84 720 -aka- my very first resto -aka- rust nightmare

[radracer]

Well, I put together a list of salvage yards in the area and headed out with my hope high and brimming with confidence. Four hours later I discovered that all but three of the yards on my list had been turned into housing developments and mini-malls, of those two were closed, and of the single one that was open he had a grand total of perhaps 45 cars in his lot, not a dang one of them a nissan, let alone a datsun. And before you start in, I didnt call because the resource I used to put together the list didnt have phone numbers, and I didnt feel like going through 18 different searches just for numbers. Especially when Im also in the hunt for seats, which I'd be willing to take out of any vehicle, given that the seats were below a certain gross-ness factor (unlikely, I know, but its worth a shot. well, it WAS worth a shot, at least). So, all that is left to me now is about a 40 minute drive to the closes pick-n-pull next weekend. Oh well.

 

Given the time I spent driving around, and also given that I was feeling pretty lazy today, I only had about 4 hours to work on the bed rust. And, given that with the heat in texas right now that means I can use my angle grinder and power drill for about 15 minutes each before having to let them sit for 30 minutes to cool down, I didnt get as far as I would have liked.

 

 

and this is where I finished

 

I also discovered another problem area, where the bed floor meets the back wall.

 

It is rusted down there all along the whole line

 

unfortunately, I simply dont have the tools to remove the rust down there, and I am not going to be removing the bed to hit it from the other side, so this is one part where "good enough" will have to be just that. I'll hit it with some rust inhibitor, stuff a load of bondo down into the gap, and presto.

 

Anyway, once the light went out I did get a chance to start poking into the engine bay. I removed the radiator. Didnt find anything I didnt expect to find, body wise. The crossmember has some rust, but nothing out of the ordinary at this point.

 

There were a few surprises though.

 

First, when I drained the radiator, the coolant looked like rusty, bloody piss.

 

The liquid coming from the block was nice and green like it should be, but that which came from the radiator was tainted. Im assuming this means my radiator is probably rusted as sin. Should I replace her?

 

 

I also found this: Yes, thats an old wasp nest.

 

 

 

Anyway, more bed work tomorrow.

[radracer]

question for everyone... found a vortec V6 and a 4 cyl VCT from a probe in the junk yard. should I pull and swap for one of those babies?

 

 

 

 

both are certain to be rough, and possibly not even salvageable, but I think the vortec especially might be worth it. Id like everyone's opinions either way, though.

[radracer]

Raining in my part of Texas today. The last thing I want to do is open the garage door and let in more moisture and humidity than I have to, so unless it stops soon enough for the sun to dry it out before 6 or 7pm, I wont be doing any grinding in the garage today.

[radracer]

It looked like this all day long today

 

but rain or no rain, I have work to do

didnt get any real grinding work done, but I finished cleaning up the patch on the back of the bed that I had mostly finished yesterday, and got it ready to prime

 

Which leaves me about 30% done with the bed. Not as far as I had wanted to be, but I cant always expect conditions to cooperate.

 

 

I also did a bit more work getting the engine ready to be lifted out. The wiring and vac line situation is a complete and utter mess in this truck. The previous owner(s) jerry rigged so many damn things that Im not even sure which lines and wires are actually connected at both ends, let alone are vital to the running of the vehicle. Im cataloging where everything was connected, but Im pretty sure that when it is time to get her put back together, I'll do things my own way. I've always followed the KISS rule, and this baby really needs some redundancies deleted.

 

This is how it looks now. Just a few more lines to disconnect, then the bolts on the engine mounts, tranny, and exhaust line, and we are good to go.

 

 

Once Im finished with the rebuild, I plan on starting a thread about extraneous component deletion, for all of those out there who are interested in removing the non-necessary parts inside the engine bay. I know there are lots of you long-time Datsun owners out there with a lot more experience on this subject than me, so I look forward to your inputs.

 

stay rad!

[bmacster]

Nice job man! I will take some pictures of my engine bay for you on Thursday. That may or may not help you with the vacuum hoses though but it'll be a good reference at least.

 

What are you using to clean up the bed? Wire cup? Trying to find a good method of getting the crap off...

[radracer]

Soda Blasting.

