Project FI

[wingnut]

Not to fear as far as jacking the thread. I don't mind at all and am absorbing as much as possible..

I was curious about the RPM range of the motor because the shorter runner length is more condusive to Hi RPM HP. Longer likes Torque. Selecting cam profiles is important so that things work together at the same time.

I am not real big on ITB setups. With the injectors so far away it could allow the fuel to come out of suspension. Most other TBI's I have come in contact with use a wet manifold. Also the pic I say shows a collision spray design on the opposite side of the TB runner which would make for wet manifold.

Most injectors collide at or near the intake valve and this is what atomizes the fuel. Very few injectors spray a fog of fuel. The internet pics can be misleading. Those pic's were taken with very high fuel pressure to fog the spray. The better atomized the fuel the more resistant to detonation the engine becomes.

OK gotta do some paying work now....I'll be back.

[heirfaus]

Not to fear as far as jacking the thread. I don't mind at all and am absorbing as much as possible..

I was curious about the RPM range of the motor because the shorter runner length is more condusive to Hi RPM HP. Longer likes Torque. Selecting cam profiles is important so that things work together at the same time.

I am not real big on ITB setups. With the injectors so far away it could allow the fuel to come out of suspension. Most other TBI's I have come in contact with use a wet manifold. Also the pic I say shows a collision spray design on the opposite side of the TB runner which would make for wet manifold.

Most injectors collide at or near the intake valve and this is what atomizes the fuel. Very few injectors spray a fog of fuel. The internet pics can be misleading. Those pic's were taken with very high fuel pressure to fog the spray. The better atomized the fuel the more resistant to detonation the engine becomes.

OK gotta do some paying work now....I'll be back.

 

Apples to oranges:confused:

 

Art,

 

Are you talking about ITB's or TBI's? Very different. Yes TBI would SUCK on your upgrade, but if you stay NA ITB's could be fun. This can put your fuel injector right at the valve. I think you might have been confusing the two. BUT if you aren't looking for an expensive challenging project you might want to skip that section. At least I can't think of any simple way to use ITB's with Megasquirt. Also you run into a BIG problem. The most efficient way to run MS is on a MAP sensor. Byron510 put TONS of hours into making his ITB setup, which looks AWESOME, but he found out he had to switch off the map sensor and use the speed density setting, which is not as accurate. It still works, just not optimal.

[bonvo]

I am not real big on ITB setups. With the injectors so far away it could allow the fuel to come out of suspension. Most other TBI's I have come in contact with use a wet manifold. Also the pic I say shows a collision spray design on the opposite side of the TB runner which would make for wet manifold.

 

i cant agree with the individual throttle body statment itb are supirior in alot of ways

 

on the throtle body injection idea though yes it may be crude considering it was efi in its early days but has anyone seriosly thought about this? a tbi would be the easiest way to convert to efi!! just a mounting bracket to the stock manifold and run the wiring that and it would simplify supercharging/turbocharging considerably yes it is simple and crude as far as efi goes these days but definatly more on the simple side of things just my .02

Edited March 13, 2009 by bonvo

[72240z]

I am not real big on ITB setups. With the injectors so far away it could allow the fuel to come out of suspension. Most other TBI's I have come in contact with use a wet manifold.

 

I think you are confused about ITBs. TBI leaves the injector/s MUCH farther away then ITBs.

 

TBI is the least efficient modern injection technique used. Behind sequential and WAY behind ITB.

[wingnut]

OK, I found the link for the ITB'. Those are some sweet looking parts:D

I am messed up on how the do the quote thing on this deal. so please excuse me if some stuff shows up a little wonky:confused:

 

Heirfaus........ Why not take the extrudabody manifolds, weld in some bungs, weld one of their plates to a chopped up factory plenum and call it good? Don't I make things sound sooooo easy:blink::mellow:

 

Well I'm wasting everyones time doing these mental FI gymnastics. My car is in a shed with its parts in at least 6 big boxes. I have a ton of work ahead before I ever get to mounting an engine. I am just curious if anyone has done FI on the L16. Thank you for all the positive posts and it's comforting to know I won't be trying to invent the wheel on this thing.

