WagDatto Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 As I understand it, the stock 510 wagon axle will always be an open differential UNLESS you A) weld (or "spool") it, causing extra stress on the axle shafts and splines, as well as making for VERY uncomfortable turns and turning radius... or B) drop in a roadster LSD, which are often very hard to find and expensive when/if you do... The roadster LSD's are what I'm curious about, since I have absolutely no knowledge on the subject. Are they a viscous or clutch-type LSD? What kind of gearing do they have? Similar/same as the stock 'goon? Are they a DIRECT replacement to the differential, or do new axle shafts need to be obtained? What are people's experiences with this, and are there any other options that DO NOT require customizing a new axle to drop in (mustang, rx-7 or otherwise). `Sean Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 (edited) OK... the '82-'83 S-11 200sx uses an H-190 rear end just like the '72 Goon and all of the 620 trucks. The 200sx uses the same side gears as the 620 so it must have the thicker 29 spline axles like the truck. Bear with me... If the 200sx axles (4 bolt rims) are the same length as the Goon, or if longer they could be shortened and re-splined. This would allow any '73 and up 620 or 2wd '80 720 differential to be used. I do know that there are LSDs for the H-190. Bonus... the 200sx axles also came with disc brakes. Depending on year the 620 diff came with 4.11, 4.375, and 4.625 ratios. If any of these are too low just swap the Goon gears on when you install the after market LSD. Edited February 1, 2009 by datzenmike Quote Link to comment
bonvo Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 convert to irs :lol: but seriously mick you are the datto god lol Quote Link to comment
Dime Dave Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 (edited) The '82-'83 200SX axle housing (50.75" outside of the bearing housing to outside of bearing housing) is wider that the Wagon axle (at 48"). The H190 200SX splines are 30MM x 29T, the 510 Wagon/Roadster are 24mm x 23T. It has been a while since I have had a 200SX axle apart, but if the axles are made the same as other Nissans, the splines appear to be "rolled". By this I mean the spline section is mechanically "raised" or possibly forged into splines not machined as is done when resplining. The axle diameter next to the splines is smaller than required to machine new splines and will need to be cut off. To respline an axle with the same splines, the axle will need to be cut back to a point where the diameter is equal or larger than the spline OD. Then it can be turned to the OD needed and the new splines can be machined into the axle. On a H165 200SX axle this means cutting off 3" from each axle to respline the axle. This requires the housing be narrowed 6". If the H190 200SX axles are similar, 6" narrower will be too much. The '82-'83 200SX housing could be used in the wagon without shortening it. You would need to use positive offset rear wheels. The 200SX housing width is 2.75" wider than the 510 Wagon. The wheels would need to have roughly 1.375" (or 35mm) more positive offset than those originally used. The 200SX H190 offers a couple advantages, one is LSD rears from H190 P/U can be used. Precision Gear (recently sold) used to offer a clutch type LSD for the H190 w/truck splines (30mm x 29T) and It has disc brakes that have an emergency brake built in. There are also some 30mm x 29T truck based H190 Detroit Lockers still around as well. While it may seem easier to find a Roadster LSD center (very rare and desirable) that bolts right into a Wagon rear, the cost ($1000+) and the likely gear ratio, 4.37+ means a new gear set on top of that cost. It makes the cost/effort of using a 200SX seem almost viable. Hope this helps. Edited February 1, 2009 by Dime Dave Error on 200SX years Quote Link to comment
Z-train Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 Sorta related....did any of the live axles come with sway bars? Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 1, 2009 Report Share Posted February 1, 2009 (edited) Yes but the '80-'83 has coil spring suspensions... might/will need some mods. Dime Dave that, is some awesome tech. Edited February 1, 2009 by datzenmike Quote Link to comment
ppeters914 Posted February 2, 2009 Report Share Posted February 2, 2009 Roadster LSD's are pretty much unobtanium. Any that are around get snatched up immediately by the roadster racing community. Quote Link to comment
WagDatto Posted February 6, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 The reason I asked is because I have the opportunity to buy a roadster LSD. However, I was worried about gearing, and how it would affect RPM's in different gears. I'm a total diff NOOB so any input is appreciated. Is it geared the same as a 510, or would it throw me off of highway cruising even more than the car already is? Quote Link to comment
ppeters914 Posted February 6, 2009 Report Share Posted February 6, 2009 The reason I asked is because I have the opportunity to buy a roadster LSD. However, I was worried about gearing, and how it would affect RPM's in different gears. I'm a total diff NOOB so any input is appreciated. Is it geared the same as a 510, or would it throw me off of highway cruising even more than the car already is? Not positive, but I believe the standard NISMO Roadster LSD was 4.11. There were other ratios available, too....I think. Sorry, not a racer. Quote Link to comment
69FJWagon Posted February 7, 2009 Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 (edited) The LSD has nothing to do with gearing it takes place of your spider gears in the rear end, If the LSD is like the ones for the trucks they will exept any gear ratio with the proper bolt size for the carrier the trucks have 2 kinds one for gears from 3.70 through 3.90 or 4.11 and another from either 3.90 or 4.11 through 4.88 , if you have the chance at an roadster lsd for a good price GET IT!!! I thing the axle splines are the same as a wagon and if it comes as a complete 3rd member (Whole center drop out with LSD and ring and pinion) then it would become a 45 minute job to change it out. really simple job did one at the track for a mini super truck at stockton 99 raceway in 20 minutes with 3 people working Clayton Edited February 7, 2009 by 69FJWagon Quote Link to comment
WagDatto Posted February 7, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 7, 2009 Yeah, it is a complete drop in, and I know it's insanely easy. The question is more whether or not it's worth it. I've broken two axle shafts in the history of my KA swap, and I've been wondering if it'd be worth doing something beefier with some disks on it. I think that'd be the better choice for me, at least... The price is average, I'd maybe be able to talk him down a few hundred since he has no use for it, but even IF I got it for 4-500, it'd be about the same price as a whole new axle, ya dig? Quote Link to comment
qship510 Posted February 8, 2009 Report Share Posted February 8, 2009 The reason I asked is because I have the opportunity to buy a roadster LSD. However, I was worried about gearing, and how it would affect RPM's in different gears. I'm a total diff NOOB so any input is appreciated. Is it geared the same as a 510, or would it throw me off of highway cruising even more than the car already is? Be sure it is real, and disassemble it and check the clutches and steels to be sure it isn't burnt up. I know a guy who has 2, and he turned down $1500 2 years ago for the spare one. UberRare. Quote Link to comment
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