Stock 510 Fuse Box and Under Dash Wiring Harness

[Goosie_the_xiii]

I need a little help. I have been chasing wiring gremlins for a few months now and finally have the time to sit down and look. I've got a couple of questions, and hopefully y'all can help me.

 

1. Can someone take a photo of the back of their stock 510 fuse box?  I am not getting power to terminals 1, 2, 3, 5, 6, & 7. I want to make sure they are in the right place (picture attached).

 

Backstory: (Bare with me)

 

I bought a dime roller a couple of years ago and have slowly been working on it. The previous owner stripped it, painted it, and never put it back together after painting it.

 

Since then, I swapped a KA24DE and trans, and now I am getting around to the wiring. I have a Wiring Specialties S13 harness for the motor. I ordered it so long ago, and at the time, I did not get the KA24DE Datsun harness that they sell. Since the order was so long ago, they wouldn't take the return or trade for the Datsun harness. Through some research on the forums, I found that I could use the JBC CAN/AM fuse box and the original 510 wiring harness in combination with the s13 harness. 

 

So I now have the JBC CAN/AM fuse box that I have been trying to connect to, but still not able to get power to the box. I have been having issues for the past couple of months. 

 

After searching the forums and talking to some of the members and Jeff, I got a lot of advice but was still not able to get power. I replaced fusible links (just in case), checked fuses, and bought a multimeter and a test light. 

 

Following IceHouse's diagram for the KA swap, I have been chasing this B/W wire issue for a few months. I was not getting power to the B/W wire in the engine bay harenss connected to the 510 fuse box when the key is on. I purchased a new ignition assembly, tried again, but still no power. 

 

Now having time to sit down and dive in. I checked under the dash where the engine harness connects with the dash harness. With the test light and the battery connected, when the key is in the ON position, there is power to the B/W wire coming from the IGN. But there is still no power to the B/W in the engine compartment or the B/W connected to the original 510 fuse box.

 

Diving deeper, I see that the engine harness wire (female plug) that it connects is B/Y. Following that B/Y wire, it runs into the bay, across the front to where the wiper motor should be (per diagram). That B/Y wire has power when the key is turned to the ON position and no power when the key is OFF.  So now I see that the B/W (from the IGN) doesn't match up with the B/W going to the original 510 fuse box. I am not sure if a previous owner tried to repin the harness or not. 

I compare the harness in the car to a spare harness that came with the car (which looks like it has seen better days). That harness is different as well, but the B/W would connect in the correct place. The spare harness B/W would lead to the B/W on the original 510 fuse box.

 

So, my second question is, has anyone had issues with wires on the factory harness not being in the factory spot (per diagram and possibly an unmolested harness)? If you have had this issue with the wires not being correct, did you rewire and repin through the connectors or did you just cut the wire, put new terminals on the ends and connect them individually (outside of the plug)?

 

[KELMO]

Mine looks to be a bit more of a mess than yours, but here are a few from my '72 wagon.

 

I could probably get some better ones but need another set of hands.

[Goosie_the_xiii]

@KELMO Thanks for the photos. Since you have a wagon, Could you look at the connectors under the dash to see if your BW wires line up together at the connector?

 

I imagine it's the same, but I haven't done any research on the comparison of wagons to sedans. 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Maybe that side of the fuse panel gets power from fusible links, which may have been removed when you did the motor swap...?

[Goosie_the_xiii]

@Stoffregen Motorsports This is the diagram that I have been using. I only see two fusible links, the alternator (W& RW) and the fuse box (BW). I still have the engine bay harness running through the bay since it has the lights, wiper, alternator, and starter. 

 

 

[banzai510(hainz)]

be honest they dont look bad.

 

But I had installed one from a different car and it wouldnt work after it was smashed. Frank oput a better one in he said .If I remeber soem lights didnt work or something and put the orginal back in then worked fine. Only different was the copper bar underneath it feed more circuts

[KELMO]

21 hours ago, Goosie_the_xiii said:

@KELMO Thanks for the photos. Since you have a wagon, Could you look at the connectors under the dash to see if your BW wires line up together at the connector?

 

I imagine it's the same, but I haven't done any research on the comparison of wagons to sedans. 

I will see what I can find out. My dash is not installed at the moment.

[Goosie_the_xiii]

Copy. Thank you. 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

It looks like that side of the fuse panel gets it s power from a fusible link at the starter. See the white wire that connects to the voltage regulator and alternator? It looks like it also connects to the starter.

[Goosie_the_xiii]

@Stoffregen Motorsports That white wire is a hot wire. I have power in that area of my fuse box. It's the second column from the left, the last terminal. So I know I have power there. Just not sure where the power for the other ones on the top right get power. 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

15 hours ago, Goosie_the_xiii said:

@Stoffregen Motorsports That white wire is a hot wire. I have power in that area of my fuse box. It's the second column from the left, the last terminal. So I know I have power there. Just not sure where the power for the other ones on the top right get power. 

It looks like the blue/black wire gets power through the ignition switch, from the red/white wire, which splices into the white wire from the starter.  And I can't see the colors of the other two wires in your pic.

 

Just to be clear, the diagram shows the color of the wires once they pass through the wiring connector. The colors inside the fuse panel are not the same as the wires on the other side of the connector.

Edited November 30, 2023 by Stoffregen Motorsports

[Goosie_the_xiii]

@Stoffregen Motorsports copy. 

