Z22sT

[philip1]

This engine is all stock internally. so the possibility of breaking a piston are high so I will be careful with the tune. I would love to use a Z24i TBI system and up the pressure to keep the mix happy. Since I'm using the stock carb I'll swap the secondary jet for a larger one to be safely fat under boost.

[datzenmike]

the problem with this is the water droplets no matter how small will erode the blades of the compressor over time

 

 

Here is a p/m to Keith Law on 'The Realm' and his reply. Let me preface this by saying this is 510 with 4.625 rear end and capable of 130+ MPH at over 8K (Jason can correct me if I'm a little low here) At the heart of this car is an L20B with mod Weber blow through with IC and much,much,much more to keep it alive. It hasn't been taken apart for the past 13 years, a tribute to to the builder and Datsun toughness. I recently put down 248 RWHP on the dyno. So is no slouch.

 

Keith hi,

I recently suggested to someone that they inject their alcohol ahead of their turbo and was told that it erodes or damages the compressor blades. Yours is at the cold air inlet at the headlight pot and works. Does it have to be a certain distance away from the turbo? Is this a valid concern?

 

Thanks,

 

mike

 

__________________________________________________________________________________________

 

HI Mike,

 

Actually, I do inject my methanol just before the turbine inlet. I have done this for 30 years, and have had NO erosion problems at all. Another fellow that used to race with me did the same thing. I guess if you were putting huge amounts in, with very large droplets, you might have some problem, over time. I sure have not. I use 2 nozzles, that are staged to come on at about 8 PSI, and then the second one comes on at about 12 PSI. The sprayers are triggered by boost pressure on a Hobbs switch, one for low boost, one for the high boost.

 

The turbine just eats the methanol and homoginizes the spray even more, thus dropping the inlet charge temperature right off the bat..

 

What I spray at the intercooler is just water, again using the wonderful "FOG" nozzles I had found. I only use those at slow speeds, or when stuck in traffic. This can keep the intercooler at ambient temp for the most part. This is a driver actuated system.

 

My methanol system is self pressurizing, so there are no pumps to worry about. I use a lot of methanol when it is under full boost, when both fog nozzles are spraying. My nozzles are about 5-6 inches away from the turbine blades. These fog nozzles are not to be confused with the ones the NO2 guys use.

 

The black bellows hose is the turbine inlet end.

 

Hope that helps, and your suggestion is right on, at least in my 30 years experience!

 

Keith

 

[72240z]

That was nice of you to take the time mike.

 

When I advised using the stock ceramic turbine turbos I thought we were talking water injection. If just methanol then where is the water coming from? I thought methanol didn't turn to water (and carbon dioxide) till AFTER it was burned.

 

2 CH3OH + 3 O2 → 2 CO2 + 4 H2O

 

So ya no wonder he hasn't had any erosion in 30 years, what would do it? lol

There is more water in the air........

[philip1]

hmm could be the nozzles that sent rather large droplets or the rock catcher instead of a proper air cleaner Again this was the Faulk engine so who knows..... I'll go with the nozzle before the turbo all I need to know is what make and part # nozzles Keith uses. the Faulk engine used 4 window washer nozzles that were modified to have a .060 outlet. there must be a better way.

[philip1]

at full song the Faulk engine would ingest a gallon of antidetonant on each 1/4 mile pass and a similar ammount of fuel.

[datzenmike]

Alcohol vaporizes very fast and absorbs heat in order to do so thus dropping the air temp. Water is cheaper but probably makes it to the cc and absorbs combustion heat directly. Perhaps a 50/50 of water/al??

 

Turbo pressure could be used to pressurize the alcohol reservoir and push the liquid to the nozzle in front of the turbo. It would provide more alcohol in direct relation to boost pressure... simple, easy, automatic.

Edited February 21, 2009 by datzenmike

[philip1]

I have just procured a nice webber 32/36 dgav I will build a nice box for this and I'm looking at some nice fogger nozzles from granger. I will have a nice blow through weber and I'll intercool because inevitably I'll turn up the boost.

[datzenmike]

That said, now is the time to think of things that will help prevent the extra stress of a turbo destroying that motor. One thing, also one of the easiest things to add, would be a hi volume oil pump from any Z24i, KA24E or DE RWD motor. This is the sest dollar for dollar up grade there is. I got mine from a wrecking yard for $10 and hot idle pressure went up from 17 to 29 lbs. The relief spring is set for 50-55 lbs but should be shimmed to give 10 lb for every 1,000 RPM you expect to run. 70 lb would be about right.

 

Well it's a start. I have a feeling you are going to have a lot of questions for Mr. Law :lol: Search on the Realm for 'Tales Of the Great Rolling Dyno'. It's a collection of observations, adventures and Porsche kill stories of a turbo 510 owner.

[philip1]

That said, now is the time to think of things that will help prevent the extra stress of a turbo destroying that motor. One thing, also one of the easiest things to add, would be a hi volume oil pump from any Z24i, KA24E or DE RWD motor. This is the sest dollar for dollar up grade there is. I got mine from a wrecking yard for $10 and hot idle pressure went up from 17 to 29 lbs. The relief spring is set for 50-55 lbs but should be shimmed to give 10 lb for every 1,000 RPM you expect to run. 70 lb would be about right.

 

Well it's a start. I have a feeling you are going to have a lot of questions for Mr. Law :lol: Search on the Realm for 'Tales Of the Great Rolling Dyno'. It's a collection of observations, adventures and Porsche kill stories of a turbo 510 owner.

 

I have a 280zx-T oil pump installed already I hope that will be enough I have similar hot idle pressure and my high rpm pressure plateaus at 75psi my biggest fear is detonation this is why I'm planning to keep the boost down but have an overboost option.

 

I was digging around in my spare parts closet and found a TB04 garrett from a Dodge 2.2. I got to thinking that this would be a better match for my engine than the DSM TC04 I have. The draw back is I will need an external wastegate because this turbo is missing the WG housing.

Edited February 22, 2009 by philip1

[DISLEXICDIME]

whee my carb adapter came and since my carb is sealed for boost this will work great.

I got it from a guy who switched to a supercharger from a turbo on his ecotec and since the OD of the TB is the same as the choke horn on my Datsun hehehe...

 

 

I will have to reduce down from this to the boost pipe but at least the hard part is taken care of.

 

whats up with the whit starquest in the background!

[DISLEXICDIME]

here is the car I'm working with...

 

 

 

oops i ment to quote this one

[philip1]

the Starquest is my kid bro's car he recently sent a rod bearing to babbitt heaven something about 13psi and a bad oil pump

[DISLEXICDIME]

benn there

[datzenmike]

I have a 280zx-T oil pump installed already I hope that will be enough I have similar hot idle pressure and my high rpm pressure plateaus at 75psi my biggest fear is detonation this is why I'm planning to keep the boost down but have an overboost option.

 

 

 

Has to be from an automatic, it had the oil cooler I believe. The KA and Z24i are newer and plentiful too.

[philip1]

I bought it from nissan new 10 years ago for another project L20et and found the engine already had one (thanks to the builder)so this shelf dweller went right in as soon as I got this engine.