 

 

Im considering waiting till next paycheck and buying an abrasive blaster (this one: http://www.harborfre...ster-95014.html)

and a good amount of tarp to "Room" my garage off so that I can soda blast the rest of the bed, body panels, frame, and wherever else will need stripping. I would have to be able to get the abrasive blaster, about 30x40 feet of tarp, and a blasting suit (silicosis? no thanks!), but I could get all of this at harborfreight for about 250, shipping included. Or, I could got the cheaper route and use a gravity hopper attached to my air compressor, and get the whole run of materials for about 120.

 

Any thoughts? It would definitely make for easier work. And, of course, keeping the tools I use on the project is always nice. Besides, now that Im back into doing builds, Im pretty sure I'll find another project very soon after I finish this one, and it would be nice to have whatever I needed to get whatever jobs I needed done.

 

Also, it would let me get a lot of the rust out of here

 

 

let me know what you guys think.

 

NOTE: I've never done home blasting, so if there are any dangers or concerns I should know about, please mention them.

 

 

EDIT: I posted the above as I thought of it, and as with most of my ideas I decided to do a bit of searching. Looking around, I could get a media blasting gun for my air compressor for about 20 bucks, enough plastic sheeting to room off my garage effectively for 6 bucks, and way more than enough blasting medium to finish the whole truck for about 30 bucks. So, I could get the whole thing on an operational, though not entirely shop-professional level, for about 75, shipping and handling included.

[84 4x4]

Baking soda works real well use it on allot of my parts with a gravity hopper on my compressor at home just make sure to wear safety glasses that shit hurts in your eyes

[Smyrna720]

Cool, thanks man. Ive got some bondo in the garage already, so I guess Im set on that end. Looking more closely at how yours looked when you finished putting it back in, I think I'll be more than happy with the final product. The dash has turned into the project I work on when I either dont have the time or motivation to work on the more major parts. Cut off a bit here, sand a bit there, fill a bit tomorrow, that kind of thing. I'll keep the photos coming as the work progresses. I was also thinking that it might be cool to work a few extras into the dash while Im doing this, perhaps fit a molded cell phone / GPS mount, or something along those lines, so when it is painted and finished it looks like they are an actual part of the dash. BTW, seeing how well this is turning out, Im officially calling this "The Smyrna method." Thanks for the tip!

 

Glad the dash is working out for you. I'm probably going to re do my old dash and paint it black. I put in a new black dash with a good pad, but I really thing I like the look of the other one. The Smyrna method... I like it!

 

Degreasing: Simple green or sodium hydroxide. Sodium hydroxide, commonly known as caustic soda is really the best degreaser I've found. You can purchase it in non diluted form from a HVAC supply house. They use it for condenser coil cleaner. Also, you can get a diluted form from any parts store. It's sold under the name Purple Power. Very nasty shit. Don't get it on any polished aluminum. Eats that shit right up. On a head or intake, it's not that bad. Simple green on the other hand is a little cheaper and is very easy on the human using it being non-toxic, but doesn't work quite as well. I use caustic soda for heavy degreasing and simple green on about everything else.. YMMV.

 

Primer advice: Please please please, if you've got rusty nasty areas you can't get to to clean up really well, use a self etching primer or POR-15. This will hold off the inevitable rust return for the longest. POR 15 is really the best choice but is the most expensive.

 

Blasting advice: Couple rolls of painter's plastic, plenty of DUCT tape (My experience is that painter's tape won't hold the heavy plastic as well) a cheap box fan for ventilation, an air compressor, and the blasting equipment. Not too expensive if you get it from Harbor Freight. Keep it simple. I always used playground sand for media. Works good for me. ALSO, work must be completely clean and dry. Grease and water will make the sand clump.

 

Blasting is really your best option to get all the rusties out of the crevices, but is really messy and you'll have to push the truck out at least once to sweep up and refill your hopper, depending on how big your hopper is and how much media you have. Also, keep the air pressure lower on the thin stuff to keep blowout to a minimum.

 

Engine swap: Dunno what to tell you. I'm contemplating this right now. I'd be looking at either 4 cyl or V6 platforms if I wasn't planning on the LT1 swap. Can't really help you much here. Myself, I'd go either 3800 Buick or 4.3 Chevy. Probably the easiest to swap.

 

Good luck!

[bmacster]

Huh. I never thought of any sort of media blasting. I have been wiring wheeling just about everything but the vibration is driving my hand nuts.. not to mention to wires flying every which direction...

