Won't be a super strong weld most likely, but the concentrated heat may also help free the bolt.

Good idea, it's just too close to the head to weld. :( I don't wanna get slag all over the gasket surface and under the hood everywhere.

 

Dude, I feel yer pain!! I had a valve cover bolt broken off right at the head, perfectly flush with it. My neighbor helped me and we were gonna ez out it. Ya right!!! Turned into a 4 hour nightmare! :o He broke the ez out in the bolt and then we decided to drill it out. Now I have a rather large bolt hole thats not really that round anymore with a heli coil in it. It is gunked up with a bunch of silicone t stp the oil leak. I was better off just leaving it the fuck alone!!

 

 

Sounds exactly like my problem :( WAY too late to turn back now though. I really don't want to have to drill and tap another hole if I can get it out, but I'm not sure what other choice I may have.

 

 

[thisismatt]

Shouldn't get slag anywhere when you're only welding inside the nut hole...?

[metalmonkey47]

Shouldn't get slag anywhere when you're only welding inside the nut hole...?

 

I only have a cheap-o stick welder. Plus, I wasn't thinking when you said that.. Now I feel stupid. lol

 

 

 

 

Anyways... heres the bolt in question.

[thisismatt]

Yeah, could totally do what I'm saying with that bolt. You could also just try using a pin punch and a hammer to unscrew it since it is sticking out a ways. Either way you should soak it with penetrating lube and probably apply some heat around it immediately before trying to turn it.

[I'm BLUE]

I only have a cheap-o stick welder. Plus, I wasn't thinking when you said that.. Now I feel stupid. lol

 

 

 

 

Anyways... heres the bolt in question.

 

Don't fuck with the welder until ALL options exhausted ,,,,,,,, it is indeed an idea

 

FIRST ,,,,, spray that fucker with lube ........ "PB BLAST" IS GREAT !!!

 

Have you carefully tried to "stake it" in the direction with either a sharp chisel/punch/screwdriver or whatver to break it free ( at an angle hit it 45 degrees down angled or whatever degree works ,,,,, deep enough to turn the bolt head counter clockwise..........

 

You can also "attempt" to use 2 picks to spin it out after turning it out enough ( takes A LOT of time but it can work........ I have done this on the pin retaining bolts in 8.8 ford rear ends ) :unsure: ( Got it out in 6 hours one time ,,,,,, about 4.5-5 of those were continous )

 

Take your time and don't marr anything up ,,,,,,,, not a race ;)

[I'm BLUE]

Yeah, could totally do what I'm saying with that bolt. You could also just try using a pin punch and a hammer to unscrew it since it is sticking out a ways. Either way you should soak it with penetrating lube and probably apply some heat around it immediately before trying to turn it.

+1 ,,,, :rofl: ^^^ I just got done typing that then saw your post ( except the heat part ) :thumbup: ....... Though I would be cautious of the amount and where you use the heat Monkey if you choose to :D

[Gary]

matt's got it

 

maybe get a wirewheel or a wire brush onto that area first and clean it up nice

 

then penetrant, WD40 does alright but there's better (CRC 5.56 if you can find some, gibbs, etc) heat might help too if you've got access to one of those brazing torches

 

looks like you could remove the bolt and easyout together which is a plus, you might not have to deal with the easyout at all :D whatever you do, do it gently so if one thing you try doesnt work, you havent messed up other options :)

[metalmonkey47]

Thanks guys! I'm gonna go spray some PB on it, look a little more, and maybe take a few more pics. The one I posted was prior to the EZ out. So it's hard to tell how difficult it is.

 

 

Can you explain more on staking? I'm gonna take my laptop down there with me and fiddle around, so I'll be here

[I'm BLUE]

Thanks guys! I'm gonna go spray some PB on it, look a little more, and maybe take a few more pics. The one I posted was prior to the EZ out. So it's hard to tell how difficult it is.

 

 

Can you explain more on staking? I'm gonna take my laptop down there with me and fiddle around, so I'll be here

 

This bolt shouldn't be horribly torqued in there ( unless previous owner was evil :lol: )

 

First Things first .......... Get a soda ! :lol: ( starts with a D ends with ....... pepper )

 

Use many incremented squirts of penetrent ( you don't have to make it bathe everytime , just make sure there is some of there often ,,,, it can help other times it doesn't do much ,,,, but is always a good practice to do !!! I always spray down exhaust stuff 1-2 days before I work on it , and a couple of hours before then as well as in between )

 

Which direction you wish to go ? Counter clockwise , so you would be tapping the punch to the rear of the car if working from the front passenger side hitting at 180 degrees level ( left loosey , righty tighty )

 

You want to be able to have enough surface area to carefully , ever so carefully hit a more solid point of the broken off bolt to get a good whack of the chisel/punch/whatever fine,,,,,,,,,, in which it will not slip off ,,,,,,,, carefully work in rotations and try not to marr the shit out of everything ,,,,,,,,,,,,

