1984 Datsun Maxima Wagooooooon! HRH's new summer daily. (Wynona)

[Chuck Most]

Then, what about style?  Have you seen the gaudy crap American Racing puts out that people actually run on their rigs?  Grotesque.  Not clean designs, fake bolts everywhere, but chunky spokes with gold flake and shit. 

I know. It's sad. American Racing put out some of the best looking wheels "back in the day", but it seems like nowadays they're just making shit for Featherlite trailers...

...and bro-dozers...

[captaingamez]

Then tell American wheel manufacturers to start making cool J-spec stuff.  That's where it's at.  I know good quality wheels are just that, but realistically, those XXRs I got are excellent quality.  As good as any factory wheel I've seen.  Clean molds, clean casting, strong enough to be beaten the crap out of and not break.  I love America, but no American companies want to make styles of wheels I like in styles of bolt patterns and offsets that fit.  That's their problem.  By rights, I should shun Datsun and drive a 'murican car!  Then I'd have tons of choices!  And they'd all be over-priced.  I can't justify spending 400-800 per wheel unless its for a racing wheel that is so light it can be picked up by a baby.  That I would pay for the engineering.

 

Then, what about style?  Have you seen the gaudy crap American Racing puts out that people actually run on their rigs?  Grotesque.  Not clean designs, fake bolts everywhere, but chunky spokes with gold flake and shit.  If morons want to spend their hard-earned money on that, I'll spend mine on Phillipino wheels that are good quality and reasonably priced.

Thats all fine, but what is your defense on spending the same money you are currently spending on vintage, period correct Japanese wheels?

 

And just how in the heck do you not make profit on an $825 wheel??!!!  

 

Forged Wheel Blank $200+

Polishing  $110+

chroming $150+

bearings, hubs $100+

assembly  $50

shipping materials  $10+

spacers/axle/speedo drive  $50

 

Total $670+ it costs us to make the wheel. depending on size. And that doesnt count my comission, the programing and design for all the components, and doesnt consider possible broken tools or tool wear in the machines or electricity.

[q-tip]

Polished and chromed? I just found a way for you to make more money, just sell it polished.

[captaingamez]

We do. But its motorcycle wheels ya know, people love chrome.  There is a higher proffit margin in car wheels because they dont need assembly (unless 3 piece) and they dont need hubs bearings and specific hubset fitments. But still not the point.

[HRH]

Time to diversify your business into other areas then.  Start making stamped or forged wheels in a "budget" line.  Start making other motorcycle parts, etc.  Just saying.  If you sell really nice buggy whips and there are less and less buggys, you have to do something else.

 

As for spending money, I don't care if the skilled craftsman is Phillipino or Japanese.  If they make a nice wheel, I'm running it.

[HRH]

Oh, and Nissan got back to me and FAILED!!!  I meant to call them today.  I don't know how they couldn't dredge up production numbers for 810 Maximas.  Someone at Nissan has to have that information.

[captaingamez]

Time to diversify your business into other areas then.  Start making stamped or forged wheels in a "budget" line.  Start making other motorcycle parts, etc.  Just saying.  If you sell really nice buggy whips and there are less and less buggys, you have to do something else.

 

As for spending money, I don't care if the skilled craftsman is Phillipino or Japanese.  If they make a nice wheel, I'm running it.

You know what man, your right, I am not going to rant about this because guys like you care about one thing

 

Price.

 

Not understanding how the wheel industry works, not that you can get the designer of your wheel on the phone or ask questions to him, not helping innovative companies pay the bills and continue innovating. Not that an American will go and be able to live his passion manufacturing beautiful wheels. Its price.

