suspension swap on 521?

[jrock4224]

So i posted in my last thread about scoring a crap load of 620 parts.. so heres the list l20b w/ w53 head, weber,stock hitchi carb, 5sp , driveline, full front suspension, (control arms spindles, steering, front discs, master cylinder, power booster, calipers) and a crap load of other misc..parts.... so heres my question , i searched on here but wasn't able to locate anything...is any of the 620 front end part usable on my 521....just from eyeballing the parts it looks like the control arms are longer than my king pin set up. oh and clearly the mounting is different...but thats ok i can fabricate, anyway so has anyone converted a 521 to 620 suspension...I am plannig on bagging this truck and was wondering if its worth anything to me or should i go a different route...the real only benefit I see is the added space, front disc brakes(which i was planning on using hardbody/pathfinder/beebani brackets and parts to do brakes anyway on stock king pins) i imagine its a waste and will end up just selling off the full front end but was curious if anybody has ever done anything like this...i was thinking if i am gonna go a different direction eith swapping in a modded mustang II or some late model import front clip...or i might just go the route of notching for space up front..for bags...assuming i can rebuild the king pin front end to be a little less sloppy...please offer suggestions...

[Budget Monty]

I will be watching this thread to see where people say. I am currently planning on going with S10/G-Body front suspension, as it is far more advanced than the kingpin set-up, has better aftermarket support, and lends itself to bags better. Plus I really want to get away from the 6 lug, as it in not allowing me to go with my chosen wheels set-up.

[jrock4224]

so if theres 32 views that means its me , not replying to my own thread a my man monty and thirty other epople who have read this but not repsonded.

 

i got it for you, 30 x no i aint seen it = three pages of negatory ghost rider...cool thanks for the help..

[nismo dr]

620 and 521 kingpin susp is essentially the same, you are right that the control arms don't bolt up, the geometry is differen, beebani also make control arms for converting to ball joint front susp

 

http://community.ratsun.net/index.php?showtopic=469

[wayno]

Hi there, I have a 1971 datsun with disc. brakes(620/720) and power steering, I call it my "franki'n truck", What you want is a lot of work, there are guys in the portland or. area that sell brakets that also work. What i did was buy four 720 upper a arms, cut them in such a way that when welded back together made them approx. 5/8 to 3/4 of an inch longer. Then I replaced the lower bushings with the 620 type, and mounted later 620 lower arms, you can use 521 bushings, but you have to use washers to fill the gaps. Now what you have is everything 620 from lower arms all the way to the upper ball joint, now this is IMPORTANT, when you put the longer A arms on, you put the left on the right, and the right on the left!!! What this does is get the upper ball joint back far enough. I cannot remember what tierod ends I used because I also added power steering at the same time, which works great I might add. This is my truck, I use this truck everyday, I use it hard, and so far it has not let me down since I took that 200SX 5 speed transmission out about 5 years ago. If you want to look at power brakes look at "1969 datsun kingcab project" in project datto I think, there are some pictures of the booster and clutch master in there, if you want the power steering, that is way harder to explain, but here we go, Datsun did something uneek, when they made there idler arms, they made them reversable, so you can put one where the steering gear is and you have a complete front end with two idler arms and no way to steer it. Then what I did was have a custom(custom parts suck) center bar/link made with a tierod connection as far to the pass. side as possible, then I mounted a 720 steering gear(and the tilt collum) as far forward as I could get it, then I took the stock center bar/link and used it between the steering gear and the custom(custom parts suck) center bar/link. The steering gear arm connection had to have the hole remachined so the connection could be reversed because of a very tight clearance between the idler arm and steering arm shaft. There is more to it, but you get the idea of how to do it. wayne

[nismo dr]

that is one bad "mini" truck

[yello620]

jrock, some of the 620 suspension parts are very useable on your 521. The lower control arms will work if you use 1/2" worth of spacers at the frame mount or use the late 620 lower frame bushing. The spindles are useable, but the brakes are of poor design. Throw the spindles away and get hardbody spindles/brakes. Then you need to build a custom upper control arm. Beebani makes arms for this conversion. You will also need to change your master cylinder.