 

Sad though, I have wire wheeled an entire steam engine a few times actually and the truck is kicking my ass....

 

More tools to look into now!

[elmerfudpucker]

While you have the dash off check the heater core box and clean it out now, it will make it easier.

[Alec 720]

Cool Build! Keep at it!

[radracer]

been out of the loop for a while, my unit is getting ready for some field training time. I'll likely be out of the loop again most of this next week also, but next weekend I'll be able to be back to fixing up Ramona again for sure.

 

havent abandoned my thread, no worries.

[radracer]

pics tomorrow, I promise. Im doing the work this evening and probably tomorrow morning as well, but Im dirty, sweaty, and tired from a week of field time, and I dont feel like internetting more than this right now.

 

see you tomorrow!

[radracer]

Alright, back on the job!

 

First, some replies.

 

To elmerfudpucker, thanks man, I'll definitely be sure to do that. In fact, it would probably just be best if I went and cleaned out the entire air system from front to back. I live in central Texas, and it is a tough sell to get someone to buy ANYTHING without AC here, so on the advice of some friends I had already decided I should probably get it working first, and in conjunction with that Ill just do a full clean up. Might as well, Im cleaning every other damn square inch of my girl.

 

To Alec 720, I appreciate that. It is always tough for me to follow through with a project once I have hit the one month mark. For better or worse (really, just for worse) one thing I have learned about myself is that my enthusiasm for projects runs rampant for the first three weeks, and after that I have to force myself to stick with it. I know Im not special in this regard, but it is what it is, and I have hit that phase where I have to remind myself that sitting on the couch and watching South Park isnt helping a damn thing, and encouragement from the community is a HUGE help in maintaining the drive to complete the project.

 

To bmacster, think long and hard before you decide to do any media blasting. It is definitely MUCH faster and easier than wire-wheeling and grinding, and without a doubt does a more complete job, but the problems that come along with it are formidable. For one, if you cant do it outside (like, say you live in suburbia, for instance), you will have to create a "chamber" in your garage or shop to catch all of the particles. Second, after media blasting you have to be VERY vigilant in getting all of the blasting media out and off before you even begin to think of painting, primer or otherwise. It can be a huge booster to your project, but if you arent careful you can screw a lot of things up.

 

To Smyrna 720, man you just did me as much good as any of the books I have bought so far. Guys like you are what make it worth being a part of this community. I cant thank you enough for the information and experience you just imparted to me. Im sure your one post right there will end up saving me time and money in the stretch. THANKS!

 

To 84 4X4, you can buy a soda blasting media which is essentially non-food quality baking soda in large quantities. It is less expensive per weight than baking soda, and comes in much larger quantities. I'd look into that the next time you want to do some blasting. It will cost you more in the short end, buying a large amount, but will save you in the long run, rather than using baking soda from the grocer's.

 

 

Alrighty, now into the meat and potatoes.

 

I got Ramona lifted up high enough to be able to get underneath her so that I can do work on removing the engine, and so that I can reach whatever I need to for other work as well. Being that she is a low-rider, it was damned impossible to do this without getting her off the ground. Being that she IS a low-rider, though, I decided that paranoia was justified in making sure that the platform for her was stable. Thus, I gave her 8 points of contact in support

 

Not shown in this pic are the chock-blocks I have since put in front of and behind each of the tires. This way I can still climb all over her, as well as get underneath her, and not have to worry about getting crushed or decapitated by her dropping on me.

 

 

I Have now gotten the bed of the truck about 2/3 of the way de-rusted and primed. I still have to do a good bit of work on the wheel wells, ie paint and rust removal, dent-pounding, and one patch panel to weld, but the work area on those is small enough and the rust minor enough that I should be able to do them both in one afternoon each. That means that, aside from removing the pain on the back wall of the bed and the side bed panels, Im nearly complete on the repair work on that area.

 

some pics

 

 

only gotta clean it up and paint it now

 

and freshly primed

 

 

Further work yesterday evening and today included following some of my new books (got in the Haynes for 80-96 Nissan/Datsun pickups and Pathfinders) in getting the engine ready for lifting out. On this particular point, I am stuck and in need of advice. All I have remaining is to disconnect the exhaust pipe from the manifold - 3 simple 14mm bolts... Each of which is locked as tight as a nun's legs at a politician's party. There is next to no room in there, and none of my breaker bars will fit in with sockets, so the only course I have for removing them is a medium length wrench.

