"Quality"

[MachineMan]

Hello, 

Just putting this out there,...........

 

My opinion, and that of people in the know, is that overall Quality is nothing compared to years ago.

 

State your opinion, and feel free to give examples.

 

This may go hand in hand with the fact that individuals for the most part aren't as smart, as well

educated, experienced, observant, or have the skills in problem solving that the average person

had back in the day.

 

I hold the parents and the school system responsible for the most part.

 

I watched a video of a policeman writing a ticket to a Canadian telling them they couldn't use a

Canadian drivers license here in the US.

(There are more than one of those videos)

 

Another shows a police woman about to, and may have, arrest a driver for his license plate,......

she claimed it was a fake, she stated, "there is no state of "West" Virginia.

 

These examples are screw ups by trained professionals.

They are allowed to carry and use a firearm to enforce the law.

 

So just imagine the average person sitting at a bus stop.

 

Don't get me started on Doctors,........ removed the healthy leg?

when the other leg was black, shriveled up, and stunk to high heaven?

 

State your opinion, give some funny examples please.

 

 

 

 

MM

 

 

 

 

  

[paradime]

MM, you're going to fit right in here.

[MachineMan]

Thanks paradime,.......

 

But I have a creepy feeling that I won't last long enough to get my little truck squared away.

 

 

Thanks for the hopeful thoughts

 

 

MM

[paradime]

All I can say is enjoy trying with all you got. Oh, and stay away from Fine Line Imports at all costs. Here's a funny example for ya, I had this young "specialist" do some electrical work on a modern engine swap in my auto-X 510 project. When I brought it to there, the engine had even compression and leak down on all 4. But after months in his shop he couldn't fire it up, so dude tried to convince me it was because the engine was shot. I called BS, did some digging and discovered that pea brain little wipper snapper re-pinned the harness for a completely different engine. And then this dunce tried to charge me for his labor as though he deserved it. I politely taught him where to stick his invoice and brought the car to an older guy who was a real specialist. Dave Rebello had it running in 20 minutes, and that engine is still making 370+ whp to this day. I can only hope Miles Heckman still has that invoice lodged in his tailpipe. 

 

Welcome to the funny farm MM

[MachineMan]

Well here is a "Very Good" example of the subject at hand!!

 

The little 720 I just bought,......missing a lug nut.

So I spring for some replacements for all four wheels.

 

An existing lug nut came off without any issue.

"The replacements on the other hand!!!"

 

Absolute out of spec Garbage!!

 

Sent them a "Flaming" message, even enlightened them "How" their vendors screw up happened.

 

Talking to an agent on ebay,.... I guess that doesn't happen anymore.

Some AI assistant that didn't understand jack crap.

 

It's not just that I have so many years in the trade, back in the day I was the

"Quality Manager" for "Amcor Industries".

 

Amcor Industries Inc

Amcor Industries, Inc., doing business Gorilla Automotive Products, provides automotive products. The company offers lug nuts, lugs and locks, racing lugs, lug bolts and bolt locks, valve stems and tire pressure gauges, thin wall sockets, lug wrench adapters, sockets, and power wrenches. Gorilla Automotive Products serves clients in the State of California.

 

They were at the time, and for many years, OEM supplier to General Motors.

Lug nuts for the Corvette, Firebird, Trans Am,... etc.

 

"I" was the one entrusted to make certain the lug nuts were within all the specifications.

The spec was, I still remember it, PQS 15-200. It has since been superseded.

Much more than just the minor ID, the thread dimensions, and pitch.

I had to verify the material, (stainless and carbon steel), had to part samples in half, lap the faces to about a 4 finish

then under the toolmakers microscope measure the depth of the case hardening.

Tension Testing, Elongation,.... the whole deal.

There was even an accelerated "salt spray test, to check for corrosion resistance.

 

Those idiots sent those pieces of trash to the wrong person.

 

I am tired of dealing with crappy companies, buying the cheapest trash available,.....

then not inspecting the parts they receive, and again not checking before they ship to an end user.

An end user that is out on the public streets and highways a danger to themselves and all around them.