 

The search function is your friend, this has been discussed many times.

[Budget Monty]

so if theres 32 views that means its me , not replying to my own thread a my man monty and thirty other epople who have read this but not repsonded.

 

i got it for you, 30 x no i aint seen it = three pages of negatory ghost rider...cool thanks for the help..

 

I have not 1 clue what this post was supposed to mean.

[elmerfudpucker]

 

I would love to see more pics and info on this little monster. You got a thread on it?

[mklotz70]

jrock....there's nearly 5000 members on here....30 people who are curious, but don't have anything to say is a lot better than 15 people that post BS...or a 100 people that just make comments. Most people are looking for info for themselves. Realistically....there's probably only one or two on here that have done what you want to do. I seriously doubt those guys are sitting around waiting for a thread like this to respond to. Those guys check new threads once in awhile...otherwise, they're typically working on something :) Just give it some time and you may get your answer.

 

Most of the info on what you're asking about was on nwde years ago. ggzilla has an archive running around somewhere...you might pm him and ask. He's a 1200 guy, so I seriously doubt your thread would ever attract his attention. I would have typically missed this thread too. Anyway...

 

I haven't done the mod you're looking to do, but almost. The easiest way to put the 620 stuff on your 521 is to use the lower control arms and spacers as mentioned by yello....but it pushes the track width out 1.25" PER SIDE. You will also need custom upper control arms to make it work. You'll end up with 620 spindles...which from that point can get upgraded to Hardbody spindles. But, as you can see....you're only using the LCA's and with the track widening...probably not the best option. 620 discs just aren't worth the effort in my opinion. Either bee's kit or mine would be a far easier way to put discs on.

 

A bit harder, but cleaner, would be to take the shock towers off the 620 and put them on the 521 frame. Then you can use the 620 uppers. This was the preferred method, back when the shock towers were still available at the dealers. You'd still want to switch to HB spindles. With either upgrade, you will not be able to use beebani's brake kit.

 

I don't remember if the disc frame is the same width as the 521. I know the drum 620's were....I'm guessing the disc frame is the same too. In which case, you can graft the front frame clip to the 521.

 

It's a lot of work no matter how you slice it. It becomes pretty clear why I designed a disc brake setup for my wife's 521 about 8yrs ago and just stuck with the kingpins. :)

 

You'll have to weigh this info against doing a mustand swap. Since you're going to bag it, torsion bars won't be an issue in any of the above scenarios.

 

Don't forget to factor in what wheels you want....there's a bunch of 5 lug wheels that look stock enough.

 

 

I did a brief thread on here about the custom upper arms I built for a buddy. Took me a bit to find...but here's the thread on them. There was a ton more info on the original nwde thread. I haven't reread this yet...

 

http://community.ratsun.net/topic/13081-upper-control-arm-build/

 

 

.....so...that should pretty much give you the answers you were looking for. ...maybe! :)

[wildmaninid]

Leave it to Mike to be the voice of reason here!! I personally did a hardbody frame swap in another 521 I had several years ago and it rurned out great......I don't have an aversion to 6 lug wheels and have no problem finding badass wheels with the right offset either.

 

keep on Datsun-ing guys,

Bill

[jrock4224]

Leave it to Mike to be the voice of reason here!! I personally did a hardbody frame swap in another 521 I had several years ago and it rurned out great......I don't have an aversion to 6 lug wheels and have no problem finding badass wheels with the right offset either.

