My truck VIDEO 2mins of driving and boom Rear end lets go

[Buzzbomb]

And yes the engine numbers on the heads and on the block match a 1967 Chevy Corvette made in November of 1966.

 

Oh yeah? :rolleyes: LOL

 

What's with the general 'tude anyway? Just suggesting you do it right ONCE so you don't have to do it again...No need to be so defensive, is there? Geez...Sorry abour your job, sorry about your truck, sorry I don't go over each post with a fine tooth comb, and sorry I dare ask about your 327 :eek: .

 

Hope you find a rear end that will last longer than your next oil change...

Edited April 12, 2009 by Buzzbomb

[mike]

I was checking into swapping 5 lug GM disks (80s monte/cutlass/regal) onto the front of my 77KC and was checking into a rearend to keep it all one lug pattern with an affordable LSD. The early S-10 rears will fit under and still have room for tires (youll have to redo your spring perches) and theyre friggin cheap. With a bit of google action you can find all the measurements of the axles along with gear ratios per option package on the truck. I think I found a list on a street rod site (maybe HAMB) A bonus is that posis are damn near a dime a dozen but the downside is that its still a 28 spline 10 bolt...

 

For the front you need to make some caliper brackets for the GM calipers and machine the ID of the wheelbearing to fit the datto spindle and figure out mounting a master cylinder.

 

Do you have enough of the gears and housing stuff left on the inside to weld your old one up (lincoln locker) or did everything get trashed? That would probably be the cheapest next to a new/replacement datto third member.

 

This is just an idea but check the width on an early bronco and see if the 9" will fit under. Theyre small bearing in the earlier ones and I dont know the spline count/interchange of shafts, but if theyll fit you could have the rear hubs drilled to the 6x4.5 bolt pattern.

[datzenmike]

The most common H-190 truck rear end is the 4.375 35/8. Was used in the 521/L16 and all 620s except the '74 automatic and the '79 standard. I think a little low for a 327 myself. A 3.889 35/9 or 3.70 37/10 from a later 720 would be easier on gas and make better use of the torque. Because it's an open diff, when the one tire breaks loose all the power is routed through the now furiously spinning pinion mate gears. They won't survive this for long and fail, or the pinion shaft falls out and takes the crown teeth out. I had one fail a couple of years ago, but not from a one tire fire. It leaked the fluid out and I didn't notice until it was growling and clunking. The pinion gear was so loose it had moved inward and was grinding against the housing that the crown is bolted too. Caught it just in time.

 

 

Undo the drive shaft, remove the 4 X 17mm nuts behind each backing plate, pop the axle outward about 3-4" to clear the diff splines: hang onto those copper shims, (you may have to undo the brake line to do this) remove the 10? 12mm nuts on the diff housing and pull it forward and out. WATCH IT, IT'S HEAVY!

 

Pop new one in, use Permatex Blue gasket maker to seal it. Put everything back in reverse. No shortening, no welding new spring perches, same brake cylinders and shoes/drums, same wheel bearings. Nothing changes but the broken parts.

[mike]

I was checking into swapping 5 lug GM disks (80s monte/cutlass/regal) onto the front of my 77KC and was checking into a rearend to keep it all one lug pattern with an affordable LSD. The early S-10 rears will fit under and still have room for tires (youll have to redo your spring perches) and theyre friggin cheap. With a bit of google action you can find all the measurements of the axles along with gear ratios per option package on the truck. I think I found a list on a street rod site (maybe HAMB) A bonus is that posis are damn near a dime a dozen but the downside is that its still a 28 spline 10 bolt...

 

For the front you need to make some caliper brackets for the GM calipers and machine the ID of the wheelbearing to fit the datto spindle and figure out mounting a master cylinder.

 

Do you have enough of the gears and housing stuff left on the inside to weld your old one up (lincoln locker) or did everything get trashed? That would probably be the cheapest next to a new/replacement datto third member.

 

This is just an idea but check the width on an early bronco and see if the 9" will fit under. Theyre small bearing in the earlier ones and I dont know the spline count/interchange of shafts, but if theyll fit you could have the rear hubs drilled to the 6x4.5 bolt pattern.

