510 drift??

[derek]

the ignorance in this thread is amazing

[hang_510]

ignorance is bliss :fu:

 

 

why dont you enlighten 'us', oh mighty possesor of knowledge.

[sick620]

poopie

Edited December 5, 2021 by sick620

[datzenmike]

in a drift race you are trying to get through corners at the highest rate of speed with a little style. it can be a time battle or a head to head battle. when i say i want to drift competitive i dont mean a parkinglot with cones i mean a real race course. a drift car can easily be faster than any other car driven by a racer with a different cornering style. a real drifter drifts to conquer the corner at the highest speed

 

The fastest way through a corner isn't drifting or all race cars would be doing it. To corner fast the tires need to be tightly gripping the pavement. I agree it's a style of cornering using hp to spin the wheels to maximize oversteer more than push the car through a turn. Ice racing would be the same but no tire smoke and wipe outs are into snow drifts. :D

[Woody620]

I think you should go for it, I love seeing the old school cars out at the drift track.

 

I drift an 81 te72. its an earlier model to the ae86 and basically all of the parts are bolt in interchangable right down to the dash. And because of that aftermarket parts are fairly easy to find as well. And it looks similar to the 510 as long as you dont have the garbage american bumpers on it.

just as an idea.

 

here's mine

[palauoriginal]

the ignorance in this thread is amazing

 

weren't you the one who set up a z for drifting?

or am i mixing you up with someone else..

[HRH]

The fastest way through a corner isn't drifting or all race cars would be doing it. To corner fast the tires need to be tightly gripping the pavement. I agree it's a style of cornering using hp to spin the wheels to maximize oversteer more than push the car through a turn. Ice racing would be the same but no tire smoke and wipe outs are into snow drifts. :D

 

Ditto that! Many an autocross season under my belt. Each time you hang the end out, there goes .2 seconds! Unless it's rallycross in the snow, then it's just fun.

[sick620]

poop

Edited December 5, 2021 by sick620

[NorCalDime]

i have to disagree with that. everyone has there own opinion on this so i respect yours mike. you are correct that gripping the corner can be a very fast strategy in a FF(front engine/front drive) or a awd. but in a FR(front engine/rear drive) car the speed in wich you need to slow too is considerably slower. a front wheel drive or awd car is faster mid corner to the corners exit.... a FR car is faster coming into a corner using a 4 wheel drift. My biggest disagree with your post is that you use HP to SPIN your tires... that is not the case at all. Thats what people with no driving technique do. In acctuality if you are a good driver you are trying to use inertia and your speed to "glide" you through the corner.... The best example i have ever seen on this is on a anime show called initial D(youtube it) where a tofu delivery boy beats all kinds of drift monsters in an underpowered ae86. He uses technique rather than power. He also beats ff and awd cars. another example Keiichi Tsuchiya who is one of the most famous drifters of all time used too race in japenese professional mountain pass races and he would literally "RAPE" his competition wich included evos and skylines (AWD cars) wich used a braking technique close too what your talking about. He raced in underpowered silvias and ae86's. Drifting has became a show of HP and stupid AWD cars with 600 plus HP. The type of drifting i am looking too do is not the stupid drift you see people doing to look cool. I want to do the Keiichi Tsuchiya style of race drift.

 

 

 

wait wait wait wait.

 

Your arguing that the fastest way around a turn in a FR car is by drifting through it? :blink:

 

I know what style you are talking about, maybe, i think thats what your talking about even thought your comparing real life driving to a cartoon :P But yes ive seen really really good drifters with maybe a 80 or 90 or maybe even 100 on occasion mph entry speed but still coming out of it they are going pretty slow, especially on a long sweeping turn.

 

There is no way that is faster than a car gripping around that turn holding a much higher sustained speed. I dont know the entry speed of a well tuned grip car but i would assume for that same turn it would be maybe 60? Factor in that halfway through the apex they are going to be getting on it and probably coming out a whole lot faster.

 

This is of course talking about a paved surface. When you get into dirt/snow etc drifting is faster because the limits of the surface. A good example is midget/ rally, etc.

 

just think of it as there is no way a drift car is ever going to be able to hang with an f-1 car through the turns. Since you said it isnt about horsepower that should be an issue with this argument. You can only substitute so much entry speed for your lack of power, and bottom line is it isnt going to match.

 

Over steer is not a new development, when driving competitively your correcting constantly to fight oversteer so that you can be faster.

Edited November 11, 2009 by NorCalDime

[HRH]

I think you're confusing the proven technique of "trail-braking" with the concept of drifting. Two VERY different things. Drifting a corner will not guarantee you anything but SLOWER.

 

In trail braking, you enter hotter than you should and use the very minimal slide (ie drag) to slow you down then recover and exit faster. Works great. Is it drifting? Absolutely not.

 

Go to any autocross. Drift the course, then drive the course. You will find drifting is NOT, I REPEAT NOT the way to go fast.

[derek]

wow at drifting being fast.. i lol'd.

 

 

drifting in a competitive form:

 

you have a course layout and a panel of judges. on the course layout there are clipping points (they can be on the inside or outside of a turn). the objective for solo car runs is to enter the course at the highest speed possible while maintaining a slide or angle while getting as close to the clipping points as possible. points are awarded for speed, angle, clipping point distance, and sometimes tire smoke produced. some sanctioning bodies favor "wall tapping" or "dirt drop" while others give you an automatic 0 for it. wall tapping is how it sounds. tap the wall with your rear bumper without affecting speed or angle. dirt drop is to drop a rear tire off course, sometimes resulting in a 1-up(where the inside front tire raises off the ground).

