85 720 Z24 Emissions Delete?

[DaveZilla]

Wow, how did this thread get like this? The thread went from "how do you do it" to "you shouldn't be doing it". I'm sorry if I offended anyone, just wanted to know how it's done since I've seen quite a few pics on this forum of vehicle engine bays that do not have the equipment. I bought the truck with the intention of fixing up for show, but put it off due to deployments and moving with the military. I'm about to retire in a few months and started working on it again after I took the truck out of storage. I don't plan to retire in Texas, and if I do end up in a state that requires smog, I will ship the truck to my brother in Guam.

 

 

The part that most people fail to realize in this thread is that it's YOUR truck and you are allowed to do what YOU want with it...

Really... think about it... have you Ever seen a car or truck that ran better with a whole bunch of crap hanging off it just because the EPA demands it?

This is another reason why I live in Texas... I can do what I want to MY vehicles... period, if you don't live here, you don't know... if you do live here, then you know exactly what I'm talking about.

 

Now for those who think they need to be the center of attention in every post anyone else answers... Please tell me HOW ANY vehicle can run better or get better milage with all this unnecessary crap hanging off the manifold and plugging up the exhaust? Mine not only got better milage, but it also runs way smoother, as well as having more power

 

Now to answer how I did my fuel return... it was as easy as putting a restrictor in the line so the fuel pressure can reach 3 psi and everything else is bled back to the tank from the stock lines. There's no fuel vent problems with mine nor is there any smell of fuel in my cab or under my hood... unless ya sniff the top of the carb

[datzenmike]

If it runs better without the controls on it then there was something wrong with or they weren't maintained properly in the first place. That's all. The emissions systems back they were very rudimentary and didn't do much like today's vehicles. It would be to no ones advantage to encourage them being removed only to find out later that there are laws that might be enforced if this is found out. We're all big boys here, do what you want but do it knowingly is all.

[Z-train]

1)The part that most people fail to realize in this thread is that it's YOUR truck and you are allowed to do what YOU want with it...

2)Really... think about it... have you Ever seen a car or truck that ran better with a whole bunch of crap hanging off it just because the EPA demands it?

3)This is another reason why I live in Texas... I can do what I want to MY vehicles... period, 4)if you don't live here, you don't know... if you do live here, then you know exactly what I'm talking about.

 

5)Now for those who think they need to be the center of attention in every post anyone else answers... Please tell me HOW ANY vehicle can run better or get better milage with all this unnecessary crap hanging off the manifold and plugging up the exhaust? Mine not only got better milage, but it also runs way smoother, as well as having more power

 

6)Now to answer how I did my fuel return... it was as easy as putting a restrictor in the line so the fuel pressure can reach 3 psi and everything else is bled back to the tank from the stock lines. There's no fuel vent problems with mine nor is there any smell of fuel in my cab or under my hood... unless ya sniff the top of the carb

1)No,you are NOT "allowed" to do what you want with it.

2)Nope-but they didn't run worse either.

3)Again,no you can't do whatever you want with your vehicles.

4)Bullshit.

5)You mean the ones of us that know what the fuck we're talking about? Your power/mpg improvement came NOT from removing SMOG gear,but from fixing a problem that existed.

6)Finally-you got something right.

 

There is no state in this country where it is legal to REMOVE SMOG equipment. In-op SMOG gear is not the same as working SMOG gear.EGR valves when working correctly, have ZERO effect on the engines performance.

[datzenmike]

EGR valves when working correctly, have ZERO effect on the engines performance.

.

Properly working there is no EGR at idle or when the motor is warming up and none a full throttle. There may be a miniscule drop in power in between but is made up for by stepping down more on the throttle. Nothing you will notice. At this point the motor has less work to do sucking air in as the throttle plate is open wider than needed at that speed. EGR also runs cooler and there is less chance of pinging.

 

Now you know your options.

[Kins720]

Thanks for all the info guys, and for the support. With all the dry rot on the emissions lines, most of them broke when I was pulling them off even after twisting to break them free (There were actually only 3 lines connected, 4 with the line that goes to the fuel tank). If the old carb and exhaust was still connected, I probably would've kept the emissions and changed out the canister. But since the EGR was already disconnected, it was a given that the rest of the stuff should come out as well. If I had seen this forum 7 years ago when I rebuilt the old carb, I probably would've stayed with stock. Actually, no I would've done the same thing :) .