 

keep on Datsun-ing guys,

Bill

 

 

hahahaha mkoltz yes i can be impatient at time...I was just wondering if any of this stuff would crossover since i got basically the whole front end off a 620 with my motor tranny...trust me i must have a bunk search engine cause i searched a billion times a billion phrases and nothing would come up... i did pst once before that the new forum layout is not search friendly as apposed to the one we had for a week or two between changes.... i can never find what i am looking for with this search feature.... Anyway... so this is very helpful i was planning on doing the swap with beebs brackets at some point...my friend and i put it on his 521 but have yet to get it back on the road yet...mainly i was curious about the front end parts so i could use a ball joint style front end and get away from my warn out king pins...I run caddy wheels and will be putting air bags on at somepoint... was about to start on it but sourced this motor trans combo so now i think my plan will be yard the l16 out this winter while its out hammer out the fornt bag assembly with shocks and reinstall l20 and 5sp...i never planned on using the 620 brakes they seemed to be big bulky and a wee bit antiquated...I will do some measuring later to see if i can still run my caddy wheels with a wider track width... i would assume it would be fine being only a 1.5 wider per side but also dont want it to look funny..plus on bags in the front the king pin to me would have less binding issues hrough the travel arc but thats in my mind, not in actuality..my fiend had a guy rebuild his king pins while the front end was apart for the disc brake conversion but it seems to be worse after what he had it done..so i was kinda leary but the guy he had do it.. also had never done it before....anyway i appreciate all the great advice.... all my other bagged trucks are ball jointed and work fine but they prematurely wear out ball joints.... the 1.5" track width addition sounds like for my bag project will allow me more room to fit a bag without having to notch the frame out for clearance...so thats intriguing..

[jrock4224]

Leave it to Mike to be the voice of reason here!! I personally did a hardbody frame swap in another 521 I had several years ago and it rurned out great......I don't have an aversion to 6 lug wheels and have no problem finding badass wheels with the right offset either.

 

keep on Datsun-ing guys,

Bill

 

 

haha forgot to mention i love your idea on a swap....two years before i got my datto i had a buddy who had bought these 3 1996 harbody standard cabs from a auction that were 65k milers that were owned by a courier service business asscoiated with the govt...only problem with trucks was the vins were removed and no titles...couldn't license them...part of the stipulation of buying them for uber cheap..he hounded me and hounded me to buy one...for 300.00, they ran perfect were super nice trucks but if i couldnt license it i figured what good would it do me...since i got my datto ...i have kicked myself several times after thinking about a similar swap as you did...oh well...would been sweet but i had no idea i would grab a 521 anytime soon...i will try that search feature to see if you did a write up so i can see how it went ...but as proved earlier i obviously cant work the search feature worth a bean....hahahah

 

oh and monty, stop trying to figure out what it meant... i was a failed attempt at humor...sorry bro

[Budget Monty]

haha forgot to mention i love your idea on a swap....two years before i got my datto i had a buddy who had bought these 3 1996 harbody standard cabs from a auction that were 65k milers that were owned by a courier service business asscoiated with the govt...only problem with trucks was the vins were removed and no titles...couldn't license them...part of the stipulation of buying them for uber cheap..he hounded me and hounded me to buy one...for 300.00, they ran perfect were super nice trucks but if i couldnt license it i figured what good would it do me...since i got my datto ...i have kicked myself several times after thinking about a similar swap as you did...oh well...would been sweet but i had no idea i would grab a 521 anytime soon...i will try that search feature to see if you did a write up so i can see how it went ...but as proved earlier i obviously cant work the search feature worth a bean....hahahah

 

oh and monty, stop trying to figure out what it meant... i was a failed attempt at humor...sorry bro

 

I wasn't mad or anything, I just honestly did not understand what you were saying. And please tell me that beautiful truck as your avatar is really yours and that you have a larger pic for me! I can't wait to get rid of my archaic suspension/brakes as well. I am trying to modernize my truck as well, while leaving the outside "OldSchool". I have already done distributorless ignition, and should have my EFI swap done in the next few weeks (Making an intake manifold from scratch). So I fully understand your wanting to do this!

