Bigger torsion bars please

[KlassicMotion]

I'm curious how well they will work with such short suspension travel....

 

An '82 720 just popped up on my local CL for $200....  I'm wondering if I should go get...?

[heretic]

If they act progressively & depending on how low he is... I'd imagine pretty good if he can dial in exactly where in the travel the heavier rate began.  

 

 

I'm curious how well they will work with such short suspension travel....

 

 

[heretic]

NOTE: I should say...  yes I do know that torsion bars in & of themselves are progressive... but the gold pieces takes it to another level .... I think :)   

[GRpufnstuf]

I'll post an assembled pic of tirsions before I put them in.

 

Just home from the muffler shop and didn't get pics of the finished product. I got distracted by 7eleven while they finished my exhaust and lowered the lift. Nothing fancy just 1.75" all the way back with a 22" glass pack mid way. And a chrome tip. We couldn't get the sound I wanted while exiting in front of the back tire so I opted for straight out the back.

 

I'll get a couple shots while laying under it I guess.

[GRpufnstuf]

I emailed Sway-A-Way with pics of their confusing instructions and asked which end the adjusters go to.

 

They replied quick with;

 

"The adjusters go to the back of the truck. The longer exposed part of the bar goes to the front. The dust boot is not used at th rear of the bar because the adjuster sits there."

 

Mystery solved

[]2eDeYe]

So now I am even more confused :lol:

[heretic]

That makes sense. NOW get them in & post pics.!!! :poke:  :poke: .

 

I emailed Sway-A-Way with pics of their confusing instructions and asked which end the adjusters go to.

They replied quick with;

"The adjusters go to the back of the truck. The longer exposed part of the bar goes to the front. The dust boot is not used at th rear of the bar because the adjuster sits there."

Mystery solved

 

 

hahahaha :) 

 

So now I am even more confused :lol:

[GRpufnstuf]

 

So now I am even more confused :lol:

 

 

"Awww, come on guys, it's so simple maybe you need a refresher course.

Heyya! It's all ball bearings nowadays.

Now you prepare that Fetzer valve with some 3-in-1 oil and some gauze pads, and I'm gonna need 'bout ten quarts of anti-freeze, preferably Prestone. No, no make that Quaker State...."

 

Registration first then torsions :)

[GRpufnstuf]

Well...

 

These wont fit in a stock 620.

 

 

My transmission crossmember is too close to the stock bars for the big adjuster tubes to fit.

 

I could run them reversed with the adjusters at the front but it would be very close the the exhaust, probably hitting actually. And the the bars would be in opposite SAW's instructions, putting the adjusters out there where they'd get the dirtiest.

 

I am headed to the wreckers tomorrow looking for a crossmember I can mod with some pipe cut outs to clear the new girth.

Then I'll be back in business.

 

While I'm there I'll be looking for late model 620 upper arm spindles and early 720 24mm torsions (just n case). I'll take my calipers along

 

I'm determined to fit these Nismo bars. They are white and gold, they are Nismo, they are coooooool. At east worth a try I think.

[Farmer Joe]

could you snap a pic of the other end of the bars.

 

just the opposite of the last pic. im curious how they instruct to install these.

 

the only way i see them working is if they have the adjuster up under the engine connected to the lower control arm. not super practical, and the opposite of how i thought they would work.

 

if they werent so spendy, id get s set to fool around with, but im not sure if torsions are the way ill stay.

[GRpufnstuf]

Here are the pics I have, I'm out of town for a few days so there won't be fresh shots.

 

 

 

There are 4 splined areas. The inner 2 sets are slightly larger diameter, these are what the adjustable lockout pieces fit in.

 

 

The splines on the "back" (according to SAW) of the bars are right next to each other. It's factory sized spline at the end then big gold adjuster/stop splines next.

 

 

My stock bars are 21.9mm dia. so these are a .5mm larger, and once the lockout starts they turn into 17.5" long torsions instead of 30" (I'm not counting spline length)

 

 

Sway-A-Way specifically told me the golden adjuster is oriented to the rear of the vehicle. They could fit either way and still twist the proper direction but the adjusters would always be moving/twisting at the front and probably get dirtier there too. I'm not ecstatic about the bearing/non bearing surface of the adjuster tube and the end lockout cap. Metal on metal but it only rotates a few degrees I guess. I greased the heavily inside and out.

 

Once I have a spare tranny cross member and get it modded I'll get these in.

I haven't gotten much deeper into it, but it looks like I might need to modify the stock adjusters a bit. It looks like the stock bars go in a little deeper before they engage splines than these new bars can with all the new hardware in the way. SAW did say to leave the dust boot off but I think it'll be a little more than that.

 

I like torsions. Sure they get in the way of some things but overall they are very adjustable (ride height) and not too expensive. And overall a nice low profile spring setup.

 

Mercedes put them on the ML55 SUVs we use at work. So they can't be all bad. This reminds me I should measure up the spares we have, maybe I can have them re-splined. They are a huge diameter. (That's what she said...)

 

 

I think even the airbag guys could use them. You could put a small bag and lever in the factory adjuster and have constant ride height adjustability.