[72 327]

Oh yeah? :rolleyes: LOL

 

What's with the general 'tude anyway? Just suggesting you do it right ONCE so you don't have to do it again...No need to be so defensive, is there? Geez...Sorry abour your job, sorry about your truck, sorry I don't go over each post with a fine tooth comb, and sorry I dare ask about your 327 :eek: .

 

Hope you find a rear end that will last longer than your next oil change...

 

No attitude here. Sorry if it came across that way. I did reread what I wrote and it did seem kinda rude. Sorry about that. I have been question a few times on the 327 so about 6 months ago I did some research since Im in pretty good with a couple corvette clubs and was able to find the info. I dont know why some people (not you) hammer me in PM's about the 327 as if it really mattered. They have questioned the HP of the motor and the fact it came out of a vette. I have been told it was probably a 327 out of a 60's truck, So thats why I now have the prof and information of the motor. haha funny thing is I dont really care I just posted what it was and I get shit about it. Maybe a bit jaded about the motor. oh well moving on....

Edited April 12, 2009 by 72 327

[72 327]

The most common H-190 truck rear end is the 4.375 35/8. Was used in the 521/L16 and all 620s except the '74 automatic and the '79 standard. I think a little low for a 327 myself. A 3.889 35/9 or 3.70 37/10 from a later 720 would be easier on gas and make better use of the torque. Because it's an open diff, when the one tire breaks loose all the power is routed through the now furiously spinning pinion mate gears. They won't survive this for long and fail, or the pinion shaft falls out and takes the crown teeth out. I had one fail a couple of years ago, but not from a one tire fire. It leaked the fluid out and I didn't notice until it was growling and clunking. The pinion gear was so loose it had moved inward and was grinding against the housing that the crown is bolted too. Caught it just in time.

 

 

Undo the drive shaft, remove the 4 X 17mm nuts behind each backing plate, pop the axle outward about 3-4" to clear the diff splines: hang onto those copper shims, (you may have to undo the brake line to do this) remove the 10? 12mm nuts on the diff housing and pull it forward and out. WATCH IT, IT'S HEAVY!

 

Pop new one in, use Permatex Blue gasket maker to seal it. Put everything back in reverse. No shortening, no welding new spring perches, same brake cylinders and shoes/drums, same wheel bearings. Nothing changes but the broken parts.

 

I think that is what Im going to do. Ill go out monday and pull it apart and see whats broken inside. No need putting a whole rear end in if I only need the 3rd member (cheaper to). Thanks for posting the numbers of teeth I could not seem to find that info. I do relise it will fail again if I pound on it, it will probably fail just from normal use and the tranny shift kit.

A 3.889 or a 3.7 from a 720 is the same rear end? as far as perches and yoke? If so and I do need a rear end thats the way Ill go.

[LCDC]

72 327, couldn't you just buy an old chevy for a few hundred bucks and throw that rear end on there for a while, like out of an old chevy pick up that had a 350 in it? i'm sure it would be wide but it would be drivable for the mean time. Thats what us rednecks up here in idaho would do on a low budget anyway.

[Buzzbomb]

No attitude hear. Sorry if it came across that way. I did reread what I wrote and it did seem kinda rude. Sorry about that. I have been question a few times on the 327 so about 6 months ago I did some research since Im in pretty good with a couple corvette clubs and was able to find the info. I dont know why some people (not you) hammer me in PM's about the 327 as if it really mattered. They have questioned the HP of the motor and the fact it came out of a vette. I have been told it was probably a 327 out of a 60's truck, So that why I know have the prof and information of the motor. haha funny thing is I dont really care I just posted what it was and I get shit about it. Maybe a bit jaded about the motor. oh well moving on....

 

Well...I appreciate the apology. I wasn't grilling you about your motor, I was just curious about it. I made a few rude comments in my follow up post, but deleted them because it was unnecessary. I think everybody is jaded about those engines because of their market value. You do have to admit that in Chevy circles, everything over 307 is sometimes known as a "Corvette Motor", and that's why people are skeptical. If you have the paper work to back it up, and the number over the oil filter on the block + the numbers on the top of heads = Corvette 327, then so be it. The doubting Thomas's of the Corvette world can certainly be harsh, especially if one of "their" motors is in an early 70's Datsun truck. That is about as sacreligious as one can get in some of their eyes!

