More electrical hell

[ISPKI]

I went by to try and figure out why the fuse for my rear lights keeps blowing. I went to start the car and it will not start. The starter cranks, but, there is seemingly no spark and no fuel. I have not done anything to the vehicle since I drove it a week ago. I tested the ignition coil which is getting power, but the spark plugs arent getting anything.

 

Here is what is confusing the hell out of me. My buddy sprayed starter fluid into the intake (this is before we tested for spark) and the car would not start, BUT, when I turned the key from ignition to ON, it suddenly got a spark and burned up the starter fluid. It didnt fully start obviously because the key wasnt switched to ignition.

 

We tested everything on the schematic from the ignition switch to the coil and everything seems to be getting the right amount of power. I know that my ignition switch is kind of worn out, could the switch itself be the issue? Or is there something else that I can check?

[banzai510(hainz)]

Is this a POint distributor?

There should be a START wire that will bypass the ballast resisitor that goes to the +side coil.

what I do is disconnected the starter wire so motor doesnt come on and find the START wire to the +side coil.

 

This is if you have a point distributor.

 

soemtimes reseating the connector behind the key switch will work.

[ISPKI]

The distributor is not points. I thought a 77 280z was supposed to still have points but I must have been mistaken. or someone changed it over if that is even possible. It does still have the ballast resistor though.

[ggzilla]

The starter cranks, but, there is seemingly no spark and no fuel.

 

No fuel. You should hear the fuel pump run briefly when you turn the key to ON.

 

Have you checked the fuses? That's where I'd start.

 

 

 

I know that my ignition switch is kind of worn out, could the switch itself be the issue?

 

It could cause the spark problem, but not a fuel problem. Btw, 280Z has an IGN switch separate from the Key barrel.

 

 

 

 

1974-1978 Z-cars have electronic ignition. They are not high energy until 1978, but they don't have points.

 

Don't worry about the starter fluid puzzle. That stuff is highly flammable.

 

There should be a START wire that will bypass the ballast resisitor that goes to the +side coil.

Yes, being low energy.

[banzai510(hainz)]

It does still have the ballast resistor though.

doesnt this mean it had points? could be a Pertronix in there.

Im not a Z expert But I dont think they had EI in 74/75 for sure.

[ggzilla]

1974-1977 does still have the ballast resistor, because it is a low energy ignition system.

 

The coil is not high-energy so needs a resistor to cut down the power.

 

Twin Resistor

[banzai510(hainz)]

Im always learning on here!!!!!!!!!

[ggzilla]

The most important thing to know about the early EI units is:

 

* Coil is never connected to 12V. It always goes through the resistor.

 

So anytime you see the dual-ballast resistor, be careful. This includes 1975 B210 CAL model.

 

Factory Service Manual said:

During cranking, electrical current bypasses the secondary resistor, thereby connecting the ignition coil through the primary resistor.

[ggzilla]

ISPKI, the most significant symptom you listed is the lack of fuel. Is the Fuel Pump relay fuse blown? Does the fuel pump sound off when you first turn the key to ON?

 

You can put a pressure gauge on the fuel rail to make sure it is high enough pressure.

[ISPKI]

The fuel issue I am still trying to figure out. It seems that the fuel in the system is draining back into the tank slowly. It isnt a problem until the vehicle sits for a few days, then it is very very slow to start. So slow in fact, that I actually almost killed the battery before it started before. I ended up having to jump it with my other car to start it. I have never been able to hear the fuel pump come on.

 

However, even with starter fluid being sprayed into the engine, it still did not start, so, having the fuel system properly charged isnt going to help anything.

[ISPKI]

I checked all the fuses, none of them are blown. I checked all wire connections from the ignition switch to the coil, its all good. Connections from coil to dizzy are new, cap and rotor are new, wires to spark plugs look new.

[ISPKI]

I still need to test for fuel pressure at the rail.

[ISPKI]

Also - Where is this IGN switch that is separate from the barrel? I didnt see anything in the schematic about it. We tested everything on the schematic and it all checked out. I just am not sure what to check from here.

[ggzilla]

The fuel pump in is the back. So have someone turn the key while you stand near the right rear wheel.

 

The schematic shouldn't show the key barrel, but only the switch.

 

The IGN switch bolts to the rear of the key barrel.

You can pull the six-connector plug off without removing the switch

[ISPKI]

Oh I see. We have checked the fuel pump before for this very same reason. My buddy got under the car and put his head next to it while I cranked it over and he said it does come on, but it does not seem to come on to charge the system when the key is turned to "ON". It seemed to only come on when the key was turned to ignition. I found that the wires under the passenger seat that go through the body and out to the fuel pump are frayed open where they pass through the body. Maybe it is shorting but no fuses are blown and that still doesnt solve the no spark issue.

[ISPKI]

I am starting to wonder if the ignition switch itself is actually causing some of these issues. It is difficult to get the key to go into the switch the right way to allow it to be turned over. Replacements appear to be cheap and plentiful. Unless someone has an idea on what I can test, I think I am going to replace it and see what happens.

[I'm BLUE]

Go here ---> http://www.xenons30.com/reference.html

 

Download and read the factory service manual.

It will tell you what to test ,,, where to test ,,, and how to test on just about everything.

Very easy to read and very user friendly

 

The factory service manual will save you a lot of grief , and money.

 

Check your fuel-pump relay.(these do go bad now and then)

Check your ignition module.

Do you have a lot of moisture in your car ? (windshield leak/missing seals/etc)

 

^^^ the manual above will tell you exactly how to with a mult-meter.

I like using a test light as well where It's allowed.

[ggzilla]

does not seem to come on to charge the system when the key is turned to "ON". It seemed to only come on when the key was turned to ignition

That's normal. The pump will "pump up" and get very quiet after that. A fuel pressure gauge will confirm it's working correctly.

 

New ignition switch are only $20 (but sometime those cheap american brands are bad new out of the box).

[DISLEXICDIME]

sounds like a bad ignition switch i bet you are loosing power to the coil when it is cranking i bet if you get the engine cranking and slowly ease off the key while it is cranking it will hit the sweet spot and start or at least sputter

[ggzilla]

Deslixicdime, there is a bug on your post ... it's distracting me ... haha

[cdub42]

Deslixicdime, there is a bug on your post ... it's distracting me ... haha

 

i tried to squish it. lol

 

i had kinda the same issue with mine when i first got it. it would start up but die as soon as i let go of the key from the start position. new IGN fixed that.

 

with so many electrical hell issues with these cars im suprised there isnt a early Z rewire kit on the market. at least, i havent found it yet.

[ggzilla]

Because a rewire kit woulnt solve your problem - a new ign switch did

[cdub42]

i was more thinking the rewire kit for all the other crap mine has going on right now.

electrical hell,

[oakespreformance]

try holding the key inbetween the start and on position, when i blew my ballast resistor this was the only way id get it to run but if it got to close to the key stop on the start pos it would cut out. and your tail light problem, you may have a ground issue somewhere back there.

[ISPKI]

I actually found that the entire lock cylinder was worn. I tore it apart and installed a new one. I also found that the wires running to the side marker lights were frayed open. I made up a pair of bullet connectors wrapped in heat shrink and liquid tape for sealant and soldered those on. Now I have all the lights working except for the driver side headlight.