is this just a bunch of b.s???

[J.C_620]

http://www.burn-water.net/?id=froggerboings

[Phlebmaster]

Don't know.....give it a try and let us know. :lol:

 

I am not convinced though.

[datzenmike]

Look up "Snake Oil" and the conservation of energy law and you'll be way more informed than the desperate people who buy into this scam.

[420n620]

just last week I heard that u should not trust ANYTHING being sold on TV, this would fall into the same catogory but if u do decide to try it yea let us no --- but you have been warned -- good luck

[Gensaiken]

http://www.turbonator.com/

 

 

zomg guize 33% MPGEE :fu: :rolleyes:

[ggzilla]

Are those $39 LSDs any good?

[tiltnose510]

HHO. Hydroxy gas. Its a simple electrolyser that turns the water into hydrogen / Oxygen and gives the engine Hydrogen / Oxygen or Hydroxy gas as a supplemental fuel. I am currently building one to run completely on Hydroxy gas. It doen't take much to make an electrolyser. A quick experiment is to put a 9v battery in a glass of water, after a short time it will start to bubble (a small amount of) Hydroxy gas. Hydrogen is 61000 btu compared to gasoline's 24000 btu. Timing in a complete hydroxy gas engine must be retarded to about 10 after TDC because the fuel burns so fast. A supplemental Hydroxy setup will increase fuel mileage by 20 - 40%.

[ggzilla]

Yes, HHO works. It just costs more to make it than gasoline.

 

Cow Magnets will give you better fuel economy.

[datzenmike]

Cow Magnets will give you better fuel economy.

 

:lol:

 

HHO. Hydroxy gas. Its a simple electrolyser that turns the water into hydrogen / Oxygen and gives the engine Hydrogen / Oxygen or Hydroxy gas as a supplemental fuel. I am currently building one to run completely on Hydroxy gas. It doen't take much to make an electrolyser. A quick experiment is to put a 9v battery in a glass of water, after a short time it will start to bubble (a small amount of) Hydroxy gas. Hydrogen is 61000 btu compared to gasoline's 24000 btu. Timing in a complete hydroxy gas engine must be retarded to about 10 after TDC because the fuel burns so fast. A supplemental Hydroxy setup will increase fuel milage by 20 - 40%.

 

First, when you burn hydrogen and oxygen together you get ... water and heat energy. And second, in order to convert the resultant water back into the two gases that made it you would require an amount of electrical energy equal to the heat given off when burning it in the first place.

 

The Conservation of Energy Law

states that in a chemical reaction, the total amount of energy in the system remains unchanged. Energy can be transferred from one form into another but cannot be created or destroyed.

 

 

Let's imagine we have a magical motor that has no frictional losses at all and converts 100% of it's fuel energy into motion. Further lets imagine an alternator that converts mechanical motion to electricity with 100% efficiency. The output from the alternator is just over 62 amps at 12 volts or 746 watts or 1 hp. We now hook up the hho generator and it makes enough gas to burn in our motor and makes an extra hp ... which just barely runs the alternator ... which makes the gas.. and so on. Where's the gain?

 

Sorry, but you can't get something for nothing.

[mnementh666]

Random thought: Byproduct = water.

I don't think that having water condensate in your motor (any more than it already produces) would be wise.

[fiveNdime]

Mike you obviously don't believe you can make a car run on water:lol: I guess science is always right? and nobody said its 100% efficient. Just like EVERY fuel source out there it must be refined in some way or stored somehow before we can use it. Yes it does cost a fair amount of money to do so but when the build is finished a car can be completely ran on water. And yes those small systems work but they don't give you a 70% increase in gas millage....maybe 20% The "something from nothing" comment you make doesn't even make sense with this system. You have something for example WATER........and you are using high pulses of electricity to separate the Hydrogen and Oxygen. Its actually simple. I hope you don't get bent out of shape from my comment I am just trying to shed light.

