philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 what about somthing like this for your turbo like what if you were putting up a pic please repost Quote Link to comment
bagged_datsun Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 like what if you were putting up a pic please repost sonofabitch... http://www.jegs.com/i/K%26amp%3BN/599/85-8921/10002/-1 Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 that would work if I were to switch to a Webber but for now I'm probably going to use something more simple like this . Quote Link to comment
mafoose Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 If worse comes to worse can't you just build a box for it? Granted it would mean it didn't have to be sealed but it should work no? Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 a box will work too I just had all the seals installed since I had the carb apart for a rebuild Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 now comes the real tough question where to inject the Water/meth.... I'm thinking down the secondary throat like was done on a certain Drag L-20b. use a fish tank check valve to prevent the engine from sucking the storage tank dry. Another option is to inject the water into the throat of the turbo... I'm not a big fan of this. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 Just spray into the air stream up wind of the turbo. Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 the problem with this is the water droplets no matter how small will erode the blades of the compressor over time Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 the problem with this is the water droplets no matter how small will erode the blades of the compressor over time I don't agree with placement being in front of the turbo but it does provide superior atomization. For only 150-300hp you could use a stock nissan t25/t28, they use ceramic not metal. That solves the erosion problem. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 Keith Law on 'The Realm' has had this set up for years. He does have a cool air inlet on the driver's side high beam headlight pot. The injector is there and there is maybe 2 ft. before the compressor. The alcohol spray isn't considered a problem. Perhaps it is vaporized by then and anyway it's not like it's coming out of a garden hose. The alcohol is used to reduce cylinder and inlet air temp ... another good reason for an IC!!! Keith runs an IC so less al injection is used. I'll contact him and see if he has any secrets about this. Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 Is this still a "200hp" project? About 6-7lbs of boost for 200hp, Idk why meth or al or water injection or ic is even on the table. None of it is even close to being needed for that ap. 5-6psi is stock 280zx and 200sx boost levels, no ic, no nothing and they run for 200k miles easy. The whole point of running low boost is because its dependable, simple, cheap and its immediate. You start adding 3ft of pipe, bunch of couplings, injectors, pumps, reservoirs 50+lbs in shit etc.. you completely defeat the purpose imho. Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 This is true, thanks for reigning me in, got carried away. :o I would keep the water/al injection idea handy because it's so easy to install and it does tame detonation. And being only human, boost levels are going to creep upwards, right? Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 This is true, thanks for reigning me in, got carried away. :o I would keep the water/al injection idea handy because it's so easy to install and it does tame detonation. And being only human, boost levels are going to creep upwards, right? Well I'm only human too. I think boost may creep upward to the 10-12 range max and there will be adequate cooling both chemical and thermal. Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 well I just sold the 280zx turbo but I still have a first gen DSM. I think this will give adequate punch. Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 I was just giving my opinion based on what was said lol now its 10-12, its going to be more like 250hp not 200. For 250 an IC alone is enough to keep it WELL within the safe zone. Don't get me wrong, w/e you want to do go for it. There are all kinds of cool stuff that can be done. You know nos is a chemical intercooler too :-X. I have just been talking need that's all. The 1st gen dsm turbo will get you to 10-12 but its going to be out of its efficiency range, if you keep it that high its going to destroy itself much faster then normal. I'd say run it like 8psi normal and 10-12 when you drag or the situation calls for it but with a carb that's a pita. I'd think 250hp is just about the limits of the stock internals too. No? Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 19, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 stock pistons are the only limiting factor here the rest is all forged steel I plan to keep things really simple and the boost levels will start near zero and creap up slowly to probably 7-9 with an overboost option of 12. I want this engine to last a while so I'm not planning to go crazy. I think 200hp for a DD is going to be enough esp. since it is lighter than most so called compacts now days Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 I disagree, pistons AND rings AND con rods AND hg all fail at about the same rating, 250hp if not THEE limit is going to be damn close. Talking a carbed motor too, it wouldn't be out of left field to lean out and burn up a piston or knock and shatter a ring. Which will go 1st is just a roll of the dice. That was the point I was trying to make way earlier in the thread, balls out or simple I believe was the post. Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 19, 2009 Report Share Posted February 19, 2009 (edited) I forgot to mention the dsm turbos use their own flange type. Idk if you noticed, I find it frustrating..... Edited February 19, 2009 by 72240z Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 I forgot to mention the dsm turbos use their own flange type. Idk if you noticed, I find it frustrating..... I have a nice laser cut flange for this turbo it should make fabricating the manifold or feed pipe relatively easy. Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Ah nice, going tubi or going to weld it onto a cast? Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 I disagree, pistons AND rings AND con rods AND hg all fail at about the same rating, 250hp if not THEE limit is going to be damn close. Talking a carbed motor too, it wouldn't be out of left field to lean out and burn up a piston or knock and shatter a ring. Which will go 1st is just a roll of the dice. That was the point I was trying to make way earlier in the thread, balls out or simple I believe was the post. Hyper-WHAT? http://forum.ratsun.net/showthread.php?t=2159&highlight=eutectic Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 (edited) Hyper-WHAT? http://forum.ratsun.net/showthread.php?t=2159&highlight=eutectic ?? explain at least a little bit Mike. I don't understand what your trying to say with the link. I read it. Edited February 20, 2009 by datzenmike Quote Link to comment
philip1 Posted February 20, 2009 Author Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Ah nice, going tubi or going to weld it onto a cast? Well since I'm a welder by trade I think I could build a manifold but I am also unbelievably lazy so I'll probably take a j pipe and make an adapter from the stock mani up to the turbo. I did make a mani for this when I first put the engine in. here are a few pics of the mani I made (wish I still had it) Quote Link to comment
datzenmike Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Sorry you were mentioning the stock pistons breaking. I always hear about forged being better but not much about how or why. Hyper-eutectic were passenger car pistons to me so I did some research about a year ago to find out more about what they are, where they are used and pros and cons of each. The link was a FYI sort of thing. Quote Link to comment
72240z Posted February 20, 2009 Report Share Posted February 20, 2009 Sorry you were mentioning the stock pistons breaking. I always hear about forged being better but not much about how or why. Hyper-eutectic were passenger car pistons to me so I did some research about a year ago to find out more about what they are, where they are used and pros and cons of each. The link was a FYI sort of thing. Ah I see, well I def learned some things. Thank you I don't mean they will flat out break at 250hp or anything like that I just mean at that point there is like no room for error. If that motor leans out at almost 1bar/250hp they are history. The con rods I'd say have a chance of breaking just from normal abuse at that level. That and stock rings are no where near built to be dealing with that kind of heat/pressure/pinging. Either going to get blow by, polishing/scoring or the one time it gets out of line they will be in pieces. OR maybe the motor runs 5 years with a perfect tune Idk, the odds though lol....... I may be confused too, is this a stock motor or the built one? If built then screw it. If stock then I stand by what I've said. Quote Link to comment
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