 

I beseech ye, all of those who have lifted out Z24s, how did you remove these damned bolts?! Is there a method of which I am unaware? Any help would be incredible.

 

 

On the topic of those books, though, since my last work I have gotten in all sorts of new toys.

 

 

Also finally got in my bondo-hair and body filler.

 

The only thing I have left that I need to acquire is a high-capacity air compressor and the gear I will need for media blasting and for painting. That tallies to about 1,500 worth of gear, low end. Of course, this doesn't include the parts I will also need to purchase for her, but what I have now is enough to keep me going strong for quite a while. Also, once I sell her (if I can bring myself to have the heart to do that once Im finished - not sure about that right now), I still get to keep the tools, so if I do nothing but break even, Im ahead. Besides, given the work Im putting into her, and the vision I have for her once complete, Im thinking she will be a 6k truck, base minimum. Given that Im at a military base, I might be able to find somebody who will give me as much as 10k for her, IF she turns out into the specialty custom job that I have in mind.

 

We will see!

 

 

stay rad!

[radracer]

oh yeah, forgot to mention: if you guys are looking into doing some grinding with your power drills, do NOT buy the Gator Finishing Products coarse grinding wheels for power drills.

 

Their angle grinder wheels work just fine, but the ones for power drills are COMPLETELY WORTHLESS. The one I got came with two wheels and a central axle, and was advertised as being able to work as a single or double wide wheel. Well, when I put it together the bolts that came with it were too long or too short, AND the axle is too long for a single wheel, AND the backers to it are not even fixed so when you try to tighten down the lock the back just slips off and the wheels dont stay in place; they just stop spinning once you apply them to a surface to clean, while the axle spins at the center.

 

BUY 3M GRINDING WHEELS FOR POWER DRILLS INSTEAD! I have never had a problem with these, and have yet to even go through a single one, though I use it A LOT. It is quality, and is lasting much longer than I expected it to. Definitely gotten my moneys worth out of it, as opposed to completely wasting my money on the Gator product.

 

 

note: the packaging shown is for the angle grinder, yes. I already threw away the packaging for the power drill set, so I put that in there so you could see what their packaging looks like, and beware. The hardware shown on top of the packaging is the gear from the power drill grinding set, though, so if you see that set-up DO NOT buy it.

[Alec 720]

For removing the exhaust pipe from the header... I know how tight that is!

What I would do is remove the header from the engine and remove the engine and then try to take the header off the Exhaust pipe.

 

And good luck with the body work! I have done that before and my best advice is be patient and keep at it.

[radracer]

he he, you know how tight a nun's legs are at a politician's party? bravo, man. ;D

 

Main problem with what you suggested is the line that goes around the back of the engine, from the exhaust manifold to the intake manifold. It is a seized as anything else. Still more accessible, though, so perhaps what you suggest is best.

[Smyrna720]

Glad to help! Something that I've learned from you was about the bulk soda. That's some VERY good information for me.

 

Let us know how your welder works out. I've heard less than favorable reviews about that harbor freight welder. I've been looking for one of my own, but am still waiting on the funds.

 

Good luck!

[Willdatsun]

Nice project FYI i heard some sands should never be used for sandblasting as they break down into such fine dust which can get in your lungs, kind of like asbestos. PLease do some research on silicosis etc.

[radracer]

oh yea, sand should actually never be used for automotive uses. "sandblasting" is actually an antiquated term which is only used now as a reference to media blasting. there are many different preferable mediums, from tiny aluminum beads, glass beads, crushed walnuts, soda, etc. I will, of course, be using a respirator and full suit when I blast as to prevent silicosis, which can be caused by any blasting medium fine enough.

[bmacster]

Thanks for the advice! I opted to go with flapper wheels instead. It seems to be doing a good job but it's hard to get into the crevices and nooks though but it takes it down to bare metal, right now, but leaves a good base for paint. Trying to find something "simple" for that has been a fun challenge. I may just use basic sand paper for those areas.

[Smyrna720]

Erm, I've always used sand, be it in a blasting cabinet or whatever. This is the last stuff I've used. You can vary coarseness of sand to the finish you want to leave. Same with air pressure.