 

tiltnose510 you keep doing what your doing....like myself I plan on building a full hydrogen car. Then we will see who's laughing:cool:. I can only hope more people start doing this cause it is real.

 

mnementh666 This is why you ceramic coat and use stainless parts. Like I said above it costs a fair amount of money but so does electric cars.

[tiltnose510]

I've already built a supplemental system electrolyser and a machinist friend is installing it on his truck. If there's a place to put files, I could post some good info on it.

 

 

This is a quick one of the Stan Meyers setup

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8stApCmxYEM

[datsunaholic]

Mike didn't say that you can't make a car run off water. What he is saying (and now I'm saying) is that water alone is not a potential energy source. To make water an energy source you need a chemical reaction to break the water into hydrogen and oxygen. That chemical reaction is either via a catalyst chemical, or via electricity. Every known catalyst that can chemically break water into components costs vastly more to produce than gasoline. And you still have to store both components, so that means 2 tanks.

 

For an electrical water-splitter, it takes MORE electricity to turn water into hydrogen and oxygen than you can produce by burning the hydrogen. Even if the hydrogen engine was doing nothing but run a generator to split water into hydrogen, it's not enough electical power to keep the cycle going. It takes more electrical power to split the water than can be produced by the generator running off the hydrogen. And that isn't even adding driven wheels.

 

To generate enough hydrogen to run a 100HP engine, you would need about 110KW electricity. Guess how many HP that takes to generate.

 

Yes, there are oxidizers, catalysts, etc that can make it more efficient. But none of those are inexpensive, as even the cheapest oxidizers are fairly radical alloys of aluminum that require MegaWatts of electricity to produce, and they oxidize very rapidly so they have to be changed out often- MINUTES, not hours. I did read about a liquid alloy that "solves" the oxidizing problem, but it isn't cheap- I could run my car a year on what it costs to produce a days' worth. Plus you have to clean out the byproduct. It is still far cheaper to produce and store the hydrogen for later use in a hydrogen fuel cell, than it is to produce it on the fly.

 

I've read the articles. I've seen the videos. I don't believe some of the claims of the "cheap" catalysts, and I don't believe the conspiracy theorists who claim any inventor of these "technologies" quickly disappear or are silenced.

 

The main claim in many of these so called water splitters is that there is more potential energy in the hydrogen component of water than it takes to split the water. That simply isn't true.

 

I've seen a water-catalyst hydrogen producer in action. Looks impressive, until you realize how little hydrogen is actually being produced.

[ggzilla]

you can't get something for nothing

What about all those free meals at the bars?

 

Byproduct = water

Just like a gasoline engine: Water and Carbon Dioxide come out the tailpipe .... hmmm, I don't want that.

[datzenmike]

Money for nuthing........ chicks for free!!!!!

 

I'm not bent fiveNdime, I just can't see how this will work.

[tiltnose510]

I went over all those calcs with my brother, he has his masters in engineering and has much the same view. I'm more like the "Meyers" one of the family. My brother has 12 years of UW and I started a family right out of high school and no college. He actually has said that I should pursue it but just understand these things. The thing is, this isn't new, there are several people out there already running this and Bob Boyce has been doing this with his boats since 1988. He has an old Valiant that runs on Hydroxy. There are a couple of different methods and a single cell electrolyser that "uses" 12 volts to produce gas will only generate enough to run as a supplemental fuel source. It only requires 1.24 volts power the cell and the additional voltage creates the by product of heat. Adding cells did not result in a large increase in current draw, in fact the increase in current was smaller with the addition of each cell up to a point where it leveled off. Boyce designed an electrolyser that uses a 110 volt inverter powered by the car's alternator and uses 61 6x6 inch cells and the result was producing too much gas so it was run through a switch that turned the unit off at 5 psi and turned it back on when more fuel production was required.

I am simply uninformed enough to waste a little bit of my time trying it. I'll let you know how it turns out.

Mark