sd22 hard to start

[jacobbsd22]

I bought this 93 ford ranger with a sd22 swaped into it for $500. It needed a clutch and a few other small things. After getting the clutch done she ran and drove fine. It is very hard to start needing 4 to 5 runs of the glow plugs to start. It has new diesel a new filter and I put in new injectors they were all very low on pop test and and a very poor spray pattern. I made sure theirs no air bubbles in the fuel system. All the glow plugs are good. Im starting to think its the injection pump. The white smoke is terrible when trying to start it. Maybe it has bad compression? I dont really know much about this motor the fuel system is kinda weird im used to my john deeres and cummins. Any help would be appreciated.

[banzai510(hainz)]

neihboor has a Landcruiser and was lots of smoke then he learned how to start it correctly. I assume you let the plugs get nice and hot before the START, But Im not a diesel expert

[jacobbsd22]

I make sure to use the plugs it seems to start better if I just hold them on while cranking. I dont know if thats good or not. 

[wayno]

My first question would be do you use something like a cable you pull on to shut the engine down, or does it start and shut down with the key?

Do you know what wiring harness is controlling the diesel electrical part?

What is the outside temperature when you have been trying to start it?

[jacobbsd22]

The fuel shut off is ran with a cable. After doing some research the datsun trucks had a solenoid on the pump and it has 3 positions start, shut off, and a run. If my research is correct? I only have a cable to shut it off. Starting is just a push button it has its separate electrical system. Most of the electrical systems of this truck is very cobbled together. It took many attempts to find what is what. Took a while to find out why the radiator fan wasnt working and I found out it was a wire I bumped and knocked lose when I was replacing a power steering line. Sorry for the rambling I'll get back on track. Before winter it was about 50 to 60 degrees fahrenheit when I was trying to start it. This winter I just parked it beacuse it was very hard to start if not plugged in till the block was warm to the touch. I've read these engines are hard to start in winter. But to my knowledge any diesel should be able to start in 50 degree weather. 

[wayno]

OK, since I am not there I cannot see what is going on, so I will start with the cable, in theory the cable should have 3 positions, all the way in would be start, pulled a little way out would be run, and pulled all the way out would shut the engine down, now if you only have run and off I wonder how much into the run position you are, you may be fine but I am not there to see how your cable works, if you only have to pull the cable an inch or less I would think you might be trying to start it in a very lean position.

My first test would be to disconnect the cable and have someone hold the lever the cable was connected to in the fully pushed forward position, if it starts easier this way you need to adjust the cable so it can move to the start position when starting.

Another thing that can make it hard to start is if the glow plugs have been burnt out from getting too hot, when starting a diesel engine on my engine stand I usually do not quoting you push the button for more than 15/20 seconds and I have slow warm up type glow plugs, I have no idea what type of glow plugs you have, but from the sounds of it with all the white smoke you said you have which is un-burnt fuel, you may have burnt some of them out/smoked them, all you can do is remove them which is a pain and test them, they should be smoking hot orange/yellow color in 15, maybe 20 seconds at the most.

If you somehow ended up with fast  warm up type glow plugs and you pressed the button for more than 30 seconds they are toast and you will be lucky to get them out of their glow plug holes because the ends of them blow up like balloons(well mine did), I had to use vice grips to get the set I was sold out of the holes, and that happened with a stock setup where the wiring harness does everything and I just start the truck when the light goes out, but it sure started easy that one time.

Try starting it with the cable disconnected and that arm pushed forward towards the radiator as far as it will go, if it's the same remove your glow plugs and test all of them, I know it is hard to get to them, but it has to be done, there likely is a way of testing them in position, but I don't know how to do that.

 

 

By the way, I walk away from this computer all the time, so sometimes it takes me a while to respond.

Edited March 26, 2019 by wayno

[jacobbsd22]

Thank you for the response I will try doing those things after school tomorrow. I didnt know that that there were different types of glow plugs. From seeing the previous owner start the engine before I bought it i sure hope its slow type. He held that switch for quite a while. I test the glow plugs with the a voltage meter and they were all reading the same OHMs dont know if there all bad or all good. I had to run a new cable before I started driving it. The old one was stuck. The injection pump control i can pull it towards the front of the vehicle and i can push it towards the back. It sits in the middle which i think would be the run position. It springs towards the middle or what i think is the run position either way you pull it. Now what decides what the run position is? Is there a type of adjustment for that? Thanks for the ideas so far. 

[wayno]

Where it rests in the middle should be the run position, but that is a general term as it is not what controls the fuel mixture, vacuum and a spring control the mixture, but if the arm is held towards the back/firewall because of the position of the cable it will run lean, you can see this if you push the arm back while it is running, the idle will slow down but it keeps on running till you totally push it all the way back and completely cut off the fuel, but if you try driving it with the arm in that lean position you will have no power.

A guy I got my SD25 turbodiesel engine from played with that cable and propane injection, he claims to have gotten 48mpg, but the engine didn't run right, and there was no way that anyone else could have drove it that way, on the test drive I took it on it ran very hot, he said I drove it wrong, but the fact is he had it set up wrong, no one but him could drive that thing except him the way he had it set up, I have it set up to where anyone can drive it now and it runs great.

I only know how to test the glow plugs by removing them and testing them on a battery, have you ever pushed the button and made sure the glow plugs were getting power with a volt meter or test light?

I had a friend that was telling me how hard it was to get his engine to start, I asked him if he was sure the glow plugs were getting power, he looked at me like I was crazy, he turned on the power and I checked for power at #4 glow plug, it was not getting power, I warmed them up with a wire from the battery to #4 glow plug and it started right away without any issue.

Try starting it without the cable connected, make sure power is getting to the glow plugs when you press the button, if neither of these things help, test the glow plugs out of the engine where you can see them glow.

