Anyone hungry?? Cuz my engines TOAST!

[metalmonkey47]

Attractive title much?

 

Alright.. heres the deal.. My car is smokin like a Jamaican. I just rebuilt the top end and replaced the blown head gasket. The car was burning oil when I got it, but now it's just insane. To the point that it isn't safe to run the car since it smokes up the street. (YES it's that bad.)

 

When I pulled the head I found a slight bit of rust on the cylinder wall from the head gasket leaking water (over-diluted coolant) into the cylinder. Thought nothing of it since it was a tiny spot that you couldn't even feel. I started up the car tonight after putting on the new thermostat housing and let it run for a while. After about 15 minuets it started puffing smoke. No biggy at the time since it wasn't any worse then before. After a while it was just blowing smoke and I began getting concerned. The only weird thing is that it runs perfect. Doesn't hesitate to start, no missing, nothing. It doesn't have ANY symptoms of blow by (although it clearly has it.) Pulled the rear plug to check it out and it was a little wet so I went and got my dad and his cool tool.

 

I think you see where this is going.

 

 

 

 

Anyways, found the dish of the piston is soaked in oil.

 

 

 

 

Now, my dad spoke to a master mechanic friend who mentioned that I may have a stuck oil ring as a result of the rust. But also that they may just be ready to be replaced. What do you guys suggest? Think it may be my oil ring?

[I'm BLUE]

Very hard to say ,,, lapping the valves is definetly going to put more pressure on any engines shortblock (rings) ,,, even if it is just a bit "tired"

 

Be careful about trying to run ANY engine flush type treatment through there ( do you really want to break a bunch of shit loose and plug up pickup/oil gallerys ??? )

 

what is the compresion dry ? compresion with just a touch of oil down each cylinder ?

 

stuck rings happen A LOT !!! it's one of the more important reasons you want to change oil more , often , and use good oil as well

 

sorry to see this man ! :(

 

IMPORTANT : --- when the head was off how much cylinder ridge did you have at the top of the cylinders ???

[Guest 510kamikazifreak]

Rebuilding the head? was it a complete redo?

Bumped the compression up , and blew a ring. :unsure:

[metalmonkey47]

Yeah didn't even think about the compression blowing the rings :(

 

I'm gonna do a compression check Saturday since I work both jobs tomorrow.

Do you think it's possible I have a stuck oil ring?

 

 

 

And what do you mean by cylinder ridge? Sorry, total noob to rotating assembly.

[izzo]

cylinder ridge, is where the cylinder wall gets worn down from use, leaving a slight ridge at the very top. you may have to get the cylinders bored out, and new pistons/rings to match the bore... a very slight ridge is ok from what i hear.

[metalmonkey47]

cylinder ridge, is where the cylinder wall gets worn down from use, leaving a slight ridge at the very top. you may have to get the cylinders bored out, and new pistons/rings to match the bore... a very slight ridge is ok from what i hear.

 

Ohhhh okay I think I see what you mean now. yeah it had a little ridge. Maybe I'll build the shit out of this engine. Bore it and port it like a mother fucker. Don't really have the money for this :(

[I'm BLUE]

Ok psychologically ,,, the best thing to do is NEVER ADMIT DEFEAT !!! It happens to the best and worst of us ,,, yup !

 

(1) Compression check will be able to tell you 70% of what's going on instantly !!! ( Do a Dry and Wet check even though you have oil in there ,,, just a tea-spoon of oil will do for wet ! )

 

(2) Engines wear in unison ( valve faces/seats are going to sit as tight after x amount of miles ! old american v-8's have valves go out in even as low as 40,000 miles from new ! ) NOTE: what may happen is one makes a tighter seal with the valve seats sealing tightly ,,, puts more pressure on the rings/walls ,,, if the engine is normal compression or just somewhat tired it can change the dynamic's of the engine for a while... At times it may not affect it much at all !!! I would have done the same thing you did :D ,,,,,,,,,,,, vica versa if you put new piston rings in and don't lap the valves ( which a surprising amount of people do :rolleyes: ) then you put more pressure on the parts that haven't been refreshed ( and could be tired )

 

(3) When cleaning off piston tops with brake clean or carb clean while shortblock is intact in the car ,,, remember that Brake Clean can dry or make things "stick" because it degreases and sucks out the moisture of everything around it ,,, old gas/oil turns to a "shellac like substance "

 

(4) YES !!! it is very possible that you have a stuck oil ring ,,, problem is changing oil repeatedly in short intervals in the only real safe way I have accomplished getting them un-stuck ( somewhat ,,, less successful than more ! ) ( I have always ended up taking them apart to clean , re-ring, re-seal , and going but I get impatient and don't see any other option ! )

 

(5) The amount of taper/cylinder wear is determined by depth gauges ( measuring your bores ) ,,, a good indicator of ring/bore wear is that small ring ridge area almost at the very top of the cylinder where the piston rings "can no longer travel further up" if you can hook your finger nail up on the edge of it ,,, it means your piston rings have slightly - to moderately - to extremely worn ( depending on how much there is !!! ) it is also a good indicator that you should ALWAYS ! ALWAYS measure you bore clearances before deciding to use standard or larger sized pistons !