 

Hope you find a rear end, I still think something out of a Chevy junker would be the way to go, but I certainly understand the financial pinch. A 75+ Camaro or Nova (2 or 4 dr) rear end (cause they're cheap) would work with some mods..Both are leaf spring vehicles.

 

If you can stay out of it, I'm sure the Datto rear end will hold up, but cmon..It's a Datsun truck with a v8..Who could stay off the gas?

Edited April 12, 2009 by Buzzbomb

[datzenmike]

I think that is what Im going to do. Ill go out monday and pull it apart and see whats broken inside. No need putting a whole rear end in if I only need the 3rd member (cheaper to). Thanks for posting the numbers of teeth I could not seem to find that info. I do relise it will fail again if I pound on it, it will probably fail just from normal use and the tranny shift kit.

A 3.889 or a 3.7 from a 720 is the same rear end? as far as perches and yoke? If so and I do need a rear end thats the way Ill go.

 

I have an '81 720 rear with 4:11 and it bolted right into my '78 620. Avoid 4X4 rears as they are 4.375 up to '83 and 4.11 after. Plus somewhere along the line the yoke changed. 2wd should be fine.

 

If you are ever hunting rear ends and want to know what ratio was installed in a 720 truck at the factory, look on the pass side inner fender just below the hood hinge. There is a credit card size aluminum tag with that info stamped on it. Here's on from an '83 or newer, older ones are similar. Down near the bottom left it says TRANS/AXLE ...... FS5W71B...... HF 38. The FS5W71B is the tranny and the HF38 stands for H-190 3.889 ratio. If it said HF41 that would be 4.11 ratio, HF43 4.375 and so on. Makes shopping so much easier. This was what was installed at the factory and remotely possible it could have been swapped.

 

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/720%20stuff/720stuff060Large.jpg[/img]"]

[72 327]

I have an '81 720 rear with 4:11 and it bolted right into my '78 620. Avoid 4X4 rears as they are 4.375 up to '83 and 4.11 after. Plus somewhere along the line the yoke changed. 2wd should be fine.

 

If you are ever hunting rear ends and want to know what ratio was installed in a 720 truck at the factory, look on the pass side inner fender just below the hood hinge. There is a credit card size aluminum tag with that info stamped on it. Here's on from an '83 or newer, older ones are similar. Down near the bottom left it says TRANS/AXLE ...... FS5W71B...... HF 38. The FS5W71B is the tranny and the HF38 stands for H-190 3.889 ratio. If it said HF41 that would be 4.11 ratio, HF43 4.375 and so on. Makes shopping so much easier. This was what was installed at the factory and remotely possible it could have been swapped.

 

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/720%20stuff/720stuff060Large.jpg[/img]"]

 

 

Cool yah goin got try a Pick and Pull tomorrow. I have a we pull you buy place that Im sure has one but last resort cause more $$$. I got the location and numbers off another website. I just could not find any information on if a d21 2wd is the same as the early 70s.

37= 3.70

38= 3.88

41= 4.11

43= 4.37

46= 4.62

 

Also what rear ends

 

H190 (ml)

A: 3.364, 3.545

B: 3.700, 3.900, 4.111

C: 4.375, 4.625, 4.875, 5.143, 5.429

H190A (ml) -12mm ring gear bolts

A: 3.545, 3.700, 3.889

B: 4.111, 4.375, 4.625

C: 4.875, 5.143, 5.429

[72 327]

72 327, couldn't you just buy an old chevy for a few hundred bucks and throw that rear end on there for a while, like out of an old chevy pick up that had a 350 in it? i'm sure it would be wide but it would be drivable for the mean time. Thats what us rednecks up here in idaho would do on a low budget anyway.