But before someone gets excited and tries it you should probably figure out a bearing setup for the adjuster tube on the frame. I don't think it's meant to have constant rotation in there.

[Farmer Joe]

right on...

 

i measured one of the 620 torsion bars, and i have 32in long from end to end.

 

from the picture, it looks like these are a little more than 33in.

 

now heres my thoughts. with the way a 620 torsion bar and key arm work, these effectively would have to be installed with the gold tubes forward. from what i can find, the HB/d21 has a shorter key arm. its not really a tube that is affixed in a tube in the frame. id say its only 4in long compared to the 620 piece that extends about 8-9in.

 

simply put, theyre designed for a d21 specifically.

 

i think why the instructions drawing has an arrow both ways on either side, would signify how to install for a 620/720 and d21 the other.

 

if it were me, id install them with the adjusters forward, and put some of those rubber deals they put on rancho shocks to protect from the grime.

 

id like to see one actually installed and working.. i remember reading about how these were used in some SCCA hardbody racing series.

 

heres a link... has a bunch of pictures too! http://forums.nicoclub.com/how-to-build-a-hardbody-pro-it-race-truck-t472000.html

 

lol, i guess we can shew on that for a while...

[GRpufnstuf]

They are 32.5" long without the dust caps on the ends. That measures out e same as my stock torsions

 

I'm going to continue trying to install the recommended way until I've exhausted the possibilities. Then I'll resort to redoing my new exhaust to fit around the adjustable stops mounted in the front.

 

Then, if that fails I I don't like the handling I'll try some of the 720 24mm bars

[Farmer Joe]

im curious on how theyll work in that fashion on the 620.

 

if they want it to still use the factory key arm, im wonderin how you keep it and have the adjuster at the same end.

 

i know the torsion bar goes a good 5-6 inches into the key arm. theres only like an inch of splines when you have the gold tube and lock piece on it.

 

they way i see it, youll have to cut the torsion bar crossmember out, and put one from a HB to get it to work like SAW says.

 

lol, sorry if im over observing this... it has me intrigued!

 

later.

[GRpufnstuf]

Well, that recessed spline on the factory adjusters is my main concern now.

Last time I had mine out it only looked like maybe the "nose" that sticks out of the frame would need to be trimmed. If it goes deeper than that I'll be running the exhaust differently.

 

I'll pull mine off and see how deep I need to go before I get all crossmember moddy.

 

Can you link me the Rancho seal you were talking about? I looked but didn't see anything that I though would work

[Farmer Joe]

heres a link to the shock boots i was talkin about.. 

 

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/ran-rs1950?seid=srese1&gclid=CMnExdGwsLoCFcU5QgodKD4A8A

[GRpufnstuf]

BOOM! I'm too lazy these days to update two threads with the same thing.

 

Look over here >>> http://community.ratsun.net/topic/57391-my-73-620-project/page-7?do=findComment&comment=1026974

[GRpufnstuf]

Ok quickie update.

 

Nismo bars are in and working great!

 

Got about 400 miles city/hwy on them and they are a huge improvement over the little stock bars, at least in a lowered 620.

 

Part of the improvement is probably that these are a better match to my mostly stock rear springs. Now it's firm all around and riding nice. Even on LA's less than sterling streets.

 

I'm now thinking about a little larger sway bar for the front and a small one for the back end.

 

And once I get my disc front end swapped in I'll be looking at drop spindles down the road for a little more travel.

 

That's all for now, see you all around the forum.

[Farmer Joe]

so have you gotten em to engage the stiffer half of the spring yet? 

 

im pretty sure this is the way ill go with my truck.. they sound like what ill be needing. 

[GRpufnstuf]

They definitely engage the secondary. I have them set at just under 1/8" clearance to the stop (min allowable adjustment is 1/16") which the instructions say should be a little less than 1" of 'soft' travel at the wheel. I don't notice the small road chatter bumps and when I get into any kind of up down whoops I can feel the stiffness and rebound. It's nice and I don't think I've bottomed on the LCA stops yet.

 

Now I'll need real shocks in the front. I put in a decent set of Pinto shocks and they were great on the stock bars but they definitely aren't setup for this stronger rebound. I don't expect they'll last.

 

And that means I need to decide how to lengthen my shock mounting.

Seems like modding the upper mount is easy enough, but when I go to drop spindles that might be too long.

Yello620 told me he modded his LCAs to move the lower shock mount down. I think I'll go that route. That way I have reversibility when I do the drop spindles, 15" wheels, vented rotors etc...

[ol' 320]

This sounds good. Are you talking like a 1 inch cup pocket in the LCA? And something like KYB Gas Adjust shocks?

[GRpufnstuf]

1-1.5" looks to be the max I could do before the shock body started getting in there I think. But it should be enough.

 

Probably not using a gas adjustable or spring over shock. I don't want to add load to the shock mounts.

 

I'll probably make the LCA fit either a Tokico or Bilstein shock. I've had both in my Volvos over the years and diggem. The Tokicos in my current driver, '71 142e, are REALLY nice.