 

http://www.lowes.com/pd_10392-286-111351_0__?productId=3006085

 

If I'm going to blast a large piece, I set it up like a paint booth in the shop and blast away. I don't have to use an activated charcoal respirator, but still use a respirator with a cheaper filter none the less. Truthfully, I use an extra US Army gas mask I have laying around.

 

 

I have a 3M respirator for painting, but the gas mask with an out of date filter works just perfect for blasting. Plus, the gas mask has replaceable sacrificial lenses that are uber cheap at the military surplus stores. And it's got a hood too.

 

I like the idea of soda blasting, but haven't found a local supplier for large quanites yet. Also, I'm a little leery of cost. I mean, sand is 5 bucks for a 50lb bag...

 

Like I said, I do like soda blasting, since it would wash out and dissolve instead of having to blow sand out of every crack.

[radracer]

The major issue with sand is that it WILL pit your metal, and if it is a spot which has been weakened enough with rust it can put in more holes than you had originally. Granted, that final part is true of any medium if your air pressure is too high, but with sand particularly because of teh extremely sharp edges sand possesses. Other mediums, such as the aluminum/glass beads, the soda, and the crushed walnuts are better for automotive uses due to either having rounded edges (the beads) or being a softer material (the soda and walnuts). Regardless of the fineness of sand or the air pressure, sand will pit your metal due to the sharp edges; you will just have more or less pitting due to the qualities/pressure.

 

All of this I learned from numerous books I bought/borrowed/downloaded on the subject. Everything post circa 1998-ish agrees that sand should never be used on an automobile.

 

 

Love the gas mask, though, thats awesome. Im going to have to find an extra one of those to keep for just that purpose. Oh, and Im planning on doing the same thing as you when blasting large projects - set up a booth just like if I were painting.

[radracer]

Well, here is my problem. So when my wife and I divorced our agreement for who paid what listed specific times and items which I would pay and which she would pay. Part of what I agreed to pay was school expenses incurred before a certain date. So, she gives me a call week or so back telling me that there is a bill for her tuition that she never paid which was before the date set. So, due to our agreement I am now stuck with a 2400 bill which has to be paid down before Christmas. That basically kills what money I had planned to be putting towards Ramona, which means for now she is basically dead in the water. Im trying to trade some of my stuff to get the air compressor I need to move forward from here, but even that wont get me all of the way towards getting her back together. Not in the way I wanted her to be. So, looks like I'll be putting her on a trailer when I move this coming January (after which our payment agreement ceases and any further bills go to whomever's name is on the account - ie all hers) and wont be able to look at completing her till after then.

 

Im sorry guys. I can still do some token work, but not much. If I manage to barter for some of the stuff I need, or sell some of my extra junk and get some parts here and there, I'll be sure to check in. Otherwise, I wouldnt expect to see much more of Ramona in 2012.

[Smyrna720]

Well, here is my problem. So when my wife and I divorced our agreement for who paid what listed specific times and items which I would pay and which she would pay. Part of what I agreed to pay was school expenses incurred before a certain date. So, she gives me a call week or so back telling me that there is a bill for her tuition that she never paid which was before the date set. So, due to our agreement I am now stuck with a 2400 bill which has to be paid down before Christmas. That basically kills what money I had planned to be putting towards Ramona, which means for now she is basically dead in the water. Im trying to trade some of my stuff to get the air compressor I need to move forward from here, but even that wont get me all of the way towards getting her back together. Not in the way I wanted her to be. So, looks like I'll be putting her on a trailer when I move this coming January (after which our payment agreement ceases and any further bills go to whomever's name is on the account - ie all hers) and wont be able to look at completing her till after then.

 

Im sorry guys. I can still do some token work, but not much. If I manage to barter for some of the stuff I need, or sell some of my extra junk and get some parts here and there, I'll be sure to check in. Otherwise, I wouldnt expect to see much more of Ramona in 2012.

 

Really sorry to hear that man. I've been there with my first wife and it just sucks.

 

Let's do this. This weekend I'll go through the garage and see what I've got that I don't plan on using, which is quite a bit, and you do the same. Let's see what you need and see what some other guys have to trade to see if we can't get you rolling.

 

If you've got stuff to trade, there is somebody with something you need. I can promise you that.