Trying to Finish a Half-Finished 1963 320 Project

[whiteaverson]

That's my cousin's Duramax towing home a 1963 Datsun 320. Making the story fairly short, I was looking for a small truck. I was thinking a Nissan Hardbody or Mitsubishi Mighty Max but wasn't having much luck finding the one I wanted. So, out of curiosity, I checked the classifieds here on Ratsun. This beauty was the only truck in New England. In fact, it was 30 minutes from home. I had to go look at it. And, because I'm not real smart, I bought it.

 

Now, the truck. Its very clean. At least for my low, New England car standards. The previous owner did a "frame off restoration" and the frame is painted and the body undercoated.

As you might be able to tell, there's always more to the story. In this case, I bought a half-finished project. The good news is it has a supposedly rebuilt engine, that reupholstered bench seat, and fresh brakes, among other things. The bad news is it needs fuel plumbing, brake plumbing, clutch plumbing, coolant plumbing, shocks, and a very thorough bolt check. The big challenge for me is that the wiring needs to be finished. Overall, that's not much compared to most projects but we will see if I am capable of putting it all together. I'll likely need some advice along the way.

Now, for what I've done so far. Not much. Mostly wrapping my head around what's needed and identifying all those parts in the bed. To start, does anyone have any idea what this might be?

Next, the biggest question for me on the wiring is the alternator. Does anyone know what this alternator is and if or how it could be wired to this Ford alternator regulator?

This is connector on the back of the alternator.

And the Ford regulator.

Any help with the wiring on that is appreciated.

Finally, things I've actually done. I'm waiting on a few things I've ordered to work on actually getting a first start on the engine. So the first thing I did was finish plumbing the brakes. They are now all connected and I wanted to get some brake fluid in the system. The previous owner claimed these were rebuilt?

Lots of crystallized brake fluid. I cleaned the brake master best I could and filled it with fluid. A couple pumps of the brake pedal showed that is was taking fluid so hopefully I can get those bled soon.

Otherwise, I've got the cab mounts all in but not tight and disassembled the clutch slave cylinder as it was pretty seized up. I didn't get pictures of that. Hopefully I can get the slave rebuilt and find a hose between it and the hard line. Then the clutch and brakes should be good to go?

More updates soon hopefully.

[Crashtd420]

Welcome , nice start to a project atleast....

Where abouts in new Hampshire?

There are a few of us in the area...

I'm down in mass with a 521....

 

One thing about the wiring is I believe those 320s were positive a ground setup... I'm not sure what that means regarding the wiring or how that works to change that to a normal negative ground system but it's something to keep in mind....

[whiteaverson]

I'm in New Ipswich. Little town right on the Mass border.

 

The wiring has been converted to negative ground with the alternator and an aftermarket harness. I just have to make sure the polarity sensitive components are wired correctly.

[difrangia]

That looks like a correct period radio so be sure that the radio is not wired into the system. I've seen it posted a number of times on here that many of the dealer added radios that were installed back when these were new would short to ground and burn up some wiring. I'm assuming that the previous owner had converted or at least started the conversion to neg-ground so the radio may be disconnected from power and if so, that's why. Also, I've seen that some of the old radios have a polarity switch on them Our 63/64 has a Clarion radio and speaker that, I'm sure, were installed when it was new and the pickup had been converted to neg-ground by a previous owner and the radio was disconnected.

 

If you don't already have a shop manual and parts catalog, follow the '320' tab on this NICO forum to view or download them. They're invaluable when tinkering with these critters.

 

http://www.nicoclub.com/datsun-service-manuals

 

BTW, that is a pretty nice survivor pickup; Good score.

Edited June 1, 2022 by difrangia

[whiteaverson]

Thanks, I got the manual and parts catalog printed out. They've already been a great help. The radio isn't wired in. Hopefully it hasn't ever been while the system was converted to negative ground.

[Crashtd420]

1 hour ago, whiteaverson said:

I'm in New Ipswich. Little town right on the Mass border.

 

The wiring has been converted to negative ground with the alternator and an aftermarket harness. I just have to make sure the polarity sensitive components are wired correctly.

Your only about 20 miles, 40 minutes away from me... I'm in leominster ma....

I'd be glad to offer a hand if you get stuck....  I'm pretty good at wiring and figuring that stuff out and good with mechanical stuff also... I did a full rebuild on my 521 and have been daily driving it for 4 years now....

Even if you dont need a hand and if you wanna see my truck and talk datsuns I'd love to swing by and check yours out.. I had to leave my 320 behind in California,  the 521 was running and driving and the 320 was not.... 

 

[wayno]

My guess on that switch is that it is for the brights, at least that is what it looks like to me.

