Starter problems

[oldschool90]

Ok so I'm working on starting up my truck after I've spent months rebuilding the engine, go to start it up, I get *click* (silence). So I think, OK, everything else is moving freely, must be the starter. So I run down to Autozone and get it tested (sounded like: wrrrrrr), it passes, but they also tested a new one they had in stock (sounded like; WRRRRR) so I buy it, install it, get the engine turned over for oil pressure, put in the spark plugs, go to start it get *click* (wrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, silence). So I do some research, find this web page: Solenoid repair, think 'Hey! I can do that', get the solenoid off the starter, and realize I can't get the plastic cap off because its got a rolled edge to keep the cap on (like this: ) Great. So what should I do next? I cant think of what to do next, other than to attempt to take it back to autozone (dont know if I still have the receipt). Advice?

[banzai510(hainz)]

Our battery cables good? I mean good

battery terminals cleaned with wire brush

 

you install a zx 5 speed an using a old type starter?

 

tell us

 

Sometimes it isnt worth the time to swap them selinoid out.

[Braden]

hey hainz i installed my 5 speed from a z car and i used my original starter but i had to use a solenoid off of an automatic starter because mine went bad, before it used to crank every time and now that i swapped those parts sometimes you can hear the gear turning but it doesnt engange the flywheel and sometimes it does, does it need to be shimmed or something?

[banzai510(hainz)]

I cannot truley confirm this myself as I have not done it.

I heard/thought the bell housing bubble that is there blocks the old type starters.

The Gear Reduction unit does not have the nose pc that sticks out thus I assume hitting the housing(bubble part), This preventing the pinion gear from going out all the way.

Hope this makes sense. I dont know if this happens to all 280zx trans or not w/the old type starters.

 

I have run both stock and gear reduction nissan rebuilds. The ZX are more expensive but I cant really tell if truel ly needed for a 4 banger L motor besides bragging rights

[Braden]

not sure i understood all of that hainz. lol man are you ok, you havent been drinking alot latley have you? just kidding hainz i know your a busy dude. i guess my question was in what case do you need to shim an l series starter? i swapped to 5 speed and about 3 out of 5 times the gear just spins and never engages the flywheel, the flywheel is in great shape and it worked fine before i swapped to the 5 speed and automatic solenoid. should i just buy a rebuilt starter or just swap the solenoid back to the auto starter and swap on the whole auto starter assembly?

[oldschool90]

WOOT!! Autozone is exchanging the starter for me!

about 3 out of 5 times the gear just spins and never engages the flywheel,

 

Get a multimeter and unplug the trigger wire have someone turn the key for you and see what you get. Do it multiple times since it does work some of the time. See if you get about 12v. If not, you've got a break in the wire somewhere or something similar. If you do have power at all times (when the key is engaged), the solenoid might be too weak to engage the flywheel all the time.

[datzenmike]

Ok so I'm working on starting up my truck after I've spent months rebuilding the engine, go to start it up, I get *click* (silence). So I think, OK, everything else is moving freely, must be the starter. So I run down to Autozone and get it tested (sounded like: wrrrrrr), it passes, but they also tested a new one they had in stock (sounded like; WRRRRR) so I buy it, install it, get the engine turned over for oil pressure, put in the spark plugs, go to start it get *click* (wrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr, silence). So I do some research, find this web page: Solenoid repair, think 'Hey! I can do that', get the solenoid off the starter, and realize I can't get the plastic cap off because its got a rolled edge to keep the cap on (like this: ) Great. So what should I do next? I cant think of what to do next, other than to attempt to take it back to autozone (dont know if I still have the receipt). Advice?

 

Stop throwing parts at it and do some trouble shooting. Solenoids either work or they don't. When they don't, usually from a weak battery, they chatter or click.

 

A/ Clean both battery terminals. Then clean the ground where it bolts to the head. Now remove and clean the positive terminal where the battery cable bolts to the starter.

 

B/ Eliminate a crappy battery by using jumper cables from a known good one or swap a good one to try.

 

C/ Are the starter bolts tight to make a good ground to the motor?

 

D/ To eliminate the weak starter signal from the key, jumper a 12 volt signal directly from the battery. Solenoid should click loudly and starter turns.

 

None of the above costs anything. Try ABCD and report what you find.