 

well an old chevy rear end is about 4" wider on each side. So with my tires all ready sticking out about 1/2". 4 1/2" would kinda look silly. At most of our J/Y here its the same price on a Chevy or a Datsun rear end. For ease of use I prefer to just stick another Datsun rear end in there until I get the Jeep rear end fixed up. Until then just see what this one can take a guess. If she blows I hope its with in the next 90 days because of the warrenty. LOL

[Farmer Joe]

so i didnt catch the answer to what rearend it ended up being? its a stock datsun axle? just tryin to catch up lol

 

oh, and what vehicle had the 3.54 gearing? id like to have a set of gears like that.

[72 327]

so i didnt catch the answer to what rearend it ended up being? its a stock datsun axle? just tryin to catch up lol

 

oh, and what vehicle had the 3.54 gearing? id like to have a set of gears like that.

 

As far as my rear end. I have a feeling its a 73 (built in 72 may also be in 521s also but Im not sure) These are the only aluminum rear ends, after 73 they are maleable cast iron. I had my buddy at his house today scratch the paint and he said its aluminum so a stock 73 rear end is what Im thinking.

RECYCLING hmmmmm wonder how much Id get in for that. hehe

 

The 3.54 gears where in these....not sure if it was at or mt specific or not.

H190A-ml D-21 2wd 4cyl (at from 12/85 & mt from 1/86) these are the easy one to figure out if you are in the J/Y they have the plate on the firewall passanger side as datzenmike said.

 

on the plate its going to say HF35

Edited April 13, 2009 by 72 327

[Farmer Joe]

hmmm, im gonna have to check out the 720s and early hardbodys at the junkyard. id really like to have a set for my kingcab. the 5 speed helps, but it needs some taller gears. it just tops out too fast still.

[datzenmike]

Only the early D-21 HB with Z24i motor had the H-190A rear end. It came with 3.70 manual and 3.889 auto.

 

If you can find an '84-'86 720 with the Mileage option (came with a small Z20S) it will have an H-190-ML and 3.364 37/11 ratio, or is that too low?

 

The stock '73 had the aluminum case but would have had 4.375 ratio unless changed. In fact if 3.54 gears were installed into the aluminum carrier this could have led to the failure. Some AL, ML and A type gear sets won't swap carriers with out spacers to shim the crown closer to the pinion to get the correct lash. The 510 wagon and the Roadster also used the aluminum case but with different side gears.

 

http://forum.ratsun.net/showthread.php?t=11158 (4.375)

Edited April 13, 2009 by datzenmike

[Wharf Rat]

Glad to hear your doing just a swap out, like you say it will last as long as you don't go crazy with it. Then later when the dough flow is better you can look for something more rugged.

 

Clean the debre field out well in that housing:)

 

Your truck doesn't weigh much so ....... if that has a stocker in it my bet is she finaly just blew the spiders out of it. Was it it a LSD or a locker, homemade locker (weld job) ? I want to see pics of your new paper weights.

 

DatzenMike I just want you to know that I apreciate all the brains and help you give this motly crew:)

[datzenmike]

Yeah, spider gears. The ones that turn the side gears... and thank you Wharf Rat.

 

Usually an H-190 will take a lot of abuse from an L motor. :lol: The H-190 is under 7.5" which is light for a V-8 and 300hp. My 340 Dart was 300hp and it ran an 8.75" rear, which is around an H-222 equivalent. D-21 HB and Pathfinders use an H-233 which is just slightly bigger than a Ford 9". It should handle a V-8 as long as there aren't too many one wheel smoke shows. The HB is a leaf spring but the Path is coil, however the Path third member does come with factory LSD and a choice of 4.625 and 4.375 ratios. The carrier will swap into the D-21 leaf spring axle. One other thing about the Path.. it also has optional rear disc brakes. Swap the path carrier and axles into a D-21 axle and buy it. The down side is that the axle is 150cm or 59" wide between the rims.

 

Here's the Path I'm working on. I've cut the coil spring mounts off. A D-21 would be less work but there weren't any around plus this has the rear discs.

 

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/720%20stuff/Pathfinder--D-21conversion031Large.jpg[/img]"]

 

Here the axle tube is cleaned up:

 

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/720%20stuff/Pathfinder--D-21conversion035Large.jpg[/img]"]

 

And painted:

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/720%20stuff/Pathfinder--D-21conversion045Large.jpg[/img]"]

 

Here's the H-233 or 9.18" with LSD:

 

http://i138.photobucket.com/albums/q251/datzenmike/720%20stuff/Pathfinder--D-21conversion027Large.jpg[/img]"]

 

It's a bit wide but maybe a different off set for the rear rims?

