synthetic or regular for our old engines?

[KlassicMotion]

The issue of ZDDP is a major concern.  I've seen a few freshly rebuilt push rod V8 engines that didn't run any ZDDP upon break-in, and the cam was wiped out withing 10 minutes of running.  I run roller cams any chance I get.  This eliminates most of the need for ZDDP.

 

Here is another opinion:

 

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/switch-to-synthetic-oil1.htm

[HRH]

ZDDP, we've have many discussion on this.  For breaking engines in, it's important.  Especially small block Chevys with flat tappet cams and pushrods.  L motors don't care.  They don't need ZDDP other than break in.  I've NEVER wiped out a cam in any L motor.  Follow the break in procedures, break it in, and drive.

 

Also, any diesel oil will have higher levels of zinc and other protectants.  15w40.  Diesel oils haven't faced the scrutiny of conventional gasoline oils due to the heavy duty nature.

[john510]

If a rebuilt engine wiped out a cam in 10 minutes it wasnt because of the oil.Probably incorrect assembly or lack of oil pressure.I dont use synthetic oils and probably never will.I think the key to a lasting engine is oil changes.My l20b gets either the Shell rotella or Mobil delvac 15w-40 diesel oils,they have zddp.I got 385,000 miles out of a Toyota truck using regular oil,many different brands.The truck i drive now has 265,000 + on it,again regular oil.Frequent oil changes are probably more important than what oil you use.

[Str8_69]

 .Frequent oil changes are probably more important than what oil you use.

 

+1

 

My ol' man always said, "It don't matter what oil you run, as long as you change it often."

 

His cars always lasted forever.

[nerdistmonk]

yes it isnt the oil choice, its the changing interval, you could use canola oil as long as you change it before it breaks down (and canola oil would not last long, 5 to 10 miles tops...so i wouldnt use it), because once oil breaks down it has the lubricating properties of tap water. (i.e none)

 

I went to synthetic because its cleaner and it captures dirt and sludge that would normally be in my engine, thats about it.

[KlassicMotion]

Running Diesel oils is a whole other discussion too.  Just because they have ZDDP, doen't mean they are made to run in gas engines.  You would be safer with Redline racing oil.  Or better yet, just put the ZDDP additive in your conventional oil and your done.

 

For what it's worth,   For every person that says they've had success running one oil, there is probably an equal amount of people that have had negative results running that same oil....

 

For instance, I won't run Penzoil.  I've seen Penzoil engines with consistant oil changes be very dirty when you open them up.  My machine shop has said the same thing with the engines they've seen over the years.  But then you will talk to Joe Blow, and he's loves Penzoil....

 

I used to be a die hard Castrol guy, but now I'm runnning Valvoline VR-1 Synthetic in my newer daily driver's, but still using Catrol GTX in my older engines....  Take it for what it's worth. 

 

Like I said, people's opinion on which oil to run is like asking what Pro Sport team you should root for.....

 

 

I change my Synthetics every 6000 miles... There is another theory that while the Synthetic oil will last 10,000 miles, the additives in the oil break down a lot sooner. 

 

I'm running Conventional in my L20B wtih an oil change every 3000 miles. 

[nerdistmonk]

pretty much boils down to its your vehicle do as you see fit, no two guys will handle their datto the same way and you could spend all day arguing about whats the best way, some people might not agree with my using non-nissan parts in my nissan for example but im a believer in function over form, (i got a 1979 jeep fuel filter for example, and all of my fuel system is aftermarket)

 

In the end if your vehicle gets you where you need to go, then it doesnt matter because thats its only purpose, its only reason to exist is to serve its owner, your datto doesnt want to cause you grief but help you get your work done.

[captaingamez]

the additives do break down a lot sooner supposedly, however that is why they say you are supposed to run one of those longer interval oil filters, they have a gel insert in them that disintegrates into the oil and keeps the oil fresh.

 

 

I know, I thought that was some crazy shit too when I first heard it, but look it up, its true.

[nerdistmonk]

I just change it out at 3,000 even if they say it works fine up to 6,000. If for any reason just so ill have some excuse to pop the hood on my nissan and work on it :) (though sometimes it does a fine job of keeping me busy)

[datzenmike]

what do you use for break in oil?

Anything you like but synthetic. It's too slippery and the motor won't wear or 'break in'.

[lostforawhile]

everyone I know swears by Brad Penn oil,  it's actually the original green Kendall oil, they bought the refineries,wells,everything, and make it just like the original stuff,  it has the proper zinc etc in it

[lostforawhile]

http://www.penngrade1.com/

[a.d._510_n_ok]

 

In the end if your vehicle gets you where you need to go, then it doesnt matter because thats its only purpose, its only reason to exist is to serve its owner, your datto doesnt want to cause you grief but help you get your work done.

 

that is dat-ZEN, sir!

 

I change oil every 5k on everything at my place ('80 510, '64 Fairlane, '03 F150) and am pretty open-minded  about oil brands and will run synthetic if it is on sale but I agree that frequency of changes is much more critical than using premium oil at every change.

 

I also run only WIX filters. I would rather jack off with a handful of gravel than run a fram oil filter. I had one clog on me on a 225 slant six in a '64 Dart and cost me an engine at a time when I could ill-afford to replace it.

[lostforawhile]

that is dat-ZEN, sir!

 

I change oil every 5k on everything at my place ('80 510, '64 Fairlane, '03 F150) and am pretty open-minded  about oil brands and will run synthetic if it is on sale but I agree that frequency of changes is much more critical than using premium oil at every change.