 

[jacobbsd22]

I've been really busy past couple weeks. But all the glow plugs are getting power and I was just gonna pull the plugs but I haven't had time. While I was trying to get it going sense its warmer turns out that fuel pump is junk. I dont feel like dropping the tank so I plan on just putting a tank in the bed. I just need to know what fuel pressure does the motor need to see what fuel pump to buy.

[wayno]

The fuel pump is on the injection pump, the primer pump is connected to it, the fuel tank is just the tank, there is no fuel pump in it.

On the bottom of the fuel pump(we call it a lift pump) is a banjo fitting, this is where the fuel enters the lift pump, the banjo bolt is special, it has a screen inside it, now if you do not have a pre-filter that screen inside the banjo bolt can get plugged and starve the injection pump, this is why everyone with a Nissan diesel should have a pre-filter.

Just because a glow plug has power to the post doesn't mean it is good, I suppose one could cycle the glow plugs(warm them up) and use a laser temp gun to see if the glow plug itself is warmer than the block around it, it might work but I would not bet on it.

If it is blowing white smoke out the tail pipe when you are trying to start it, it is getting fuel, it's just not enough in the cylinder to ignite it, which could mean the glow plugs are not working, they also could have gotten ruined being heated up too long.

Edited April 9, 2019 by wayno

[jacobbsd22]

I missed a couple key points with my post I was in a hurry. SoI had it running and it died. And now it's not getting fuel. The fuel pump is turned off and on with  a switch. The switch is getting power to the pumps power wire but its not working the ground is fine and I've checked most of what it could be. So at this point I'm thinking of throwing a fuel tank in the back and making a fuel system with that the truck is very very rusty and I think trying to take the tank is is gonna do more harm then good. The motor does not have anything but the injection pump on it. The guy that swapped it striped it of all that stuff. He just used the fords stock fuel sending system but he added 2 filters to it. So now thinking of that I never new the motor had it's own stuff could that be making it start bad by having the wrong fuel pressure? Its just a thought. 

 

So with the glow plugs I've heard horror stories about that breaking in 2 when trying to get them out. Is there a trick to getting them out or is it nothing to worry about? 

[wayno]

I only know how these engines are supposed to work, does your injection pump have the primer pump so you can prime the injection pump?

Do you have a spin on fuel filter or do you have a filter that has one fuel line going in and one fuel line going out?

Does your injection pump look like this below?

Or does it look like this injection pump in this photo?

[jacobbsd22]

I have the inline pump like in the first photo but the primer is gone. Someone must have taken it off while it was getting swapped into that ranger and used the rranger fuel pump. I thought it was weird when I took off filter and it was empty like it was sucked dry. So I'm guessing the lift pump still works on the motor. Do you know where I could find that primer that's in that first picture?

[wayno]

You can buy a compete lift pump on ebay, lot of them for sale, here is an example, I do not know any of these sellers.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1981-86-Fuel-Feed-Pump-Assy-For-Nissan-720-Pickup-SD22-SD25-Diesel-Engine-NEW/162755084722?hash=item25e4f581b2:g:RQYAAOSw8iZcNdYh

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Fuel-Feed-Pump-Assy-For-Nissan-720-Pickup-SD22-SD25-Diesel-Engine-1981-86-USA/113619758447?epid=20021616545&hash=item1a7443ed6f:g:FSQAAOSwwkNcWsLI

 

Here is the primer itself, but if that is all that is missing it still should start but it might take a while.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Diesel-Primer-Hand-Pump-16655-34W00-For-Nissan-720-Pickup-SD22-SD25-1980-1986/273714738879?hash=item3fbaab76bf:g:9s8AAOSwC5RcbOQx

 

If you are missing the lift pump that would leave a large hole in the side of the injection pump, how did they plug the hole?

[jacobbsd22]

This is a picture I took a day ago it's not very good. I'll go get a better one.

[jacobbsd22]

looks like that plate is over that hole

[wayno]

That plate with the 3 nuts holding it on is where the lift pump goes, them first two links in my last post is what goes there.

If nothing is messed up behind that plate it should work fine, that would be your fuel pump and primer, there is a little cam lobe behind that plate.

 

But you also will need the banjo fitting and bolt for the bottom of that lift pump, I don't think I have one of them to take a photo of, I will look.

Edited April 13, 2019 by wayno

[jacobbsd22]

Thanks for all the help Wayno. 

[wayno]

I found a lift pump with the banjo fitting on it, you can also see the little roller that rolls on the cam inside the injection pump.

 

 

[jacobbsd22]

I'm gonna take that cover off tomarrow and make sure everything is ok with the cam then I'm gonna order one of those lift pumps. Hopefully I can get that truck back on the road.

[wayno]

This is what that special banjo fitting looks like, that little screen threads into the banjo fitting, and if your not careful you can break it like I did.

If you cannot find that type banjo fitting, just use any open type banjo fitting and use a pre-filter.

[jacobbsd22]

Any auto parts store should have that right? Or should I order it online?

[wayno]

OK, I just went and looked at the brand new lift pump I bought last year when I had a fuel issue, it came with both the proper banjo fittings, but both have a fitting on them, the bottom one feeds from the tank, the other one feeds the fuel filter, but now I hate to ask, but do you have the spin on fuel filter that has 3 banjo fittings and 4 rubber fuel lines, if you don't then I really don't know what to say.

A couple photos of the fuel filter assembly.

 

[jacobbsd22]

This is not a good picture but that's the filter I have it doesnt look stock so I think it's just a universal fuel filter he added.

[wayno]

Here are some photos of an injection pump I have if a different type, but it shows the routing of the lines.

See the line next to the primer that goes from the lift pump to the top, that one goes to the fuel filter.