[jrock4224]

 

two for the price of one....short bed standard i still have ... the crew cab i sold to help finance my business venture...loved it was fun to drive just impractical as hell....if i get rich one day(probably not) i will build another one....no caddie front end and 22's large lugs not 19's..though...dont like the caddy look anymore...both are airbagged the 1/2 ton is engineered to lay frame and the bed is stock...no tanksno hole no nuthing..i love it no one bellieves it...crew cab truck is in portland somewhere now along with my fathers twin turbo c 6 vette the guy bought at the same time.....

[mklotz70]

How much did your friend pay to have the kingpins done? I think Hainz had his done...nearly $400? I've got several sets around and they're on the list of things to do and ebay :)

 

The bushings have to be reamed...if they aren't done right.......they'll be sloppy or tight. They're a royal pain to do!!

 

 

My thought....since you can fabricate and turn out trucks like the above pics....you should WOW us with something new on the front end :)

[wildmaninid]

After doing kingpins on International front ends on school buses, doing them on a datsun is just like childs play, still not a huge fan of doing it, but a tight kingpin front end is as good as any.

 

 

Bill

[mklotz70]

I didn't have the shop press the first time....had to hammer the hell out of the old pin to get it out. The lock pin probably gave me the most grief!!

[wildmaninid]

yea, a press makes a world of difference. Although I prefer to do u joints with a hammer and jig setup I have setup. I have crushed way too many needle bearings in a press.

 

datsuns rock

 

Bill

[johny5]

I put 620 disc brakes and ball joints in my 521 .

http://community.ratsun.net/topic/17408-johny5s-521/page__p__237323__fromsearch__1#entry237323

[mklotz70]

LOL! See.....I knew there was someone around here that had done it! :) Thanks johny5! I'd completely forgotten about the cross member supports being the easiest way to fix the lower control fit problem. :) So, where's the rest of the build pics in your thread?

 

jrock.....it might be just as easy to do a clip swap.....especially if you want to "Z" the frame for the drop at the same time.

[jrock4224]

not sure i wanna z the fram....if i went that far i would just build a new one....which i dont really have time for ... mainly i just wanted to see if it would benefit me to switch to any of these parts while i had them....seems 50/50 especially since i wanna use the disc brake conversiosn we already aheve started on my friends 521 ....620 brakes just seem like a small improvement over stock while the hardbdoy and brakets seems like abetter option...i am just trying to make the best decisiosn before i just sell off all the 620 extra s i got... at this poitn looks like i will wait till after august pull the l16 and 4sp... prep font end for conversion to air clean up l20 and 5sp now and finish fornt suspnesion then put in l20 5sp... and have a drive line built while i have the bed ff re do in the rear...

[jrock4224]

How much did your friend pay to have the kingpins done? I think Hainz had his done...nearly $400? I've got several sets around and they're on the list of things to do and ebay :)

 

The bushings have to be reamed...if they aren't done right.......they'll be sloppy or tight. They're a royal pain to do!!

 

 

My thought....since you can fabricate and turn out trucks like the above pics....you should WOW us with something new on the front end :)

 

nothing he works at a can plant and he had machinist there , who had never done it before do it, ... and now they are sloppier than before....thanks for the compliments but that stuff is childs play...simple bolt on and modding existing bolt on stuff...but i like mystuff clean so its a lot of prep work and figureing to make it what i want... that new stuff i didnt wanna hack up so i went at tit differently then like my mazda where i just started plasmaing everything i didnt need of the frame....my stuff is not wild its more utilitariean ... i like it relaible, be clean and easy to work on if something happens...no looping tube or wierd spider web gussets.. i think that can cheapen a build and adds nothing ...I used to look at trucking mag and see what epople would do in there beds and laugh...I mean i could take abunch of tubing bending it crazy circles and put a ball a tthe top and call it a fifth wheel but... i wouldnt hook shit to it...I like a truck thats clean and can still be used...i use my trucks to haul shit and do work....u will never see me welding a tailgate closed...