[72 327]

I went to the J/Y today and found a rear end that will get me by. Its a little tall for my liking since I think I have 4.7?? in my truck now. I got the HF37 (3.70) out of a 85' the only one they had and for $60. I save some money and my truck will be on the road again. Yah me, and a couple pics. So I will be going out tomorrow to change it out and get back on the road with it. Ill get pics of the old rear end should be pretty messy.

 

 

Edited April 13, 2009 by 72 327

[72 327]

datzenmike:

 

Just wanted to thank you for clearing a few thing up for me and thanks for the help.

 

also PCD thanks for the info.

 

although Fineline doesnt know he helped though other posts of his did.

Edited April 14, 2009 by 72 327

[72 327]

Well this whole rear end swap has been shitty.

 

First off the 86 rear end (720) is not compatable with the 620's at least not the 73-78s, its also 1" wider which doesnt matter to me cause my tires stick out anyway. The input flange on the rear end is a different size and spline is different. At this point I would have been better off getting my Jeep Dana44 rear end together.

 

Heres the run down so far. With the 86 rear you have to buy a N2-2-899-1 Datsun 1310 flange and a 3151-15 1310/Datsun U Joint (numbers are from boxes I got from drive line shop). To the sum of 103.70. This allows you to use a Drive line from a 620 and adapts the 720 (86' up) rear end(could not use a stock 720 drive line since I have a TH350 tranny adapter on the front of the drive line allready) . Also I have to get M12-1.25 Long shaft(1 3/8" or so) axel nuts at $3 each x 12 because I have old school Craiger SST rims.

 

So with a $60 rearend (that I cant return, Tried) $103.70 for the flange and U joint and $36 for the damn lug nuts. I have $200.70 into this project. Shitty day for sure. Better than $250+tax for a 620 rear end but about the same as fixing the Jeep one. I love temp fixes...

 

I really hope the brake lines are the same. If not Ill be running down pats for that to.

 

Sorry had to vent..

 

Pic of 86' (bottom) and 73' (top) 73' is a bit larger by 1/4" But the pearches line up and so do the inputs.

 

 

U joint specs 3151-15 1.102/1.063 2 in/ 2 out 2.205/3.218 Nissan/1310

Edited April 16, 2009 by 72 327
add pic

[datzenmike]

I have an '81 720 rear with 4:11 and it bolted right into my '78 620. Avoid 4X4 rears as they are 4.375 up to '83 and 4.11 after. Plus somewhere along the line the yoke changed. 2wd should be fine.

 

Sorry, I know the yoke and spline changed around '82-'83 for the 4X4. Figured the 2wd would be OK. :o

 

Once converted you will have a wide variety of 720 gears to choose from if/when it blows again.

[72 327]

Sorry, I know the yoke and spline changed around '82-'83 for the 4X4. Figured the 2wd would be OK. :o

 

Yeppers yoke changed in 2wd also. Oh well maybe this post will help somebody in the future.

 

Do you know if the brake lines are the same threads?

[510er]

I skimmed most of the thread, and figured i would throw this out there, your looking at using the Dana 44 eventually and im a jeep guy, i swapped a ford 8.8 in place of my dana 97 wrangler, came with disk brakes and a locker picked it up for 100 bucks, they are within an inch width as the dana and just about as awesome

[72 327]

I skimmed most of the thread, and figured i would throw this out there, your looking at using the Dana 44 eventually and im a jeep guy, i swapped a ford 8.8 in place of my dana 97 wrangler, came with disk brakes and a locker picked it up for 100 bucks, they are within an inch width as the dana and just about as awesome

 

 

Are they an Inch longer? Im looking at I think a total width of 56" with the Jeep rear and only having to swap out the axel tube. I happen to know a couple guys with parts and they are almost free. Im using 2 of the short sides axels so no remaking the axels.

[whitechef]

I've got an 80s chev PU that you're more than welcome to the rearend. No charge just come pick it up. I'm in northern CA.