 

a tandem run is similar to the solo runs for the lead driver but the chase driver has to mirror the lead driver. get as close as possible without overtaking and still getting the clipping points and maintaining speed.

 

all runs are judged by a panel, which of course causes controversy at times. judges also can call a "one more time" which is basically too close to call so we will run again.

 

its all set up in a bracket style just like drag racing.

 

most people that enjoy the sport, however, do not compete. we just go out and have fun trying to do wall taps or dirt drops or close tandem battles. there are some assholes and dumbfuck kids out there. but they are everywhere, in every sport and are unavoidable. like i said, the guys that show up at our local events are all amazing sports and eager to learn. drifting may never be considered a legitimate sport to most of you guys but it is fun and there is a lot more technique than just pulling the ebrake or clutch kicking like that shitty movie fast and furious makes it seem.

 

anyway. i really didnt want to get into a debate about drifting since anyone can argue about it till they are blue in the face. but i agree with the smart guys on here. drifting is not fast, its only pretty. it is hell on cars. but its not any more expensive than properly setting up an auto-x car. im sure someone will mention the cost of tires but i havent paid for tires in 3 years. just hit up tire shops and ask for take-offs. they give them away since they have to pay some schmuk to take them otherwise.

 

ill try to answer more questions but guys, please. be adults and show respect to us humble drivers.

 

also to sick620: you do know thats a cartoon right? you can sure slide around while trying to race but you will lose. ive seen every initial d episode, read every manga and even own the shitty chinese live action movie. dont go racing around in mountains. you will wreck. you will fuck your shit up and you will probably see jail time. and thats if you're lucky and not kill anyone. these vintage pos 510s cant handle downhill high speeds without some serious suspension and brake upgrades.

Edited November 11, 2009 by derek

[NorCalDime]

I think you're confusing the proven technique of "trail-braking" with the concept of drifting. Two VERY different things. Drifting a corner will not guarantee you anything but SLOWER.

 

In trail braking, you enter hotter than you should and use the very minimal slide (ie drag) to slow you down then recover and exit faster. Works great. Is it drifting? Absolutely not.

 

Go to any autocross. Drift the course, then drive the course. You will find drifting is NOT, I REPEAT NOT the way to go fast.

 

Yeah but trail braking is there to transfer weight to front tires to reduce understeer, not ment to have you start sliding the rear out.

 

The drifting technique of brake drifting is very simular except you capitalize on that forward weight transfer and either throttle in to break the rear loose our turn harder into the turn to get the rear out.

 

But yeah +1 its gonna be slower

[datzenmike]

Well the closest to drifting I've done is live in Ontario and drive in the winters so you guys hash it out. I 'feel' that drifting a corner is slower than performance driving a corner. SICK620 glad you're keeping your cool about this mutual disagreement on drifting. It's no surprise that I'm not a fan but being cool about it allows room for serious discussion. I agree with you about all the wannabe kids with more balls than brains and that there is a serious side to it. Just not my thing.

[Dime Dave]

If you take the "judging" factor out of drifting and go strickly on time its called road racing. If excess oversteer makes a car faster, every class of asphalt racecar would driving that way.

 

Never saw an F1 driver hazing the rear tires all the way around the track get on the podium.

 

I think what they put into drift car tires to make colored smoke is killing off brain cells.

Edited November 11, 2009 by Dime Dave

[datzenmike]

Colored smoke??? WTF? They do that???? Oh man, ....drifting is getting like NASCAR with the fireworks and glitter.

Edited November 11, 2009 by datzenmike

[derek]

yes there is one company that added colored smoke. the tires are not legal in competition though and are very expensive anyway. and dave.. the speed is just one part of judging.

[Dime Dave]

I will be the first to say that drift drivers at the top of their sport exhibit some of the best car control of any drivers around. Tanner Foust does a terrific job in a rally car.

 

But I have a problem when people think that "drifting" a corner is the fastest way around one. In my 30 plus years of auto racing, NEVER, I repeat NEVER!!! has a car made faster lap-times on asphalt by "drifting" into, thru or exiting a corner.

 

And I do stand by my statement that there must be brain damaging effects from colored tire smoke.

[JDM510]

^^^ words spoken from a tru racer!!!!

[derek]

I will be the first to say that drift drivers at the top of their sport exhibit some of the best car control of any drivers around. Tanner Foust does a terrific job in a rally car.

 

But I have a problem when people think that "drifting" a corner is the fastest way around one. In my 30 plus years of auto racing, NEVER, I repeat NEVER!!! has a car made faster lap-times on asphalt by "drifting" into, thru or exiting a corner.

 

And I do stand by my statement that there must be brain damaging effects from colored tire smoke.

 

i agree with you wholeheartedly. i have never inhaled colored smoke though and im glad i havent, given that statement.

[Dime Dave]

Derek,

Glad I could help. There are some times in life when you just shouldn't inhale. :cool::cool::cool:

[sssr20det510]

I agree but sometimes it just looks like an art. Most of you have seen this but it my fav drift video

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KmAYHUuqe78&feature=related

[sick620]

poop

Edited December 5, 2021 by sick620

[sick620]

poop

Edited December 5, 2021 by sick620

[sssr20det510]

they posted a video of a 510 drifting so yes they can, if i was looking for a datsun to drift id prob pick up a 280z they are cheaper and parts are easy to find. Do you already have a 510 ???

[sick620]

poop

Edited December 5, 2021 by sick620