 

By the way, if you look at the engine bay picture I posted you'll see a line threaded around the brake lines on the firewall. That was the line the previous owner ran to power the fuel pump. What the hey?!?!

[nismo24096]

Ok just to put in my input since everyone else has had something to say.... the reason I did the smog, egr, etc etc delete to my truck is for the simple fact that I like the less is more look. was there any real benefits to it...NOPE..will it run better?  nope nor will it run any worse, and does it really matter its only got 80 something horsepower anyways..so not gonna be a screamer with or without it.. as I stated before I did it for visual reasons. same reason I'm doing a wire tuck.. which is a pain and gains you nothing...( Nothing showing in the bay) which is what I like.... so if your doing it to clean up the look of your bay..than go for it..just make sure your properly rerouting whats left so the truck still runs properly and that's all that matters.. hell all that really matters is that you enjoy your project truck and it makes you happy working on it...I know that's the only real justification I can find for me buying my truck in the first place...I like building and creating things..  ok  I have said enough now someone else can quote this whole thing and pick it apart...lol

[DaveZilla]

Well thanks for that analysis on my post... I'm proud of you :sneaky:

 

1. YES I CAN and WILL do whatever the fuck I want with my vehicles... Got a problem with that? 1-800-WAAA

2.better or worse... who cares? it's NOT your car that he's working on, it's HIS, get over it

3.Again, I'll do whatever the fuck I want... TRY to stop me

4.Look in the mirror asswipe

5. IF it was YOUR vehicle and YOU would rather fix these things, go for it, if it's NOT yours, let them decide whether they want to delete the stuff or not... it's not yours, get over it.

6. That's a given...

 

Just because YOU choose to do something to your stuff doesn't mean everyone else has to do the same, if you don't like what I'm doing, again, try to stop me. IF someone wants to delete their emissions for whatever reasons they want to do so, I will show them how, it's up to them to get it to pass smog if they live in a state that requires it, or they can remove the stuff and put it back on for the test. In most cases, a well tuned engine will pass anyway by running lower octane gas for the test, retarding the timing to the lowest recommended setting (you can retard it more if they don't check the timing, but there's a limit there too) and setting the air fuel as lean as possible (Weber calls this "lean best idle" and the AFR usually measures around 17:1 or more, it still runs good, but not as good as it can run) then after the test, just restore it back to the way you run it the rest of the year.

 

IF you knew about Texas you'd know that they do have SOME rules about emissions, but most places don't check for this, and anything over 25 years old is exempted anyway, if one place fails you because they're being too strict, it's just a matter of going to the shop next door and they'll pass you... it's pretty much that easy. The thing is to NOT take your car to a dealership or the big name shops in the area, they will have the test equipment and they will use it, but the smaller mom and pop owned shops won't have the test equipment and will just do a regular safety inspection and you're good for the rest of the year.

[datzenmike]

Like a lot of federal laws it's up to the state to enforce them. Seems like Texas doesn't care much, or you seem to think so. Yes you can do what you like but it's a federal offense to tamper, remove or modify the emissions system is the point. If something is illegal from the get go it should at least be brought up and included in the discussion. Weather you think you can get away with it is immaterial. No one said you can't do it... only that you can't do it and expect it to be legal. Ignorance of the law is no defense. There is a risk here, perhaps a small risk.

[Z-train]

 

Well thanks for that analysis on my post... I'm proud of you :sneaky:

 

1. YES I CAN and WILL do whatever the fuck I want with my vehicles... Got a problem with that? 1-800-WAAA

2.better or worse... who cares? it's NOT your car that he's working on, it's HIS, get over it

3.Again, I'll do whatever the fuck I want... TRY to stop me

4.Look in the mirror asswipe

5. IF it was YOUR vehicle and YOU would rather fix these things, go for it, if it's NOT yours, let them decide whether they want to delete the stuff or not... it's not yours, get over it.

6. That's a given...

 

Just because YOU choose to do something to your stuff doesn't mean everyone else has to do the same, if you don't like what I'm doing, again, try to stop me. IF someone wants to delete their emissions for whatever reasons they want to do so, I will show them how, it's up to them to get it to pass smog if they live in a state that requires it, or they can remove the stuff and put it back on for the test. In most cases, a well tuned engine will pass anyway by running lower octane gas for the test, retarding the timing to the lowest recommended setting (you can retard it more if they don't check the timing, but there's a limit there too) and setting the air fuel as lean as possible (Weber calls this "lean best idle" and the AFR usually measures around 17:1 or more, it still runs good, but not as good as it can run) then after the test, just restore it back to the way you run it the rest of the year.