 

It doesnt matter how much people explain something, even from the perspective of someone who makes wheels and feeds his kids that way. And it wouldnt matter if an American company were to make designs that you like, because they couldnt do it at Rotas price people like you will never buy them anyway. So please dont wonder why we wont appeal to that market, cause nobody would buy them unless they were $500 or less a set

[HRH]

That's just it, they should be able to do it at or near Rota price.  If the Phillipinos can make a badass looking wheel for 80 bucks, sell it for 140 or whatever, an American company should be able to make that same wheel maybe double the cost.  It shouldn't be much more.  If I had to pay $200/wheel for some USA wheels that looked as good and functioned as good as the Phillipino Rotas, I would pay the extra scratch and buy them.  If I had a Ferrari, I'd pay more than $500 for a single wheel.  But I don't.  I drive a Datsun.  Datsun owners are inherently cheap.  I'll spend $1100 in parts and labor rebuilding a motor, but it needs to last.  Wheels just look pretty and roll down the road.  If there were issues of quality, of them falling apart, then yes, I'd reconsider.  (Granted, I do care about price to some degree because I'm not buying 80/wheel China knock-offs.)

 

I'm sure the wheels you make ARE worth the price, but it's rather apples and oranges comparing motorcycle wheels to car wheels.  Motorcycles definitely are used more as art than cars are.  And if you want something truly unique and hand-made, then yeah, expensive custom wheels are the way to go.  But you are right, Datsun owners aren't your market.  Dentists and doctors who drive 30k Harley-Davidsons are.  I'm sure they will buy your wheels.

 

And I still love you, man... ;)

[captaingamez]

In all frank honesty, its all the same crap. Car wheels, motorcycle wheels, ect ect.

 

There have been thousands of sets of Rotas that have come apart, so there are definitely some serious inherent quality concerns.

 

I guess I just feel my car deserves good wheels regardless of how much my car is worth.

 

Its about looking at things as assets rather than liabilities. And you are looking at wheels as a Liability you have to spend money on, I look at them as an asset.

 

I was going to sell you SSR Reverse Mesh for like $400-500 and you could have cleaned them up and sold them for probably $1400.

 

Assets vs Liabilities.

[HRH]

I do appreciate that, but they're not the style I want, and unfortunately not the offset either.  The other part is if I'm at NAPA, marking up the part makes sense.  However, with Datsun things, I don't buy stuff for peanuts and sell it for gold.  I'd feel bad.  If It's something I've made, that's a different story, but buying and reselling?  I reserve that for business only, not pleasure.

 

As far as Rotas breaking, meh.  I'd say 99% of that is driver error, possibly some bad castings, but damn near any wheel from any manufacturer can have that happen.  Also depends on the wheel design.  I'll check these for stress cracks after some running around, but if they're anything like the XXRs on the autocross Maxima, I don't think I have anything to worry about.  I'm also not getting the weak super spindly wheels.  These are fairly large, the chances of failure are much less from the basic shape.  Plus I know others who have the same wheel and haven't had any issues.

 

And here is some food for thought regarding Rotas in particular:

 

http://my350z.com/forum/autocross-road/394560-rota-wheels-with-race-slicks-on-a-race-track.html

[captaingamez]

I guess I will just never understand why people buy replica wheels. Because regardless of all the good reasoning otherwise, people still do not buy the real thing.....

 

Assets vs Liabilities.

 

SMH.

[q-tip]

People buy rep wheels for the ease of availability, you can't find the authentic wheels in all the sizes and offsets, not to mention everybody and their brother is always looking for authentic wheels. Both of my usersof SSR's I lucked into, couldnt find them easily if I was looking.

[HRH]

I say again, imitation is the most sincere form of flattery.  And besides that, the Shakotans will look bitchin' on my wagon!! :D

[captaingamez]

People buy rep wheels for the ease of availability, you can't find the authentic wheels in all the sizes and offsets, not to mention everybody and their brother is always looking for authentic wheels. Both of my usersof SSR's I lucked into, couldnt find them easily if I was looking.

Well I sure havent had any issues.

[HRH]

So I've been thinking about Ford 5.0s in the Maxima.   ;)  Easy power and not SBC.  Of course, it's totally blasphemous.  So what about a V12 L48?  Think I could make that, maybe.   :D

[HRH]

Went on information overload last night on the potential powerplants.  Ended up coming to the realization that an L V12 would be very hard to make.  Mainly because V blocks are triangle shaped, whereas inlines are rectangle.  Not to mention the offset in bore spacing in relation to crankshaft journal width for two rods instead of one.  So that's out of the question though I may attempt it someday in the future just for giggles.