 

 

I would get a simple alternator that is internally regulated, just hunt around for a small one, adapting it to the generator mount is fairly easy, my Australian U320 has an MG alternator, I would not use anything externally regulated unless it was stock.

 

 

 

[whiteaverson]

18 hours ago, Crashtd420 said:

Your only about 20 miles, 40 minutes away from me... I'm in leominster ma....

I'd be glad to offer a hand if you get stuck....  I'm pretty good at wiring and figuring that stuff out and good with mechanical stuff also... I did a full rebuild on my 521 and have been daily driving it for 4 years now....

Even if you dont need a hand and if you wanna see my truck and talk datsuns I'd love to swing by and check yours out.. I had to leave my 320 behind in California,  the 521 was running and driving and the 320 was not.... 

 

I'm in Leominster fairly often. I'll definitely let you know if I need any help. Hopefully I'll have it running soon and we could meet up at some point.

[whiteaverson]

10 hours ago, wayno said:

My guess on that switch is that it is for the brights, at least that is what it looks like to me.

 

 

I would get a simple alternator that is internally regulated, just hunt around for a small one, adapting it to the generator mount is fairly easy, my Australian U320 has an MG alternator, I would not use anything externally regulated unless it was stock.

 

 

 

I think you're right. It looks like the original headlamp switch broke and the previous owner replaced it as there is one in the truck.

 

That's probably the route to take on the alternator. Was just hoping there might be a simple way to use what I already have.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Here's a screenshot for https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=ford+voltage+regulator+wiring+diagram    google search.

 

[whiteaverson]

17 minutes ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Here's a screenshot for https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d&q=ford+voltage+regulator+wiring+diagram    google search.

 

Thanks, I'm aware of the Ford regulator wiring but the alternator doesn't appear to be a Ford alternator. It doesn't have the stator lug or at least one labeled as such. My limited knowledge and research says its a Toyota alternator. I'm inclined to connect the "E" terminal on the alternator to the "S" terminal on the regulator and follow the rest of the Ford charging system wiring. If that doesn't work I'll just get an internally regulated alternator.

[Crashtd420]

2 hours ago, whiteaverson said:

I'm in Leominster fairly often. I'll definitely let you know if I need any help. Hopefully I'll have it running soon and we could meet up at some point.

I set you a private message with my info....

You should see the notification in the top right corner....

Sometimes phones make it hard to access... if you click by the front tire, under the ratsun logo, of the 510 it pulls up the menu page with the messages and notifications....

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Do a search for Toyota alternator wiring and scroll through the results until you find a similar alternator. Are there any stickers on the alternator? Denso or Hitachi or ?

 

Looks like a match - https://www.ebay.com/itm/265445282152?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=265445282152&targetid=1645685073568&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=9032494&poi=&campaignid=16730423415&mkgroupid=135815925780&rlsatarget=pla-1645685073568&abcId=9300841&merchantid=116334139&gclid=CjwKCAjwv-GUBhAzEiwASUMm4gatYuUeo7C9xi29iSEFrVvpd8s41quO2EJpEIKRR80pjdLSQU8GThoCrmcQAvD_BwE

[whiteaverson]

9 minutes ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Do a search for Toyota alternator wiring and scroll through the results until you find a similar alternator. Are there any stickers on the alternator? Denso or Hitachi or ?

 

Looks like a match - https://www.ebay.com/itm/265445282152?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=265445282152&targetid=1645685073568&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=9032494&poi=&campaignid=16730423415&mkgroupid=135815925780&rlsatarget=pla-1645685073568&abcId=9300841&merchantid=116334139&gclid=CjwKCAjwv-GUBhAzEiwASUMm4gatYuUeo7C9xi29iSEFrVvpd8s41quO2EJpEIKRR80pjdLSQU8GThoCrmcQAvD_BwE

I think I did find the regulator that is specifically for the alternator. No stickers that I can see.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

I used to have a book that showed basic simple automotive wiring diagrams.  This - https://www.amazon.com/dp/188408902X?tag=uuid10-20

 

The book showed super simple wiring diagrams that are perfect for old cars or race cars.

 

I think any regulator will work, as long as you can figure out which terminal goes where.

[whiteaverson]

Not much progress last night. I have the clutch slave cylinder disassembled.

It was pretty seized up and, as you can see, has some rust in the cylinder. My plan is to "hone" it with 1000 grit sand paper and rebuild it as I'm missing the boot and the only way I've found to get it is with a full rebuild kit.

Also, I need the hose between the slave and the hard line.

I know people just get a custom one made but I just ordered an off the shelf one without the 5/8-18 external threads. It should work just fine.

[wayno]

This is not funny, but it is hilarious to me, in all the years that they made Datsuns there is one thing that is not interchangeable, the clutch slave, the slave mount holes are a different width apart on the 320 transmission than they are on everything made afterwards.