[oldschool90]

I guess I should have posted this in the first place but didn't have the time

I've already troubleshooted ABCD before I posted this topic

Here's the results

A.) Posts an clamps are spotless (and new, and so is the positive cable to the starter)

B.) Had it hooked up to our running van via new jumper cables

C.) Bolts were tight

D.) Gear clicks loudly, starter does not turn on engine. works fine at Autozone

Added bonus!!! Engine turns easily via grabbing belts, so it's not holding up anywhere

I'm not throwing parts at it. I've already troubleshooted everything before we got the new starter, then this one went out. It worked fine, then it died. Had it tested at autozone too, it passed. Guess it couldn't handle the load after it died.

[banzai510(hainz)]

oldschool

D.) Gear clicks loudly, starter does not turn on engine. works fine at Autozone

 

I would try maybe to add a starter realy so you have a direct 12volt to the selinoid.

 

Ghetto,

If you shim the starter the sarter usually will come out. You want the starter to go more inside. But the old starter has the casing around the pinion . this casing I think hits the 5 speed bellhousing slightly.,Why I say this is a had a starter from a import place years ago that I got for cheap. It looked exactly like a L series starter. It lined up perfect but would not seat fully in the transmission.. I got rid of that starter.

 

To me if the selinoid spins the motor over then its good.

If it clicks , it could be low voltage loss from the key switch.bad battery cables or just a bad selinoid.

L series starters are cheap enough to swap out than fucking with the selinoids in my opinion.

ZX starters are more expensive. but I dont have a 280zx trans ,so this is my best guess.

 

I write this so fast as Im not to be on the computer, so my spelling sucks. Kinda like my torq setting when I do a motor. I go just by feel.

 

I have a stack of new starters. I would swap the 2 different ones in there. then if fixed then I trouble shoot the old one.But this is at My house.

[Braden]

my problem is not the solenoid, the solenoid works every single time hell i can hear the gear spinning like there is no tomorrow, i am getting power, plenty of it, i have all new wiring, its just wierd it almost like the flywheel gear is bad but it worked fine before the swap and i inpspected it and it was fine. i am still using my orginal starter that worked great before the swap, the solenoid went out on it and if i jiggled the wire on it it would work fine, but now i swap in a solenoid off of an auto starter and the solenoid kicks in but the gear doesnt want to engage the flywheel everytime, you can turn it over hear the thing spinning hella fast and you can hear it barely hitting the flywheel but not engaging it, try it a few more times and it will eventually engage.

[banzai510(hainz)]

Ghetto

Your selinoid is good. I already knew that part.

 

Im just saying the pinion is not being thrown far enough out. You could take the starter off and see where the wear marks are on the flywheel. But I would find another starter like a Gear reduction unit. The GR unit the pinion will go out and not be blocked.

 

Maybe the armature part that throws the pinion out is worn.

 

in most bad starters is the selinoid/contacks and moveing parts theat wear. the motors are most times always good.

[oldschool90]

I would try maybe to add a starter realy so you have a direct 12volt to the selinoid.

 

Its not the trigger wire though. The gear engages, it did turn the motor over a few times then died. Its the contacts inside the solenoid that I was trying to get at. Just like in this web page: Link Just didn't know how to proceed getting the cap off and then be able to get it back on.

 

 

These contacts:

 

 

 

 

 

 

And these:

 

 

 

 

 

ghettobraden= threadjacker

But I'm done with this thread anyways

[banzai510(hainz)]

My yellow 510 has a click proplem. I swap starters and still same thing every now and then. It has a 68/69 key switch so I assume its getting old. So if I put in a Start relay Im sure its fine.

I thought it was the selinoid but Im sure the realy would fix this. Hoever I rarely drive the car so it will not get dont as of yet. Some people use the Ford Starter relay or the Blk Light box relay.

 

oldschool

the back side of the the selinoid contacks look worn out.

[datsunaholic]

If the starter spins it's not the wiring or solenoid contacts.

 

The bendix isn't engaging. I've had a few starters do that and the only solution other than rebuilding the starter was replacing the starter. No amount of wiring changes or shims or other stuff will fix when the bendix doesn't work.

 

It's usually a mechanical failure in the bendix, or something is stuck, but sometimes it's just bad gear mesh cause by chewed up teeth on the ring gear.

[banzai510(hainz)]

The bendix isn't engaging. I've had a few starters do that and the only solution other than rebuilding the starter was replacing the starter. No amount of wiring changes or shims or other stuff will fix when the bendix doesn't work. EXACTLY!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

 

thats what I was trying to say on earlier post!

Your a Scholar Datsunaholic!!!!!!!!!!