Cold air intake?

[Dean720Ada]

So i found out K&N filters makes a cold air intake plenums for the weber 32/36. What you guys think about running a cold air intake? Here's the site... http://www.knfilters.com/racing/plenum.aspx?pkid=722571&rw=1

[mhub91]

God dammit.

 

FUCK NO. These things (cold air intake, that is.) are a complete waste of money, man. C'mon!

 

You really think throwing some after market cone filter on will ...ad up to 16HP! Pfffft. NO.

 

Recollection of my tech school days .... we put a  supercharged Honda S2000 on the dyno and threw every-single after market bolt on you could think of.

 

Guess what happened? 

 

K&N 'cold air intake' piping and cone filter kit made the Honda S2000 lose a total of 7HP!

 

Guess what the Apex'i header back exhaust with test pipe and high-flow cat in conjunction with the K&N filter did? a total loss of 17HP!

 

....Now, if you could route the intake to LITERALLY be cold air, ie. out of a headlight bucket so cool air is forced into the plenum... sure? You may get an increase. 

[mhub91]

Oh hey, you're a local  :rofl:

[Radim]

Two summers ago, My truck would run like complete shit was one of the hottest summers in years.
The "cold air set-up" substantially increased performance during the rest of the summer.
I still have the intake, tubing, and headlight funnel I shittly made too, weather or not it has REAL performance gains I'm not sure, but it DEFINITELY made my shit run better.

 

[mhub91]

"...headlight funnel..."

 

 

Very important part.

 

Like I said, If you made it come out the headlight bucket, I'm sure it would have a positive effect. Don't run it inside to your hot engine bay like these Honda kids do, though.

[Tristin]

There are a couple of setups out there. One is a "ram air" style and the other is "cold air" setup. Mostly everyone calls any cone filter and cheap China pipe a CAI.

 

The ram air intake is basically a small length of tube with a cone filter that eliminates the stock airbox. Various models of various manufactures for cars have more restrictive stock airboxes so there can be some small gains in running a ram air. The cons to a ram air is that by eliminating the stock box, youre now sucking up hot engine bay air. You can gain some power due to a less restrictive path for airflow, but the heat can screw you.

 

The cold air setup is usually a longer tube that sticks the filter directly in the path of fresh, cold air. It can be to a headlight funnel, naca duct, or a lower section of fender well. The colder air is more dense which packs more oxygen into the chamber producing higher HP numbers. Numbers will fluctuate with outside temps and with whatever setup youre running. The problem with those, is your filter is usually exposed to the elements which can result in sucking up water during heavy rains or if youre driving though puddles. 

[mhub91]

There are a couple of setups out there. One is a "ram air" style and the other is "cold air" setup. Mostly everyone calls any cone filter and cheap China pipe a CAI. The ram air intake is basically a small length of tube with a cone filter that eliminates the stock airbox. Various models of various manufactures for car have more restrictive stock airboxes so there can be some small gains in running a ram air. The cold air setup is usually a longer tube that sticks the filter directly in the path of fresh, cold air. It can be to a headlight funnel, naca duct, or a lower section of fender well. The colder air is more dense which packs more oxygen into the chamber producing higher HP numbers. Numbers will fluctuate with outside temps and with whatever setup youre running. The problem with those, is your filter is usually exposed to the elements which can result i sucking up water during heavy rains or if youre driving though puddles. 

 

Yay! Someone else gets it!  :thumbup:

[Tristin]

Haha caught me in the middle of an edit for readability.  :sleep:

[Dean720Ada]

Lol i came across this idea. Didnt got to get all mad;) lol. But thank you. That's why i come to this forum for suggestions, before i go out and buy something stupid.... But thanks for your opinions. Now that i know. I wont buy it....i live in port orchard by the way...

[mhub91]

Lol i came across this idea. Didnt got to get all mad;) lol. But thank you. That's why i come to this forum for suggestions, before i go out and buy something stupid.... But thanks for your opinions. Now that i know. I wont buy it....i live in port orchard by the way...

 

Lol, we don't get made at YOU! I get mad that these companies try to swindle people, really. It's fucked up, in my opinion. 

[mhub91]

For example..... PLEASe TELL ME HOW THIS FITS AN L20B?!?!!  :angry:

 

http://www.jcwhitney.com/edelbrock-pro-flo-xt-universal-intake-manifold-50-state-legal/p3052371.jcwx?filterid=c2034d1668y1979g2u0j1

[Dean720Ada]

I have no idea how that could fit. And your right some of these companies are bs...

[Tristin]

For example..... PLEASe TELL ME HOW THIS FITS AN L20B?!?!!  :angry:

 

http://www.jcwhitney.com/edelbrock-pro-flo-xt-universal-intake-manifold-50-state-legal/p3052371.jcwx?filterid=c2034d1668y1979g2u0j1

 

I like the "advertised HP gains" bullet. :rofl: You can advertise anything you want... doesnt mean the facts will back it up. 

[mhub91]

I like the "advertised HP gains" bullet. :rofl: You can advertise anything you want... doesnt mean the facts will back it up. 