 

I could be wrong, but I think the fix was to slot the newer slaves on both sides to except a wider mount pattern, the doodle below is what I mean by slotting it.

 

[difrangia]

Wayno, Yup. Slotting the holes on a 520/521 slave to adapt to the 320 has been discussed here before. Also need to use the operating rod from the 320 or fab a new one. I worked up a dimensioned drawing for the op-rod that I have in my archive and if anyone could use it I'll dig it up and post it.

 

I also used the master cylinders for the 620 pickup on ours. Some mods were required and, if I remember correctly, the op rods for the 320 need to be used. The 620 brake master gave me dual-circuit brakes. In addition, I changed to a mechanical brake light switch from the 620 on the pedal arm. I used as many ancillaries as I could from the 620 (ECM distributor, alternator, and probably more that I can't remember at the moment) as we also have a 78 'Longbed' 620 and it cuts down on the stock of spares. Future mod will be a 79 pickup third member with 4:11 ratio if I live long enough.

Edited June 3, 2022 by difrangia

[whiteaverson]

Yeah, it does look like slotting the holes is the common solution. I'm hoping I can just rebuild it but the more common 2" bolt spacing slave cylinders are fairly cheap if that doesn't work out.

 

Yesterday's progress was also pretty limited. Had the wrong parts show up which was frustrating. Will likely be bouncing around on tasks until I have enough parts to go system by system.

First, on the alternator wiring, my research on Ford regulators and the 70's Toyota alternator (?) resulted in this wiring diagram. Hopefully I'll get to test it soon.

Next, the steering wasn't bolted up. Got that all wrapped up. Should make moving the truck around easier.

Also, the tie rods look like they really need to be replaced. Not high priority right now but something else to think about.

All that means a couple things are crossed off the still growing list of things to do.

[wayno]

That is quite a list.

 

Not sure if you can get the temp gauge to work negative ground, I just asked about that in the newbs thread, I asked if he or anyone else ever successfully got the stock gauge to work converted over to negative ground, my gas gauge works fine.

 

I just put rear shocks on my slightly lowered(3" lower) U320 and I found some Buick shocks that were stud/stud, the "Monroe" part number is 5826, they say "Made in the USA", make sure your upper connection is the stud type, that surprised me, my 1963 is the same.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Isn't there a parts cross reference thread here on Ratsun? I thought somebody was compiling part numbers.

 

FWIW - early Chevy truck brake hoses (I think 55-59) are a direct fit. I used them on both of my 320s.

 

Are you going to convert to a dual circuit brake master? Now's the time, and a worthy upgrade. Most dual circuit masters are from later disc/drum cars/trucks, so you'll have to install a residual valve in the front line.

[whiteaverson]

Well I finally got back to it. Its been a busy month and this summer doesn't look like its going to let up. I'll have to be more intentional about putting time into this.

Wanted to wrap up the brakes so that one system was off the list but the master seems to be leaking from the valve on the bottom? Need to sort that out.

So I started to look at the fuel system as that is actually necessary to get this thing running. First the fuel and tank were generally dirty.

I made a half hearted effort at cleaning them.

The big item is the fuel line from the tank to the fuel filter. It was originally a hard line but I'm missing the hard line and it appears that it was cut.

So I'm going with a soft line just out of convenience. The fitting on the fuel filter is threaded.

So I got a barbed fitting. I was under the impression it was 1/4 NPT threads on the filter but they definitely aren't. I then got a 1/8 NPT fitting and it still doesn't seem right. Hopefully it doesn't leak.

I also need to get a new element and gasket for the kind of crusty looking fuel filter.

The fuel line is currently just run into the wheel well.

I also started looking into the coolant hoses. Specifically the tee to the heater hose. As far as I know, a direct replacement for that hose doesn't exist and my original is toast. My current solution is a brass tee.

That results in this mess.

If anyone has a more elegant solution, I'm open to suggestions.

[wayno]

I would suggest removing the plug in the water pump and getting a fitting for it as that is where the heater hose is supposed to go on that water pump.

 

[whiteaverson]

15 hours ago, wayno said:

I would suggest removing the plug in the water pump and getting a fitting for it as that is where the heater hose is supposed to go on that water pump.

 

Okay, this is good to know. For some reason mine has a hose with a tee fitting of sorts (I'll have to take a picture of it). Is there a readily available replacement for the radiator hose?

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

My '65 320 had a tee's hose too. Austin Healey Sprites and MG Midgets had a hose with a nipple off towards the heater core.

 

Do not throw away those fuel fittings. They are a unique thread and may be hard to source in the future. On the tank side, I assume you just cut the tube and tightened the hose over that? You could always flare it to make it a true hose nipple.