Clutch differences

[paradoxx]

Hey you guys, last saturday I went to buy a Exedy clutch to replace it because last time I installed an unknown brand that sucked big time.

 

The thing is that when the guy showed it to me, the pressure plate is smaller in width.

 

The one of the pic is an old clutch that I changed a couple of years ago, and this is my main question, the original measures 52mm tall and the exedy is 10mm smaller, will this work??

 

Also theres a difference between the exedy and this one, the PP centerhole is bigger, but this means I have to use a bigger release bearing, but....will the stock bearing sleeve work?

 

 

Im asking these questions because you guys have more experience when interchanging parts and didnt find any topic regarding the clutch cover differences.....and I would definetely want the excedy, since I cant afford the shipping if importing the roadster one.

[ggzilla]

The height of the cover does not matter.

The height of the fingers inside matters.

 

On another topic, L-series clutches come in these diameter:

* 180mm (L13/L14)

* 200mm (L16/L18 most cars)

* 225mm (most trucks except early ones)

[paradoxx]

thank you gg......well, theres also a difference on the fingers were the release bearing sits, its 10mm lower too.

 

and yes, it is a 200mm.

[ggzilla]

You probably need one of these to go with the cover.

Or just get a different cover.

 

[datzenmike]

I wish I had this nailed down and had a definitive answer. This list would only apply to the Z car where you know what clutch was used with what transmission.

 

 

The clutch arm and slave travel is fixed and not really adjustable so the arm must contact the pressure plate at roughly the same position in it's travel. So the housing, bearing and fingers on the pressure plate must add up to the same distance from or above the flywheel surface. The height of the clutch fingers above the flywheel surface is different between the 200mm, 225mm and 240mm pressure plates. A 200mm's fingers are closer to the flywheel, and because the bearing thickness are all the same the housing must vary in length. A 200mm PP will have a longer housing and a 225mm will be shorter and the 240mm the shortest. If a shorter 225mm housing is used on a 200mm PP the clutch arm (and the peddle) will have to travel further to disengage the clutch. In fact it might not be able to fully disengage it and there will be grinding of gears on shifts or when shifting into reverse because the clutch is dragging. Like-wise if a longer 200mm housing is used on a 225mm PP the clutch arm may not be able to travel far enough back to fully engage the PP and the clutch may slip and the release bearing will be spinning all the time and wear it out.

 

ggzilla what's your take on this?

.

[ggzilla]

There are two different length release bearing sleeves for A-series clutches which I know about.

The difference is (apparently) whether you use an engine plate or not. Datsun mixed & matched them over the years so no one is sure which one to use. It doesn't seem to depend on the transmission, but on the clutch, flywheel and engine plate (or lack thereof). The engine plate is a thin spacer between the block and transmission. Probably used to reduce NVH.

 

If you use the wrong one, the clutch doesn't work at all, or barely works

 

4.5 mm difference for A-engine

[paradoxx]

ok, so, since the distance between the fingers and FW is 10mm shorter than the one im using right now, I will have to find a taller bearing sleeve? is that right?

[ggzilla]

I'm not sure... I always try to keep them as a matched set to avoid this problem... :(

[datzenmike]

Taller I would think so, yes. Contact Excedy?

[paradoxx]

let me try contact those guys........now that I have a strange sound on the 3rd gear I want to change the clutch once and for all.

 

wanna hear the sound Im having? I thought is was a low oil sound but I changed it sunday and nothing changed.

 

 

Click on the image to see the video.

[paradoxx]

Finally found the exedy CC and a NKK disc, both japan made. the one I had installed was TRW, looks like a taiwan made because the brand is just ink painted.

 

After opening the gearbox, the sound I was hearing was the 3rd gear broken. 4 teeth are off.

 

 

I dot know where to get a spare or take the chances and installed the other gearbox without knowing the the condition of the bearings. What would you guys do??

[datzenmike]

This is odd and looks like something loose got in there and broke the teeth off. These are the counter shaft gears and are in constant mesh with the main bearing gears. In other words they aren't shifted in and out of gear. Lack of oil might cause this.

 

 

.

[paradoxx]

yes mike, that might be the problem, some time ago, maybe a year+ the oil level was very low........now, why the sound was louder when shifting to 3rd gear?

[paradoxx]

also, if you look at the lower gear in the pic, you can see a little notch on every teeth, Do you think I have to change that one too?

[Master-O-Turbonics]

also, if you look at the lower gear in the pic, you can see a little notch on every teeth, Do you think I have to change that one too?

 

You must keep gears in matched sets. You just need to find a different transmission.

your bearings dying from a lack of oil could have caused that failure.

 

failed input shaft bearing caused this on my transmission:

 

[datzenmike]

This is the counter shaft and all the gears are one piece on it. You can't take one off and change it.

 

 

The counter shaft is actually hollow and slides onto a rod and is supported on needle bearings front and back. Those holes are for lubrication.

[paradoxx]

You must keep gears in matched sets. You just need to find a different transmission.

your bearings dying from a lack of oil could have caused that failure.

 

failed input shaft bearing caused this on my transmission:

 

 

Thats gotta hurt! Actually today im installing my spare tranny and see what happens.

 

 

This is the counter shaft and all the gears are one piece on it. You can't take one off and change it.

 

 

The counter shaft is actually hollow and slides onto a rod and is supported on needle bearings front and back. Those holes are for lubrication.

 

Since pl521sss is coming here, he will bring this shaft with him for me to replace it, meanwhile I will be changing all of the bearings.

 

Does anyone has a guide to disassemble the tranny?? I cant seem to understand well the book explanations.

 

Thank you very much both for your help!!:D

[datzenmike]

Does anyone has a guide to disassemble the tranny?? I cant seem to understand well the book explanations.

 

Thank you very much both for your help!!:D

 

 

I have some stuff at home. I'll look tonight

[paradoxx]

maaaaan, that tranny is just fucked up :(

[paradoxx]

take a look

 

 

 

 

[paradoxx]

do you guys have any idea of where I can get those needle bearings??

 

also, i had a little squeek that I thought is was going to disappear when changing the tranny......I dont know what it is.

[datzenmike]

 

That's the shaft the counter gears turn on??? This is worn from the needle bearings??? This is why the teeth are chewed. This much wear allows the counter to move away from the main and the gear lash increases.

 

32219 A0600 is the needle bearing assy. Two are required one for each end.

 

 

.

[paradoxx]

yes Mike, as you said, this was caused by a low oil level. This was my surprise when I pulled out the shaft. The needle bearing that presents wear is the one close to the shifter, the one near the bell housing looks good, either way I want to change both.

 

now i wonder how do you assemble the needle bearings?? tricky procedure?

 

I want to thank in advance to pl521sss that is going to be the parts donor.

 

You control the Dat Zen, Mike. :D