Dyl510 Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 For starters, I've read that write up (I noticed it's stickied on here also) a million times over and surfed the net, but nothing seems to get much into the newer Subi stuff as to what works and what doesn't. So I have to ask in hopes that someone can shed some light: Looking for a rear end that can handle a few more ponies than the R160 I just grenaded. I thought about an R180, but something stronger and LSD would be a bit nicer if I could find one. I hear a lot of guys doing the Subi thing, and I've got a good line on a rear diff out of a 2002 WRX (non STI). I'll be bringing my old R160 and the stock 510 halfshafts with me to see if it will work.... but does anyone here know anything before I drive my ass out there to find out it's way off? Does the WRX housing itself fit to the stock 510 mounts? Are the axles splines the same as the stock 510 half shafts? cheers in advance! Dyl Quote Link to comment
rpowell25 Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 If its a R160 or R180 it will fit into the car. The real issue is stub axles. If it is a VLSD (Viscous) then you will have to fabricate stub axles. If its a CLSD (Clutch)then you can retro the stock Datsun stubs. Chances are that a 2002 Subie will be a VLSD if it is indeed a LSD diff. There is a Dime Quarterly article on how to use a VLSD Subie diff in a 510 (Volume 9 Issue 4). It describes the a fabrication technique to get it to work with stock half shafts. Here are pics of a Subie VLSD and stubs:http://datsun510.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=3602. Hope that clears it up. Robert Quote Link to comment
thisismatt Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 If its a R160 or R180 it will fit into the car. The real issue is stub axles. If it is a VLSD (Viscous) then you will have to fabricate stub axles. If its a CLSD (Clutch)then you can retro the stock Datsun stubs. Chances are that a 2002 Subie will be a VLSD if it is indeed a LSD diff. There is a Dime Quarterly article on how to use a VLSD Subie diff in a 510 (Volume 9 Issue 4). It describes the a fabrication technique to get it to work with stock half shafts. Here are pics of a Subie VLSD and stubs:http://datsun510.com/photopost/showgallery.php?cat=3602. Hope that clears it up. Robert Newer subaru R180s have 27 spline shafts, whereas the old R180 and R160 have 25 splines. You cannot use any newer subaru diff without custom stubs or modified stock CV shafts. Quote Link to comment
Dyl510 Posted February 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 awesome, that's the kind answers I was looking for. Saved me the trouble of looking at it, cheers! what about a 92 SVX? The gearing is a little lower than I hoped (3.545)... but does anyone know how well one of those would work? Or if it will have 27 or 25 spline axles? It's the same price as a non LSD R180 (from a Z) with 4.11 gears. So I'm stuck between the two... The higher ratio R180 would be nice, but so would an LSD that would probably handle the power better (appx 250HP, 250flbs, SR20DET). Opinions on using the lower 3.545 gears with the 5spd SR20 tranny? Thanks again for the input. Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 No z r180 came with 4.11 gears. Quote Link to comment
Dyl510 Posted February 3, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 this one has 4.11, perhaps the guy put 4.11 in there, or it's not out of a Z (which is likely) Either way.... it's an R180 with 4.11 gears. Any opinions on running a lower 3.545 ratio with the SR20 5 spd tans? Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 Ya if it's the original pumpkin/carrier then it's 200sx. I didn't note it to split hairs but because depending on what it came out of the ring gears are different sizes. Quote Link to comment
sssr20det510 Posted February 3, 2010 Report Share Posted February 3, 2010 92 svx is going to be vlsd and might require some mods Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 '84-'88 200sx and '83-'86 720 4X4s had 4.11 R180 in them. I have an open R-200 with 4.11s. You won' break that. Quote Link to comment
Dyl510 Posted February 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 cheers, thanks again guys. still any opinions on the lower rear end ratio? 3.545 sounds like it might be disappointing. Quote Link to comment
rpowell25 Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 The pics I listed above are of a 92 SVX VLSD with the 3.54 gears. I chose that ratio as it should match up well with the VG30E I am installing. I have no experience with SR's so I cannot speak to the compatibility of that ratio. Robert Quote Link to comment
thisismatt Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 I know someone was saying they swapped in a higher gear set like 3.5 into their SR20 510 but I can't remember who or where I read that. Either on the510realm or on the bluebird list perhaps. You should be able to find an open R180 for $100-$150. I think I paid $80 for mine from the front of a 720 4x4. R180 ring gears changed inner diameters in 76 or 77, so don't try to swap gear sets between that split. Some are clip-in stubs, some are bolt in, but the innards can be swapped between the two. R180 LSDs have become very difficult to find, or very expensive for an 3rd party aftermarket like Kaaz. Quote Link to comment
ichorid Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 when you factor in the costs of getting and SR20det or KA-T going in a 510 the LSD prices are quite reasonable, if you ask me. No one did though, just saying. OCCASIONALLY the nismo r180 pops up on ebay. very rare though. Quote Link to comment