So my issue right now is that from that diagram, it shows the BW wire at the under-dash connector (by the passenger door) is connected with a BY wire. Now from looking, the corresponding BW wire leads to the fuse box. 

When I turn the key to the on position, I have no power to the BW wire in the fuse box. I do, however, have power to the BY wire that runs across the engine bay to the "washer motor". It seems like for me to get power to the fuse box, I will need to cut and reconnect those wires to the wires they "should" correspond with. I have a spare harness, it is a little mangled, but if I were to plug it in, the BW would connect with the BW under the dash. 

 

I am just not sure if anyone else has had issues with wiring not being the same from one harness to the next. 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Yes, I have had similar issues. Mostly they are the same, but there are a few differences over the years, and depending on which trans it came with.

 

Sounds like maybe your harness just has a break in the connection. The factory used W crimp wire splices, and the wire can become cracked at the connection and break.

 

[fiveoneO]

To my knowledge there are at least 3 different 510 fuse blocks, which would mean there are at least 3 different wiring harnesses, probably more. I think the 68 had its own unique fuse block, I've seen 2 different fuse blocks in 69's and I think all the 70's cars had the same (but there could be more). You can make any fuse block work with any harness, but you'll have to rewire some things. I'd try and find a wiring diagram that matches the harness you have, then you'll know which wires you have to move for the fuse block you have.

[yenpit]

Have you verified that the engine compartment harness & the dash harness actually match together, by part #'s or by matching the color coded wires at the big junction under the right side of the dash?  All 3 main harness sections had a white plastic tag with a part# & a date code.  The engine compartment harness tag was under the radiator, ran across the lower rad core support rail............right where it got "weathered", so most of the engine compartment harness tags are missing.  Most of the dash & tail part# tags are intact, cuz not out in the weather.  The Sedan dash & tail harnesses are Sedan only.  The Wagon dash & tail harnesses are Wagon only, they do not interchange.  The manual vs auto engine compartment harnesses are different, but can be easily modified to work, as long as the "generation" is the same.  The 1968 harnesses are 1968 only.  The 1969 harnesses are 1969 only. The first 6 mo's of the 1970 model year was the first 6 mo's only (this is the one that catches a lot of people of guard).  The later 1970-1972 harnesses are basically the same, only adding more emission crap, but that wiring stands alone & can be simply unplugged and/or removed.  The 1973 harnesses are 1973 only.  Some years ago, I had to replace a burned early 1970 dash harness.  I plugged in a 1971 harness..........yes it plugged in, but the wiring was NOT the same & I could never get it to work.  I ended up finding a correct early 1970 dash harness after 6 mo's of searching, did a few minor repairs (not alterations), plugged it in & it all worked. 

 

The only wiring diagrams that are correct, are Paolo's hand drawn, color coded diagrams.  Paolo never made the early 1970 or the 1973.  None of the Haynes, Clymers, Chilton diagrams are correct...............none of them.  They can help in a bind, but there are typically missing wires/color codes, which can be very cornfuzing & frustrating.

Edited December 10, 2023 by yenpit

[yenpit]

PS there are 3 different fuse boxes............1968 only, 1969-maybe 1970/71 & 1970/71-1973.  Sedan vs Wagon are the same.

[Icehouse]

Wish I was closer I would come help out.  You're going to need to check every wire and re pin some plugs.  I've had to do that before.  For sure some Palo diagrams would help out. 

[Goosie_the_xiii]

@fiveoneO & @yenpit Thanks for the wealth of knowledge! This information is exactly what I needed to know.

 

I'm not sure what year the engine harness is. I bought the car and parts after it was painted. The body harness (tail, cabin, and dash) was still in the car. The only harness that was removed was the engine harness and the bay was painted. So I am taking someone else's clutter and trying to put it back together. Nothing was tagged. 

But knowing there are multiple harnesses within that same body style throughout the years helps.  

 

Also, all the tags on the harnesses were weathered and caked on with grease and dirt. I ended up taking the old tape off to see where the wires were running. 

[Goosie_the_xiii]

Thank you all that helped with this issue. I finally got the CAN/AM to light up and also have the original fuse box wired up!

 

With the advice from @fiveoneO and @yenpit on the different harnesses, I was able to wire mine up to match what is under the dash and now the three relays light up. I also have headlights running but I will have to go back and check on those later on. 

 

This has been months in the making but little progress like this definitely helps keep the build and motivation going. 

Thanks, @Stoffregen Motorsports, @KELMO, @Icehouse, and @banzai510(hainz) for giving me advice as well along the way. Your advice did not go unnoticed. 

 

LFG!!!

 

 

[banzai510(hainz)]

since your headlamps work I would just get a H4 harness and that willl take up the current draw and wouldnot have to worry about the fuse boox taking up a lot of current. the H4 harness would take that up

[Z23T]

Here is a link to the archived Dime Quarterly articles. Volume 3 Issue 1 describes how to wire in relays to power the headlights on a 510. This modification allows you to use more modern/powerful headlamps without melting down the stock wiring.

 

https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/0ByCvxnHNk90SYzc4N2E1MWEtMzg0MC00YTE4LTkxZGQtM2RjODA5ODA1YjU1?resourcekey=0-KaGDzn2MdEPAVOsa5PeUSQ

Edited December 18, 2023 by Z23T