Parkinglotslider521 Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 So as i was staring at my factory exhaust manifold outlet I had a thought. It stemmed from another thought. A while back I helped a guy put a twin snail setup on a 350z. I know I know, v6. But he didn't like how the greddy kit didn't fit worth a shit so we designed an adapter to be used with an aftermarket na tubular manifold, and did a rear mounted setup. Fast forward to now. Im looking at a pair of IHI RHB31's. Supports about 100hp a piece, and can be used on anywhere fro 200 to 900cc engines. Im in between doing a full rear mounted turbo setup with about 2 inches of pipe after the turbos, and making an exhaust manifold to run front mounted turbos. Pros and cons. Front mounted setup- Pros: easier installation turbos are visible (wow factor) Less piping Cons: More engine bay heat Less room need to pipe in an intercooler Rear mounted setup Pros: No more underhood heat no need for an intercooler with such a small amount of pipe after the turbo I may actually get a turbo whine Cons: Large amount of piping involved need an oil return pump Yes, im doing it to be different. Yes, I know there are other simpler ways that could make more power. Whatever. If anyone has any ideas on how to simplify this and make it more reliable, or a better turbo recommendation feel free. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 Rear mounted set up? Like behind the engine instead of right at the exhaust manifold??? Too much heat loss and lag building exhaust pressure in the pipe and lag compressing 8 feet of pipe back to the intake. And where to mount this behind the rear bumper??? To use power you need the largest difference between heat and cold. Entropy is the dispersion of energy from a high state to a low one (more or less) Turbo gasses have the most energy when HOT and spin the compressor with POWER!!!! Long pipes will drop the temp and pressure and the turbo will have much less to work with. If this was the best they could come up with because of space or w/e it's nothing short of desperate. I wonder if those BOVs even have anything to do. Surely a pair of motorcycle turbos are small enough to mount under the intake. 1 Quote Link to comment
Parkinglotslider521 Posted September 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 Im thinking of mounting the turbos under the driver side of the cab. About 4 feet of pipe, wrapped all the way. And I know that hotter air makes for better spool, but the turbine intake looks to be about 1 inch. I have yet to verify this, but if that's accurate it should still spool to 5 psi quickly. That's all im planning to run until I get my other motor built. Quote Link to comment
Tristin Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 Rear mounted set up? Like behind the engine instead of right at the exhaust manifold??? Too much heat loss and lag building exhaust pressure in the pipe and lag compressing 8 feet of pipe back to the intake. And where to mount this behind the rear bumper??? There are plenty of videos that show thats actually pretty false. STS makes a widely used setup on a lot of cars that all have the same comparable lag time to any other turbo setup. Quote Link to comment
Z-train Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 By the time exhaust gas reaches the muffler(or where one should be,the gas temperature has dropped from 1400 degrees to 400 degrees. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 There are plenty of videos that show thats actually pretty false. STS makes a widely used setup on a lot of cars that all have the same comparable lag time to any other turbo setup. STS is also what? 500+ hp engine? It has exhaust volume to spare. If there is a vid about this you can bet STS made it. 1.6 Liter needs all the help it can get. No way 8 feet of pipe is going to generate the same boost as on the manifold.... and no way is 8 more feet on the compressor side. Assume for a min that there is virtually no turbo lag difference, there will still not be the same amount of over all boost available. parkinglotslider521 yes it will work, but a lot of work for little gain. Lets just say inefficient and wasted potential. This is something strictly for a compromise to lack of space on the engine. 1 Quote Link to comment
Tristin Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 STS is also what? 500+ hp engine? It has exhaust volume to spare. If there is a vid about this you can bet STS made it. Fully agree, but I dont think it would be as bad as assumed. I do believe that if you want to go twin turbo, you should just convert to RHD and run a setup like this L28: 2 Quote Link to comment
Stupid_fast Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 When you increase pressure in a long pipe the other side pressurizes almost immediately. Long pipes probably have similar pressure loss characteristics to a big intercooler. Put bigger turbine lol. rear mounted setups work just fine. On an L16? do it. Quote Link to comment
Uber Deaf One Posted September 9, 2014 Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 Rear mounted setups def have more lag... that's a shitton of extra piping. Show me a rear mount setup used in anything other than drag racing or car meets/shows? Two turbos on an L series with the intake and exhaust practically touching.. I never understood WHY. That's so much heat... poor engine. Quote Link to comment
Parkinglotslider521 Posted September 9, 2014 Author Report Share Posted September 9, 2014 Make no mistake it will be done right. I have also seen a v8 with 8 of these mini turbos. I was just wondering for fabrication purposes which seems the better option. If I go with front mounted turbos, everything will be wrapped and ill get lil' baby blankets made. But I'm not going to mount them at the rear bumpers if I do a rear setup. They would be squeezed in the space between the frame and drivers kick panel. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 10, 2014 Report Share Posted September 10, 2014 When you increase pressure in a long pipe the other side pressurizes almost immediately. Yes the pressure would be pretty much the same anywhere in the pipe, but it will rise much slower than a shorter pipe. There is more volume to fill. Quote Link to comment
scooter Posted September 12, 2014 Report Share Posted September 12, 2014 I'd mount em up front, by the time you get 16 feet of pipe in there and brackets and oil pumps and shit your gonna end up with a laggy overplumbed turd that makes 30 more horse than your stock l16. Plus some drunk idiot (me) will be like cool exhaust whistle and chop his finger off in the spinning turbine wheel if there's only 2 inches of pipe at the back :D When I think of l16 exaust, im thinking perfect tailpipe size to blow up my air mattress campin lol Quote Link to comment
metalmonkey47 Posted September 12, 2014 Report Share Posted September 12, 2014 Does an L16 even generate enough exhaust pressure to spool two turbos? I imagine the lag would have to be WILD, unless it was a compound setup like the 2JZ or RB. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted September 12, 2014 Report Share Posted September 12, 2014 A smaller turbo to match two cylinders will work. If smaller like from a bike maybe they can be fitted beside the engine? 1 Quote Link to comment
housew Posted September 12, 2014 Report Share Posted September 12, 2014 i thought the point of the thread was that he already had 2 tiny turbos. I have a t25 on my sr20det (came stock). a t25 is a small turbo and is good for 250hp max. A t25 is sized appropriately for a 2.0l that can rev this guy has 2 miniscule turbos, good for 100 hp each (200 total) that hes looking to put on a 1.6L. I would say that is probably also appropriately sized. I don't really feel the remote setup though. I would guess they would be small enough to cram in up front, but my l16 knowledge is almost non-exsistent. pic of turbo and how tiny it is, yes it is normally used on bikes. http://www.caferacer.net/forum/attachments/project-builds/8969d1408864171-kz400-new-cafe-looking-some-recommendations-15.jpg I know jeep 4.0L have the ehxaust and intake manifolds VERY close to eachother, and the common solution is a semi-remote setup where the turbo is still technically in the engine bay, but down lower closer to the oil pan, maybe something like that would work. Either way i think it would be awesome if you could tune it right. Good chance 2 tiny turbos would have less lag than one big one too (less inertia) Quote Link to comment
Z-train Posted September 12, 2014 Report Share Posted September 12, 2014 Turbos up front.Heat shield between manifolds and a good electric fan(95 Taurus/Sable) to keep air moving under the hood. Quote Link to comment
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