 

Is it possible to get 150 NA hp out of the L16 or do you have to give her some boost. I realize 50 hp is alot when it started with only 95 to begin with. I know thats such a newbie question, but I figure what the hell. I am a newbie here............LMAO

[bonvo]

out of an L series ive read its possible with ALOT of head work and money in the lower end

[heirfaus]

I know thats such a newbie question, but I figure what the hell. I am a newbie here............LMAO

 

Noob questions are allowed from people actually trying to do something:)

 

No you will not get that much power out of you L16. Byron did a TON of work to his LZ22, including custom ITB, EFI, huge cam, and nice manifold...the whole ball of wax... and only got 120ish at the wheels.

 

You need to turbo it to hit those numbers. I think a turbo L16 would be fun project. Build it strong and hit some nice RPM's. The good thing about that is you can just replace the block and head later for increased CC.

 

 

Why not take the extrudabody manifolds, weld in some bungs, weld one of their plates to a chopped up factory plenum and call it good?

 

Yes you could do this, but why waste the money? Two cheaper ways to do it:

 

For non turbo: Byron's manifold, machined old webers

 

For turbo: Byron's manifold, custom plenum from 240sx(factory 240sx manifold, cut side off, weld on aluminum plate, drill holes for studs to mount)(you don't need itb's on a turbo)

 

Yes you could do it different ways, but why spend the extra money if you don't need to.

 

 

http://www.ozdat.com/ozdatonline/featurecars/Andy/index.html

 

http://www.turbophile.com/feature_cars/paddy_1600.html

 

http://www.turbophile.com/feature_cars/andy_1600.html

Edited March 13, 2009 by heirfaus

[wingnut]

So if i'm reading correctly, the L18 and L20 parts are interchangeable with the L16. Are there any more engines that share parts?

 

Sounds like a Turbo project to me. I've got a buddy with a drive on dyno and we will see what I can wring out of the wee motor before it makes bad noises.:lol:

[heirfaus]

If you are going to do a L motor or some variation you will want a copy of "How to Modify Your Nissan Datsun OHC Motor

 

And Jason Grey's motor specs:

http://the510realm.com/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=2887

 

Almost all your parts questions will be answered in these 2 sources

[Icehouse]

Heirfaus what numbers does your car put down? Wait wasn't it an L20 turbo first? Some day I would like to turbo an L series, just for fun :D MS all the way though, I wouldn't want to mod KA EFI then turbo the engine on top of the already ish tunning. Plus I've seen it done and the KA management on an L20 with a turbo is a total bitch :D

[heirfaus]

Heirfaus what numbers does your car put down? Wait wasn't it an L20 turbo first?

 

Dunno, it's just NA. I was going to turbo it, but then I decided I wanted to do it right. The motor in my car is all stock internals with felpro gaskets. I'd didn't think it would be wise to turbo that. That's why I am building the Z22 block and a U60 head. And this thing is EXPENSIVE!!!! I could have bought 3 full ka swaps with the money in my head :(

[Icehouse]

Dunno, it's just NA. I was going to turbo it, but then I decided I wanted to do it right. The motor in my car is all stock internals with felpro gaskets. I'd didn't think it would be wise to turbo that. That's why I am building the Z22 block and a U60 head. And this thing is EXPENSIVE!!!! I could have bought 3 full ka swaps with the money in my head :(

 

WOW!!!! It would still be fun to blow up the NA engine :D That is the main reason I want to turbo an L series. We end up with so many L's, turboing them to death would be cool :D

[wingnut]

Here it is, at least what I could get to. This baby is literally shoehorned into an old chicken coop.:eek:

I will get more when I move myself and car to my new shop.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I sure hope I did this right. It would suck if I accidently posted my porn collection:lol: