510 steering box question

[71ka510]

I did a search, but could not find an answer. What type of fluid or grease goes in the steering box? And how much? Thanks in advance for any info.

[INDY510]

80-90W

 

fill it until it over-flows

[71ka510]

Thank you

[Duke]

I personally run something a little heavier than that with some moly mixed in. The steering box is subjected to quite a bit of heat because of it's location. Using thicker oil than what is specified can't hurt.

[71ka510]

Moly? New to me, what is it and where do I get it?

[Duke]

Basically like grease. Should be able to get it at auto parts stores and the like.

[71ka510]

Ok I will look into that

[datzenmike]

Moly-coat is a brand name for a lube that contains molybendum disulphide.

 

The FSM recomends GL-4 tranny oil 80-W-90 in the steering box.

 

GL-5 rear end oil is high in sulphur compounds which boost the oil's ability to protect rubbing gear surfaces in the all steel differential.

GL-4 is lower in these sulphur compounds because they break down (sulphuric acid) over time and corrode copper and brass synchro rings.

 

If you are sure there are no copper or brass parts, like shim packs, in the steering box then run whatever you want. There is an upper and lower bushing for the sector shaft. Could this be brass??? Anyone have a 620 box apart and know? If, however there is copper or brass I would run the factory recommended GL-4 and leave the moly out.

[HRH]

Hey hey kids! Guess what I did tonight!? Did someone say take apart a 210 steering box? :)

 

This is the box I'm refurbishing for the 510 since the 210 is the easy quicker ratio and bolts right up. It's actually really really cool inside. It's like a little mini rack and pinion! Got the seals out, will probably be able to match those up. Finding bearings might be a little more of a pain in the butt. These felt just slightly notchy although they look great. I think just the style lends them to wearing out eventually, even in a controlled environment of a gearbox. The oil was just beautiful inside, despite the crappy looking exterior.

 

Inside the box are two needle bearing assemblies, they looked great as well, leaving those alone, shaft didn't have any play.

 

The top cover (rack portion) has quite a few (3 or 4) shim plates, so I'll see if there are any specs in the Haynes book, otherwise I'm just winging it.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[510er]

matt you better document this 210 box rebuild and replacement in full details in the dime section for me to curse at while doing this in a couple months haha

[hang_510]

this is the component that wears outs.

NLA anywhere. :angry:

 

there are a bunch of balls that get lost when you seperate :lol: but is rebuildable.

[HRH]

this is the component that wears outs.

NLA anywhere. :angry:

 

there are a bunch of balls that get lost when you seperate :lol: but is rebuildable.

 

 

Hehe, yeah, I didn't take that one apart, I kinda figured it had a bunch of bearings in it. So far it's been a poopy thing. The two bearings at the top and bottom of the worm shaft look beautiful, but I think the top one is a bit more worn. The gear had a little bit of notchy resistance when turning. Not bad, don't think I'd notice it from the driver's seat, but figured I might try anyway.

 

So I checked NAPA today, the pitman seal is a 9500 number at NAPA, still available. Brown Bearing here in town has it in stock. The little tiny top cover seal is not gettable. I took the seal book home and am going to check by dimension tonight to see if I can find something that will work. Or I'll throw it in a puddle of ATF and put it back in. It came out pretty nicely, so might get away with re-using.

 

Called Nissan today and had the old guy look up the microfiche. 14 part numbers associated with a 210 steering box, all of them no longer available. That was disappointing.

 

Previous to Nissan I called Chuck's Gear (does Datsun trannies for race cars beautifully) and a rebuild kit for a '79 210 box is, surprise! not available to him.

 

So I think I may cannibalize a few boxes and use the best parts and throw it back together. Goodness forbid I break it though! Maybe I should start making a steering box? :) Somehow don't think I'd sell enough. Rack and pinion would be better, but I'm trying to do it on the cheap and since this requires no modification, maybe I'll get lucky.

 

I'm going to drag the funky bearings down to Brown Bearing tomorrow anyway to see if they maybe magically have some like it. Really the gear is in pretty good condition, I probably could have refilled and stuck it in, but since I went to the trouble to take it apart, might as well go the distance with what can be done.

[datzenmike]

Hey Matt. Does this box look like the one you have?

 

 

 

 

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[INDY510]

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Is that a 710 box???

 

It looks like a HL510 box too..... the previous owner of my 510 put a HL510 box in my PL510..... it worked okay, but he used the rubber bushing instead of a U-joint on the spline.... .. and it had a HL510 steering column swap

 

The box died in a parking lot 6 years ago when I was turning at "full lock" and the box popped and all the gear oil poured out of a small crack in the box...

 

I drove it the 2 miles back home,,,,, not a good idea,,,,, It took three full turns of the steering wheel to get the car to turn,,,, then three turns in the other direction to straighten out

[datzenmike]

There was discussion about using the HL510 box but no definite consensus on how well or even if it worked. The one in the picture I got off an '80 or '81 (forget) 200sx. My other 200sx was power steering.

 

The rubber thing that joins the column to the box is also known as a rag joint.

[HRH]

Mounting looks the same, but my top cover only has 3 bolts. More of a diamond shape. Also just noticed that one seems to have a big threaded collar on the steering shaft attachment, whereas it's another 3 bolt mounting plate on mine, but I doubt that would be an issue. What ratio is that one? I don't know the ratio of the 210, but I turned it in relation to the 510 and it's much quicker.

 

I finally had a stroke of luck on the bearings. I may have to have the top cover machined out to accept a slightly large seal diameter as that's what is available. Looked at all the dimensions and I found a suitable inside diameter but the outside is about 100 thousands bigger. Fortunately there is a lot of material on the cover. Anyway, when I tipped it over, a race fell out with NSK numbers on it! I thought the race was machined into the housing, but looks like that's not the case, so the bottom one should be able to be replaced too.

 

Now I'm hoping I can still get those kind of bearings. It's a funky number. VTA A19Z-3 Crossing fingers in the morning. Should probably cross dicks too. :D

[INDY510]

Well the HL510 box "worked" in my PL510...

 

But I think it would have worked better with a U-joint instead of a rag-joint

 

I drove it for years with the rag-joint.... and probably put 15K miles on that box before it broke

 

The steering did feel a million times better when I put in the stock steering column and stock steering box.

And tightened up the T/C rods for a better feel.

[HRH]

Well I found out today that those NSK bearings are common in steering columns and bicycle steering heads. So I'm going to try a bike shop tomorrow, 'cause no one else can get them so far!

[HRH]

Hah, I'm a retard, I'm on the wrong thread!

[510er]

Matt your anal ness and creativity never cease to amaze me. Good detective work on the seal and bearings

[HRH]

Yeah, I like anal! :D j/k Unforunately I haven't found anything yet. Need to call NSK during their business hours, that will be sometime next week.

[hang_510]

Should probably cross dicks too. :D

Yeah, I like anal! :D

:huh: you better get your bearings straight!

[HRH]

I got all excited playing with the steel balls! :D "Yeah, like that, wait, no not that, yeah, there we go." - Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back (You guess the scene)

[hang_510]

the stewardess adjusting the pillow right before kicking his fat ass off a southwest flight? :o

[HRH]

No, when he's describing the clitoris. "The female clit?" Uhh...yeah. "I'd pinch it like this, and grab it like this....oh you naughty clit... etc. Pretty funny.