 

IF you knew about Texas you'd know that they do have SOME rules about emissions, but most places don't check for this, and anything over 25 years old is exempted anyway, if one place fails you because they're being too strict, it's just a matter of going to the shop next door and they'll pass you... it's pretty much that easy. The thing is to NOT take your car to a dealership or the big name shops in the area, they will have the test equipment and they will use it, but the smaller mom and pop owned shops won't have the test equipment and will just do a regular safety inspection and you're good for the rest of the year.

 

Read Mike's post above.Read it again.then read it a third time.Tell us how many times it takes for it to sink into your skull.

[Kins720]

Does anyone know what the magnet valve on the driver side of the engine bay firewall is for? The one mounted right above the brake lines. I've looked in the Haynes manual and it just says the wires are connected to the magnetic switch. Emissions chart does not show it as well as the Steering section. I also noticed on the pictures posted that none of the other 720's have it, there are holes for the screws but I don't see it there. I tried to post a pic of what I'm talking about but for some reason it's not working.

[datzenmike]

http://community.ratsun.net/topic/691-how-to-post-pictures-and-keep-online-photo-albums/

[Kins720]

Yeah, I did that. It was the same way I posted those pics before. But the forum is not letting me post any pics for some reason. Even when I click on the image tab and paste the url it's not working. Yeah, I can't right click and paste, nor can I use the image tab. I even tried to paste the url on notepad and copy and paste from there but it's not working.

[Kins720]

Yeah, can't use the image extension even after I typed out the URL. I guess my account access was modified so I can't post pictures.

[Kins720]

 

Ok, messed around with the editing on the code I got from Photobucket. It seems to work now.

[datzenmike]

Just went through you account looks ok to post pictures

[datzenmike]

Where does the vacuum line go.??

 

I've seen this before but forget what the answer was.

[Kins720]

The vacuum line is connected to the check valve in between the booster and the manifold, there's what looks to be another fitting on the other side for another vacuum line, but there is nothing connected to it. Right now the engine compartment is stripped, is it possible that this is for the brake lights? I can't tell until I put everything back together again. It's possible that the previous owner wired it that way, since the fuel pump was rigged the way it was. Thanks for the reply Datzenmike.

[datzenmike]

Not for brake lights.

 

Where do the wire go then? Do they look like 720 wiring or is this home made?

[Kins720]

It looks like wiring harness. The wrap around the harness doesn't look like electrical tape. Here's where it connects.

 

[nismo24096]

Ok it talks about it on page 101 of the haynes book. it goes to the FICD control on your old factory carb. and since you dont have that..it goes nowhere. it basicly controled the idle when the ac kicks on ..aka raises it some to keep you from stalling..due to the drain on the engine.  I removed mine  and just pluged the vac lines on the check valve.. hope that helps you decide what to do with it. 

[DaveZilla]

Same info in the factory service manual... you really don't need it anymore after installing an aftermarket carb, but you could make up some brackets to make your FICD work if you have any stalling issues when you turn on the AC, but I've seen no issues with mine, even with the idle set at 700 rpm or so.

[Kins720]

Thanks for the info guys. I disconnected it and capped the check valve. I couldn't find the darn thing, even though it shows a picture of it on the front of the manual. Was checking out the schematics when I saw your posts. I'm putting the truck back together right now. Going to have to shelve this project, put the truck in storage until I find out where I'm going to settle. I'm keeping all the emissions stuff just in case I end up in a state that requires the inspection.

[Z-train]

Out of El Paso is a good thing.

[Kins720]

I'm going to miss the lower cost of living though Z-train. I was in Hawaii for 3 years before I ended up here and the cost of living there was outrageous. I applied for a job in Sierra Vista, I'm hoping the cost of living is the same as over over there. I've also put in resumes in different parts of the continental US and overseas, will be staying with my brother in Casa Grande until I've done all my interviews, so I'm still up in the air on where to go right now. No kids (if you have kids you're blessed) so I'm not tied down to anywhere right now.