 

I also run only WIX filters. I would rather jack off with a handful of gravel than run a fram oil filter. I had one clog on me on a 225 slant six in a '64 Dart and cost me an engine at a time when I could ill-afford to replace it.

definitly, ever cut open a fram? there's a reason they sell them at walmart, cheapest filter they can get there hands on, wix in EVERYTHING, I have heard from plenty of hard core engine guys that the Brad Penn oil is the shit for older engines

[nerdistmonk]

definitly, ever cut open a fram? there's a reason they sell them at walmart, cheapest filter they can get there hands on, wix in EVERYTHING

 

 

teehee....yeah well i heard fram went down the crapper approx 2 minutes after installing a fram on my truck....so the fella has a fram on him for the time being, also i was looking up some 'zddp' enhanced oil and i notice one thing out of the window, its all racing oil so idk about using that in a dd.

 

though i am thinking about draining the truck getting some new oil and a new wix filter.

[lostforawhile]

teehee....yeah well i heard fram went down the crapper approx 2 minutes after installing a fram on my truck....so the fella has a fram on him for the time being, also i was looking up some 'zddp' enhanced oil and i notice one thing out of the window, its all racing oil so idk about using that in a dd.

 

though i am thinking about draining the truck getting some new oil and a new wix filter.

the brad penn works fine in daily drivers the hot rod guys run it, it says "racing" oil because this lets them get around the EPA mandate to remove the zinc, they can't sell it with zinc as a regular oil 

[nerdistmonk]

i think ill get some lucas oil 10w30 synthetic with zddp in it  (just rolls off your tongue), man 3 oil changes in a month this truck is spoiled rotten, $1,000 in parts all done in 18 days hasnt had to even break a sweat yet, its biggest work load was a 85lb dresser whoopy doo.

 

Who am i kidding this truck _is_ spoiled...i oil the door hinges and moving parts including the A-arms 3 times a month....ha....this truck eats better than i do, nothing but 89 octane + stabil for it (mainly due to all that ethanol they keep mixing in the fuel, which is a big scam in and of itself but thats for another thread).

 

 

edit: im 2 steps shy of just wiping the fenders with a diaper 3 times a week hahaha, and it would be on its 3rd oil change, it got one back when i got the truck, but then i needed a gasket for the oil pan so i drained it, now its on #2 with lucas oil.

[Boaty]

FWIW, I ran and run STP oil treatment. Simply because it is a ZDDP additive. Kind of thick, I guess... but never had any problems with it, and it cleans things as well. Found that out when I poured the remnants of an old bottle on my OLD L20B with the valve cover off... was doing a valve adjustment. Went inside, took shower, went to sleep.. came out next day, everywhere the STP touched was now shiny and clean, all the buildup was gone. Ran it pretty religiously since that point. Even in my KA - with it, start ups are less noisy. Without it, kind of rattly. 5w30 probably doesn't assist that in summer.

And it's cheap.

[KlassicMotion]

definitly, ever cut open a fram? there's a reason they sell them at walmart, cheapest filter they can get there hands on, wix in EVERYTHING, I have heard from plenty of hard core engine guys that the Brad Penn oil is the shit for older engines

 

Why yes I have.  I did a demonstration for my Car Club.  I went to all the local parts stores and bought every different filter they had for a 1977 Chevy 350 (I just figured that would be a cheap generic filter).

 

I will just start a new posting to tell my findings.

 

http://community.ratsun.net/topic/56482-oil-filter-comparison/

[maltese]

I run Lucas Hot Rod and Classic Car 10w40, with a Bosch filter. 2500 PPM ZDDP, per our Lucas rep. My L24 uses much less oil this way.

 

I'm a Lucas fan. Fuel additives, gear oil, motor oil, etc.

[KlassicMotion]

FWIW, I ran and run STP oil treatment. Simply because it is a ZDDP additive. Kind of thick, I guess... but never had any problems with it, and it cleans things as well. Found that out when I poured the remnants of an old bottle on my OLD L20B with the valve cover off... was doing a valve adjustment. Went inside, took shower, went to sleep.. came out next day, everywhere the STP touched was now shiny and clean, all the buildup was gone. Ran it pretty religiously since that point. Even in my KA - with it, start ups are less noisy. Without it, kind of rattly. 5w30 probably doesn't assist that in summer.

 

And it's cheap.

 

 

I run Lucas Hot Rod and Classic Car 10w40, with a Bosch filter. 2500 PPM ZDDP, per our Lucas rep. My L24 uses much less oil this way.

 

I'm a Lucas fan. Fuel additives, gear oil, motor oil, etc.

 

Sounds like both are worth trying.

[a.d._510_n_ok]

FWIW, I ran and run STP oil treatment. Simply because it is a ZDDP additive. Kind of thick, I guess... but never had any problems with it, and it cleans things as well. Found that out when I poured the remnants of an old bottle on my OLD L20B with the valve cover off... was doing a valve adjustment. Went inside, took shower, went to sleep.. came out next day, everywhere the STP touched was now shiny and clean, all the buildup was gone. Ran it pretty religiously since that point. Even in my KA - with it, start ups are less noisy. Without it, kind of rattly. 5w30 probably doesn't assist that in summer.

 

And it's cheap.

 

Give this stuff a try some time. It's gut slick (it take a couple of washings with Dawn Ultra to get it off your hands) and make STP look like 10w.

 

[Datsfrodo]

My ka has about 240k. I found that Pennzoil euro spec 5w40 works great! As everyone knows ka burn oil. After I switched to 5w40. I didn't have to " top off: my oil every 1k miles. I highly recommend 5w40 for ka's. As for older L motors I'd guess 10w40?