 

Second, a big displacement 6.  I know you can stroke a 2.8 to 3.2 liters, which is pretty badass.  However, what if you wanted 4.2 or 4.0 liters?  Or 4.5?  Well, what about a Jeep block?  Problem there is the cam is in the block.  And I don't know about the bore spacing.  Probably not even close to the same as an L.  If it was, though, you could just remove the lower cam and adapt the L head to the Jeep block.  That would be pretty cool!  I doubt the combustion chamber size would be correct either, probably way too small, too much compression.  But it's fun to think about!

 

So realistically, the 5.0 Ford or 350 Chevy are the two easiest options.  The Chevy of course being cheaper.  OR I could just turbo the 2.4.  Which would work, but I would need to yank the head on the L and replace the head bolts with a head stud kit.  Probably would want to replace the rod bolts with ARP as well.

 

That's what I thought about all night, to the garage boy wonder!

 

[captaingamez]

Use a Nissan V8 or a Toyota V8. Any engine with the cam in the block is a giant leap backwards in technology over an L. Yes it will be more work, but then you will be unique, unlike the other two people that put SBCs in this chassis.

 

Nissan TB48, 4.8 liters of inline 6 fury. Too bad its impossibly large.

 

Or just stick with your L24 and get a L26 rotating assembly and turbo it.

 

You are talking about more power when you are still running stock fuel injection, so I am not sure what you think your gaining without replacing that first, or course if your heart is set on a v8 instead of an inline 6 then thats useless to you anyway.

[q-tip]

I would go with the 5.0 over the SBC, a vq would be pretty badass too, but lots more wiring.

[captaingamez]

VQ would be epic. Or VG. Theres only one guy that has a VG and I think it has a big ass single turbo running like 10.5s.

[HRH]

Oooooh, I LIKE the idea of a TB48DE.  And I know someone who might be able to supply me with one!  Not that impossibly huge.  If I can fit a 350 in the engine bay with the length for an L motor, I can fit a 4.8l 6.  That would be freakin' awesome!!!

[captaingamez]

Would be totally epic, but I imagined it to be similar to the size of a 1FZ-FE, the Toyota I-6 4.5 liter. A guy put one of them in a Supra in Canada and he had to make a special tall hood to accommodate it. But it would be completely insane to do.

[HRH]

Back on to wheel crap.  I measured the XXRs again, the limit I have for backspacing is 4.75" but that's with an 8" wide wheel.

 

120.65 = 4.75" backspacing

206.4 = 7" wide 15" wheel

103.2 centerline

+17.45 is ideal offset with limit of 4.75" backspacing  Realistically a +12 offset is about right to get it a little farther away from the inside by 5 mm.

 

In short, it's a good thing I haven't gotten the wheels I've tried to order!  Apparently the Datsun Gods WERE looking after me.  After all this pain in the ass, I may just order some tires for the snowflakes like the original plan and call it good.  I'll find wheels I like better eventually.

[HRH]

Or...what about the futofab VTO wheels?  Iron crosses.  Debating black center vs. regular silver.  Need to get a decent sideview.  Tried to photoshop some on, but hard to get an idea of looking good or not.  Little more expensive than I wanted, but hey, they ARE made in the USA, so that should make someone on here happy. ;)

[hobospyder]

Or...what about the futofab VTO wheels?  Iron crosses.  Debating black center vs. regular silver.  Need to get a decent sideview.  Tried to photoshop some on, but hard to get an idea of looking good or not.  Little more expensive than I wanted, but hey, they ARE made in the USA, so that should make someone on here happy. ;)

i am not happy

 

though that's just me, it's your car do what you want to it. just don't get so deep into looks that you don't get anything else (i've guilty of this which is why i'm warning you away, and i can't remember if the car is running or no)

[captaingamez]

I dont know if VTOs are made in the US, but I have heard that they stand by their products pretty well. $800 is not that bad if you ask me. You dont even want to know what I have into the Ray's.