Dyl510 Posted February 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 The SR itself was bought at an earlier date, and it was cheap as borsch anyways. I don't really have tons of cash right now to spend on the rear end (as much as I would like to go all out). The R180 is a cheaper find you're right, but I hear mixed stories about their strength at that kind of HP range. So I'm hoping to find a stronger solution for around $400-$500. Anyone have any experience with the strength of an R180 they'd like to enlighten me with? I just went and looked at an LSD rear diff out of a 2005 WRX (non STI), and my stock 510 half shafts slid right in no problem, the splines matched. Only issue I could find was that the WRX diff leaves nowhere for the 510 half shaft retainer bolts to thread into. The guy swore up and down that the sock Subi CV axles just slide in and out (no retaining clips or anything like that) but I think he's blowing smoke up my ass. Nonetheless, it's cheap.... and I don't see any reason why the 510 axles would try to walk out of the diff... correct me if I'm wrong, so any thoughts on running the 510 rear axles with no retaining bolts? Quote Link to comment
thisismatt Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 $900-1300 for a LSD is a bit unreasonable IMO, especially when you compare it to how much you can get, say, a ford 9" LSD for. Quote Link to comment
thisismatt Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Are you 100% sure the splines are meshed properly? I'm guessing that's a viscous LSD? Even if the splines are correct, if it's a VLSD it's not going to function as a limited slip without the proper VLSD shafts. The subaru shafts use a circlip on the end of the shaft. I would not run it without some retention mechanism. Quote Link to comment
ichorid Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 $900-1300 for a LSD is a bit unreasonable IMO, especially when you compare it to how much you can get, say, a ford 9" LSD for. yeah, I see what you're saying. be it quaife, or subi. Either one will cost you but you'll end up with a part that will last you longer than buying used open r180s that blow under heavy use. Quote Link to comment
sssr20det510 Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 you will need these if you go with the subi r180 to work in 510 http://www.betamotorsports.com/products/products.php Quote Link to comment
sssr20det510 Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 The SR itself was bought at an earlier date, and it was cheap as borsch anyways. I don't really have tons of cash right now to spend on the rear end (as much as I would like to go all out). The R180 is a cheaper find you're right, but I hear mixed stories about their strength at that kind of HP range. So I'm hoping to find a stronger solution for around $400-$500. Anyone have any experience with the strength of an R180 they'd like to enlighten me with? I just went and looked at an LSD rear diff out of a 2005 WRX (non STI), and my stock 510 half shafts slid right in no problem, the splines matched. Only issue I could find was that the WRX diff leaves nowhere for the 510 half shaft retainer bolts to thread into. The guy swore up and down that the sock Subi CV axles just slide in and out (no retaining clips or anything like that) but I think he's blowing smoke up my ass. Nonetheless, it's cheap.... and I don't see any reason why the 510 axles would try to walk out of the diff... correct me if I'm wrong, so any thoughts on running the 510 rear axles with no retaining bolts? You will need to machine the 510 stubs for c clips Quote Link to comment
Dyl510 Posted February 4, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 Thanks for the link, probably the way to go in the end since this WRX 180 is pretty cheap. Anyone have some info on stocker R180 strength? I'd go that route because it's cheap and easy, but I really don't want to replace a grenaded rear end in a few months. Quote Link to comment
sssr20det510 Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 R180. Should be good to 350 at least Quote Link to comment
fo0manchu Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 i would go with the 3.5. Or better yet, find a 3.73, you'll be burning through the shifts with the 4:11 and sr20det. Thats just my opinion though. Quote Link to comment
sssr20det510 Posted February 4, 2010 Report Share Posted February 4, 2010 i would go with the 3.5. Or better yet, find a 3.73, you'll be burning through the shifts with the 4:11 and sr20det. Thats just my opinion though. I dont belive they make a 3.73 or 3.50 they have 3.54, 3.70, 3.90, 4.11, 4.44 Quote Link to comment
Dyl510 Posted February 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 I like the idea of the lower ratio for a daily driver. Seems like it would be a bit nicer on the freeway. Thanks again for the info guys, it's nice to post soemthing on a forum and not have 5 people mocking me before I get a decent answer. Cheers. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 5, 2010 Report Share Posted February 5, 2010 I dont belive they make a 3.73 or 3.50 they have 3.54, 3.70, 3.90, 4.11, 4.44 R-180 came in 3.364, 3.545, 3.70, 3.889, 4.11, 4.375, 4.625. (at least) Torque matters. Here's some diff ratings from Datsun 1200 H145 5.71 ~ 100 lb. ft. H150 5.91 ~ 125 lb. ft. H165 6.50 ~ 225 lb. ft. H190 7.49 ~ 285 lb. ft. R200 7.88 ~ 300 lb. ft. Ford 8.00 ~ 325 lb. ft. Ford 8.80 ~ 500 lb. ft. Ford 9.00 ~ 600 lb. ft. Quote Link to comment
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