 

Yeah, right? 30HP for $500? ILL BUY IT!

[Dawa]

slap in one of these funnels 

(they make square ones for the 720 btw)

and slap on one of those plenums

 

and then get some dryer duct or whatever to connect the two

and youre good to go!

[mhub91]

slap in one of these funnels 

(they make square ones for the 720 btw)

and slap on one of those plenums

 

and then get some dryer duct or whatever to connect the two

and youre good to go!

 

 

Bingo!

 

Btw, where'd you get that funnel? Interested in getting one for my '79 510

[Tristin]

Or install two funnels for twice the powah!

 

[Dawa]

spectre pn 9789 i think i found it cheapest at autoplicity.com

 

id like to add that i dont have a plenum nor ducting hooked up yet, but i dont mind tellin ya 

that i did indeed reap benefits from the funnel alone. 

[Aibast]

Cold air intake is a bad idea in the winter on carbed cars - have any of you ever seen frozen carb in the middle of nowhere in the middle of night with a blizzard. If you experience that you know its a bad bad idea.

 

With a funnel - get a carb full of snow. Or waterlock your engine when a truck passes you and happens to hit a big big buddle.

 

Have fun.

[datzenmike]

Cold air works best on fuel injected cars that accurately and automatically adjust the fuel air ratio for best performance. Carbs... not so much. The after market industry is worth billions and caters to the ignorant and gullible. Many items afford one or two hp or fractions of but are at the ultra high end of the rev range, which on a race car can mean the difference between winning or loosing. On a street car, they are along for the ride.

[Z-train]

Physics dictates that lowering the temperature of the intake charge will produce more power.How much power? That is vehicle by vehicle debate-able point.Now are a lot of the "bolt -on pipes" a joke? Definately.

 

 

On the trucks, something like this could be fabbed.I know it'll work in a 620.

[Dawa]

Cold air works best on fuel injected cars that accurately and automatically adjust the fuel air ratio for best performance. Carbs... not so much. The after market industry is worth billions and caters to the ignorant and gullible. Many items afford one or two hp or fractions of but are at the ultra high end of the rev range, which on a race car can mean the difference between winning or loosing. On a street car, they are along for the ride.

thats interesting because i just read someone make the point of the complete opposite. 

they said that it works even better for carbs because the computer CANT adjust for temp change, etc

[Dawa]

shoulda multi quoted

 

Physics dictates that lowering the temperature of the intake charge will produce more power.How much power? That is vehicle by vehicle debate-able point.Now are a lot of the "bolt -on pipes" a joke? Definately.



On the trucks, something like this could be fabbed.I know it'll work in a 620.

^ that exactly. thats what im going to do. 

one can take from either the front of the vechicle but also from the base of the windshield as well.

you can google search some aerodynamic/flow photos of different cars that show that both of these areas are great

pressure zones/etc to put an INtake.

 

what do you do in the snow or rain? idk, aha

i was thinking that maybe one could introduce a trap door in the plenum or piping to let you just suck engine bay air

at that time, as well as a way to 'close' the 'cold air' induction hole. 

 

like i said, at this time i havent made ducting or plenum, and the other day it started to rain down there in san diego (rarity)

and i had to drive the truck. i was worried! aha. for my application i wasnt worried about ingesting water (because lack

of ducting straight to carb) but i was worried about water introduced to the engine bay, especially because the dizzy

is pretty much right behind the funnel. turned out all good THIS TIME

[Tristin]

thats interesting because i just read someone make the point of the complete opposite. 

they said that it works even better for carbs because the computer CANT adjust for temp change, etc

 

It varies by the type of ECU programming. Normal MAF systems will work exactly the same in regards to cold air vs. hot air. MAFs are built to ignore temperature and pressure when calculating air volume so it gives the same fuel for both hot and cold air. By cramming in the same amount of fuel with colder air, the MAF engine will produce higher numbers. 

 

If running speed density, then the ECU will adjust fuel for changes in temperature so on a base tune, almost anything below heat soak temperatures will be the same with any change in temperature. 

 

 

what do you do in the snow or rain? idk, aha

i was thinking that maybe one could introduce a trap door in the plenum or piping to let you just suck engine bay air

at that time, as well as a way to 'close' the 'cold air' induction hole. 

 

Having anything but a smooth pipe will induce quite the air disturbance in intake path. Thats the exact reason that people ditch the stock airboxes for ram or CAI (not including the ricer fanboys doing it purely based off racecar status). There would have to be some tests to see if the disturbances would negate the positive effects of the colder air. I have no idea. I think adding a water trap is just way too much work for what its worth though personally. 

[mhub91]

Carb'd cars love moist climate. I once read somewhere that a small increase to moisture in the air (fog, mist, etc.) really does add performance to a carb'd vehicle to the fact that the molecular amount of water seriously heightens the violence of the flame front due the fact that water can be compressed several times more than air/fuel before it will ignite. Granted this is on a molecular level... We all know what hydro lock is :-D