 

I'm giving a heads up to the DOT and the FTA.

 

I these were aircraft fasteners with one phone call they would be in handcuffs.

 

 

The seller is, get this,.......DP SPEC AUTOMOTIVE

 

LOL, they wouldn't know a "Spec" if it jumped up and bit em' on the backside.

 

 

 

 

 

Let's see how much luck these hacks have explaining their themselves to the feds.

 

 

[datzenmike]

Maybe for Toyotas. They have almost the same thread as Nissan.

[MachineMan]

13 hours ago, datzenmike said:

Maybe for Toyotas. They have almost the same thread as Nissan.

 

Sorry, no chance of that what so ever!!

 

OK, time to teach, class please pay attention.

 

Let's start with taps. 

You may have noticed, (or not), good / high quality taps have an "H" or "GH" designation followed by a number.

(examples: H3, GH2, etc)

What that indicates is the amount of oversize from the true size.

Each number reflects .0005", a 3 for instance indicates .0015" over true size, H2 would be .001" over.

So guys, in lay mans lingo, it's a "half a thou over for each value of the number stated" 

 

Why?

Easy, what happens when you "plate", apply any "coating", or, in this instance, "Case Harden" a workpiece?

Answer,.... the workpiece "Grows".

Now consider a thread, in this case an "internal thread", growth in this feature creates "shrinkage"

An O.D. grows, and I.D. grows as well,..... an I.D. grows "IN".

 

Think about it,...... you send a batch of fasteners out for plating, some nuts and some bolts.

If they are plated "all over" the external threads will grow larger, the internal threads will grow "Smaller"

 

That is why a plating house will "Mask Off" threads as to not change their size.

If the blueprint says, "plate all over", and it's a threaded workpiece, you have to plan ahead,.......

You go under size on an external thread, and the plating brings it "up" to size.

You go "oversize" on an internal thread, and the plating brings it "down" into size.

 

Right now you're saying, "makes sense", "but case hardening isn't plating"

Of course it isn't, but it has the same effect.

Case hardening "introduces carbon into the workpiece"

It has to go somewhere, "it's pure Physics,.... "two things cannot occupy the same space at the same time"

 

So, in the case of an "internal thread" that is subject to Case Hardening you have to "plan ahead".

You incorporate the use of a higher number H or GH tap. Depending on the specs.

An example would be to use an H or GH tap, depending on the requirements, perhaps an H5 or H6, (GH5 GH6).

Then when the predicted "Growth" takes place the internal thread "shrinks" into size, (H2 or GH2 or so).

 

It's called, "Planning"

 

That is why blueprints state, "final sizes reflected here are "after" plating and any other outside processing"

 

Now, these chi-com Hacks used a tap size that didn't allow for the "Growth" that would take place in Case Hardening.

Yielding an "under sized thread" do to the processing "after the feature was established"

 

That is why these lug nuts are "Squeaky" tight and actually get hot, (due to friction), when trying to install them.

 

I am not just a, precision machinist, precision grinder, and toolmaker, with nearly "50 years experience"

I'm an expert in "Failure Analysis"

 

Which is why the FAA offered me a job as a crash scene investigator. 

 

Class dismissed.

 

 

MM

 

 

 

 

[MachineMan]

15 hours ago, datzenmike said:

Maybe for Toyotas. They have almost the same thread as Nissan.

 

Mike, and IZRL, honestly?

I'm just shy of 50 years in the trade, (six years in school not counted),

I posted a picture of some of my work in the 1975 thread.

 

And you think I can't tell one thread from another?

 

Plus, I actually was the "Quality Manager" for an OEM supplier of lug nuts to General Motors.

(Amcor  Industries, maker of Gorilla Nuts)

 

I can't tell one thread from another?,.... really?

 

I have instruments here in my shop that read down into "millionths of an inch"

I can show the difference in size between two different Gage Blocks of the same stated size.

 

And you figure I can't tell the difference between two threads.

 

Gee, thanks for the insult,.... likely the worse I have ever received.

 

 

MM