 

 

Don't give up on this yet ,,, this could be a very valuable learning experience !!!

 

If you can find a second motor for CHEAP ,,, that runs good ,,, it could be a cheaper option .... I usually pickup a second motor to build/repair and throw in ,,,, unless I am pretty sure the one I have is repairable/cheap enough to repair --->correctly<---

 

sorry for the RANT ! ;)

[I'm BLUE]

Ohhhh okay I think I see what you mean now. yeah it had a little ridge. Maybe I'll build the shit out of this engine. Bore it and port it like a mother fucker. Don't really have the money for this :(

 

find a good used motor or upgrade ;) ( finally a legitimate reason to build what you want :cool: )

 

Your Valve guides were tight/good right ?

[datzenmike]

What cylinder has all the oil????? #3 right, or maybe #2?

[metalmonkey47]

find a good used motor or upgrade ;) ( finally a legitimate reason to build what you want :cool: )

 

Your Valve guides were though tight/good right ?

I'm already shopping :P Thanks for the rant though, helps a ton! I'll get back to it later

 

What cylinder has all the oil????? #3 right, or maybe #2?

 

#4 on the rear.

[datzenmike]

The motor isn't over filled with oil?

 

New valve seals?

[metalmonkey47]

The motor isn't over filled with oil?

 

New valve seals?

 

Not according to the dipstick. Yes new valve seals. Full rebuild of the top end. Seals, valves lapped, even smoothed out the ports.

[metalmonkey47]

Now that I think about it, I DID use carb cleaner on the pistons to clean and also used WD40 to protect from rust while I rebuilt. Maybe my rings are stuck?

[I'm BLUE]

Now that I think about it, I DID use carb cleaner on the pistons to clean and also used WD40 to protect from rust while I rebuilt. Maybe my rings are stuck?

 

how "bad" was it smoking before the repair ?

[metalmonkey47]

how "bad" was it smoking before the repair ?

 

Not bad. It was a just a bit. Nothing more then i would expect from a 200,000 mile car.

[I'm BLUE]

a little bit all the time ?

 

Blue smoke I pre-sume ?

 

Puff at start up ?

 

constantly ?

 

any other details ?? :D

[Skib]

how long did you run it while it was smoking?

[metalmonkey47]

a little bit all the time ?

 

Blue smoke I pre-sume ?

 

Puff at start up ?

 

constantly ?

 

any other details ?? :D

It was constant, but it was very light. Never noticed a difference in oil level. In fact, the only time I really ever saw it smoke was on the road when you were around 3000 RPM. And yes, blueish white smoke.

 

how long did you run it while it was smoking?

 

It ran or about 5-10 minuets. As soon as it started getting bad was when I shut it off.

[I'm BLUE]

hmmmmmmmmmmm well ,,, seems a compression check is your best friend/tool for the moment ;)

 

 

then a leak down tester if need be :)

[datzenmike]

On an older motor the oil rings wear down but coked oil and carbon will still seal them pretty good. Carb cleaner might have dissolved this and now the oil gets past them into the combustion chamber. ???

 

See what the compression on 4 is.

[Skib]

check compression, if its ok run it for a while longer, its possible its just burning off all the shit you sprayed in there ect.

 

jass's goon let out a big ass cloud of smoke when we put it back together and started it up but it was just burning off all the old carbon and shit.

smoked for a little while too

[metalmonkey47]

hmmmmmmmmmmm well ,,, seems a compression check is your best friend/tool for the moment ;)

 

 

then a leak down tester if need be :)

Doing it ASAP :) Good thing I work at Autozone tomorrow.

 

On an older motor the oil rings wear down but coked oil and carbon will still seal them pretty good. Carb cleaner might have dissolved this and now the oil gets past them into the combustion chamber. ???

 

See what the compression on 4 is.

That's possible, and I didn't think about this. Hope I don't have to replace them :(

[metalmonkey47]

check compression, if its ok run it for a while longer, its possible its just burning off all the shit you sprayed in there ect.

 

jass's goon let out a big ass cloud of smoke when we put it back together and started it up but it was just burning off all the old carbon and shit.

smoked for a little while too

 

Well, I thought that was it originally, but it wasn't smoking on the first start. It just started and progressively got worse.

Plus the whole "oil filling the piston" thing kinda dissolves that theory :(

[I'm BLUE]

Cool ! report back the dry readings , and wet readings :)

[metalmonkey47]

Cool ! report back the dry readings , and wet readings :)

 

Out of curiosity, how do I get a dry reading on cylinder 4 when its soaked in oil?