 

There has been a couple of times were I would deliberately drive a flat SHARP Chisel straight down to make a "flat head" type slotted surface area ,,,,,,,, to resemble being able to use the slot to put the point of the punch/whatever against to turn the bolt out. ........ hope this helps a bit more ,,,,,,,,,,, sometimes you can hit it on the lowest point that has the most beef on it so you KNOW it will not slip off and marr the surface ;)

 

Take yer time and use a balanced CORRECT weight Ball Pein hammer (for fatigue / force issues ) You will get a fee for this , usually work around 16oz or so ? everyone has a different preference ! ;)

[datzenmike]

Rub some Vaseline on any exposed areas and weld away. Or make a shield. You can try the other stuff but if it's in there enough to snap it off ... it's in there. Once the nut is on, heat the aluminum around it with a torch. Aluminum expands twice as much as steel so heating it will expand the hole the bolt is in making it 'looser' and easier to remove when hot.

[I'm BLUE]

ohhhhhhh Monkey , I forgot ,,,,,,,,,,, the steeper the angle , sometimes can be better , other times you f%cker yourself out of space on the head of the bolt to get it out ,,,,,,,,,,, don't just hit the bolt make sure it is uniform , and actually turning a direction at a comfortable angle ( 45 degrees is as close I usually get , would go steeper , but usually screw it up if more than that )

 

If using a smaller punch ,,,,,,,, make sure you work closer to the edges but not neccessarily at them leaving you enough material on the head itself to work with

 

Looking Back ^^^ thisismatt has really good advice about slipping an oversized nut , and welding that enough to break free ,,,,,,,, I would add if you are worried about slag ......... slip some sheet metal around the area or cut out a Campel's soup cup , size it down a bit , bore a hole and weld away ;)

 

Good Thinking thisismatt !!! I originally thought there was less material ,,,,,,,, I bow to your superior knowledge :D :lol:

[metalmonkey47]

DTP, I'll reply to that crap in the damn PM later you ass

 

 

Mike, will do! The heat was my original thought, but I didn't have anything to grab with it until now.

 

 

 

 

Also, theres a lot less material then it seems.

 

 

[thisismatt]

That looks like it could even be enough to get vice grips on, but you need the smaller kind with the finer, sharp teeth

[I'm BLUE]

That looks like it could even be enough to get vice grips on, but you need the smaller kind with the finer, sharp teeth

 

+1 ^^^ , done a few times with success

[INDY510]

if you fuck up with the vise grips............. then you will have nothing to weld to........

 

 

 

That bolt is really in there if it broke............ vise grips might just round it off

[metalmonkey47]

if you fuck up with the vise grips............. then you will have nothing to weld to........

 

 

 

That bolt is really in there if it broke............ vise grips might just round it off

 

Yeah, it's rounded from the vise grips. Tried smaller finer and it made it worse :(

[metalmonkey47]

I made a video for ya, but I'm all kind of out of it right now so I feel like a douche.

 

I'll post it in a few.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Video:

Edited August 8, 2010 by metalmonkey47

[datzenmike]

 

L series thermostat cover bolt broke.

 

 

Started by getting a good grip on it first. Remove vice grips and heat it up till just smoking hot, quickly grip and turn.

 

 

At least with the L series the whole thermostat housing could be removed and swapped... but this risks breaking another bolt. Luckily it squeaked a bit but loosened and came out. I turned it slightly and backed it up, turned it a bit further and backed it up and a little further and back up until fully loosened.

 

 

If careful you can use a file to make two flat spots for better grip.

[metalmonkey47]

I wish it was that simple :( I don't have as much to grab since I drilled into it for the EZ out. I can try filing down 2 sides though.

 

Naturally, when it broke my first thought was to go to the vise grips. I tried large ones like what you used, and I also tried smaller, finer threaded ones. Neither were very successful because the way it broke made it very simple to round the broken stud off and they just keep slipping off.

 

Even then, I wasn't worried until after I drilled into it with a hardened steel EZ out, and as soon as I tried backing it out it snapped off. THAT was when I knew I had a problem and turned to Ratsun.

[Sealik]

Done it....but different location for the Z24 TC cover. If all else fails.....grind it flush. Punch/mark the center of the bolt. Drill with a slightly smaller bit (relative to bolt size).....keeping 90 degrees to the 'block'/housing is a plus. ;) The remaining threads can easily be pulled out.....if not....tap it.

[datzenmike]

If the easy out snapped that's some hard shit to drill through. I guess you could try punching the easy out into pieces to get it out?

[metalmonkey47]

If the easy out snapped that's some hard shit to drill through. I guess you could try punching the easy out into pieces to get it out?

 

Yeah, that's the hard part. I pulled the radiator so I don't accidentally smack it while chiseling away and ruin it and when I'm not working one of these next few days I'll get back to it. Just wish I didn't have to do this in the first place