Off road engine hoist

[frankendat]

18 hours ago, iceman510 said:

I used a carbide bit like this to cut holes in spring steel brackets for my 510 bumper.  Used lots of lubricant.

 

This is the type I used.  I don't recall exactly which "brand" I bought.  There are lots of these weird Chinese names for the suppliers.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Tungsten-Carbide-Stainless-Plastic-Drilling/dp/B0FPLZ5FVG/ref=sxin_17_pa_sp_search_thematic_sspa?adgrpid=189510986587&content-id=amzn1.sym.157815aa-47d5-4a63-b37d-108738de1fd0%3Aamzn1.sym.157815aa-47d5-4a63-b37d-108738de1fd0&cv_ct_cx=1%2B1%2F2%2Bcarbide%2Bdrill%2Bbit&hvadid=779600292439&hvdev=c&hvexpln=0&hvlocphy=1019293&hvnetw=g&hvocijid=13197191257487280917--&hvqmt=e&hvrand=13197191257487280917&hvtargid=kwd-1391247779946&hydadcr=28597_14788419_2323118&keywords=1%2B1%2F2%2Bcarbide%2Bdrill%2Bbit&mcid=38d7a9f1150b35cdbc9ff412ea81f4b8&pd_rd_i=B0FPLZ5FVG&pd_rd_r=d17bb9ce-409c-4400-a649-0bc34b746630&pd_rd_w=36pmd&pd_rd_wg=hRhkE&pf_rd_p=157815aa-47d5-4a63-b37d-108738de1fd0&pf_rd_r=0PEB901RZ1ZAKQTR0VSM&qid=1772852312&sbo=RZvfv%2F%2FHxDF%2BO5021pAnSA%3D%3D&sr=1-1-6024b2a3-78e4-4fed-8fed-e1613be3bcce-spons&aref=DsZwuiQbhA&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9zZWFyY2hfdGhlbWF0aWM&th=1

Good on you Iceman510, I was looking at that type of bit at the Harbor Freight. Same setup, same gray color, different weird name and was torn between it an one of those step bits. I tried the HF titanium step bits and for steel they are a no-go. The Bauer steel step bits are more coin than the carbide. The link you provided is even cheaper than HF, but I have a HF gift card so I'm torn. Thanks again for reaching out. 

[frankendat]

Well, as said by the Rolling Stones, in 1969,

"You can't always get what you want
But if you try, sometimes
Well, you might find
You get what you need..."

Frustrated with the metal fandango, I ventured to the back of the garage to see what I could find. Found an orphan Dana 44 spindle that I could cut for the metal spacers AND a 6ft piece of 2.5 in square steel tube .250 wall, damn near exactly what I need, with extra. 
Funny thing is I don't remember where I got it. I doubt I paid anything for it. crazy.

 

The top mounting pins on the casters are 1.25, the ID of the spindle is just over. But the top mounting pins are some kind of alloy that will sand down, much easier than the interior of the spindle pieces. (I chopping up the spindles to make spacers, so that the hole in the top mounting pin of the caster, where I will insert a 1/4 or 3/8 grade 8 bolt, is near the middle of the 2.5 square steel tube, mounted atop the 2.75 steel tubes that are the lower supporting arms of the engine hoist.)

Car parts came in the mail and I figured how to fix a problem without spending money-Today has been a good day. 
 

[frankendat]

On 3/6/2026 at 8:02 PM, iceman510 said:

I used a carbide bit like this to cut holes in spring steel brackets for my 510 bumper.  Used lots of lubricant.

 

This is the type I used.  I don't recall exactly which "brand" I bought.  There are lots of these weird Chinese names for the suppliers.

 

https://www.amazon.com/Tungsten-Carbide-Stainless-Plastic-Drilling/dp/B0FPLZ5FVG/ref=sxin_17_pa_sp_search_thematic_sspa?adgrpid=189510986587&content-id=amzn1.sym.157815aa-47d5-4a63-b37d-108738de1fd0%3Aamzn1.sym.157815aa-47d5-4a63-b37d-108738de1fd0&cv_ct_cx=1%2B1%2F2%2Bcarbide%2Bdrill%2Bbit&hvadid=779600292439&hvdev=c&hvexpln=0&hvlocphy=1019293&hvnetw=g&hvocijid=13197191257487280917--&hvqmt=e&hvrand=13197191257487280917&hvtargid=kwd-1391247779946&hydadcr=28597_14788419_2323118&keywords=1%2B1%2F2%2Bcarbide%2Bdrill%2Bbit&mcid=38d7a9f1150b35cdbc9ff412ea81f4b8&pd_rd_i=B0FPLZ5FVG&pd_rd_r=d17bb9ce-409c-4400-a649-0bc34b746630&pd_rd_w=36pmd&pd_rd_wg=hRhkE&pf_rd_p=157815aa-47d5-4a63-b37d-108738de1fd0&pf_rd_r=0PEB901RZ1ZAKQTR0VSM&qid=1772852312&sbo=RZvfv%2F%2FHxDF%2BO5021pAnSA%3D%3D&sr=1-1-6024b2a3-78e4-4fed-8fed-e1613be3bcce-spons&aref=DsZwuiQbhA&sp_csd=d2lkZ2V0TmFtZT1zcF9zZWFyY2hfdGhlbWF0aWM&th=1

I was hemming and hawing because, in my mind, I can still keep a schedule. I was torn about waiting a couple days for the Amazon bits and losing momentum on the project. HA, HA, HA, sister needed help this weekend, my neat idea to make my own spacers out of a D44 spindle (I had that was junk) is taking twice as long, the weekend is gone and the week is going to start in the morning. Now it is a race, can I get enough done on the engine hoist where I have to change direction, because I am waiting on Amazon? The deal you found is half of HF, so I bought 2. One for each 1-1/4 hole through steel that I must create. Confidence is high. 
The second photo was taken after I stopped working in the dark, that was even with the flash on the phone. 

Edited March 10 by frankendat
no need to post in 2

[frankendat]

I cut 2 rings off an axle spindle to use as spacers. The spindle diameter is only uniform in the middle section, which was fine, but it means neither spacer has a factory edge. My washers are not uniform in height and it has proved challenging to secure the approx 1/2 inch wide spacers in a vice to grind them flat. It is also proving challenging to grind them flat. For fine work, I would get some hardened glass and sanding paste, but this is far from fine work. If I could get the spacers individually within a 1/16 of height all the way around and within a 1/16 of height of each other, then I would be frog hair fine. There is fact that these spacers are going to be welded on, so I was considering no longer trying to force them flat, use a magnet  and/or clamps, to set them flat and let the welding rod fill in any uneveness. I am inquiring to the great minds of the Ratsun brain trust, for any guidance. 
Are there any potential problems with holding the spacer, with magnet or clamps level (the widest part of the spacer touching the surface and the thinner areas held just above) and welding it. The finished product is therefore level, across the top, even thought the spacer was not level. The spacer is not structural and weight will be place on top of it. 
Thank you

[frankendat]

No words of wisdom for the welding query in post last? I am going to go with trying to fill it in level, either tonight or tomorrow night. There are only a few hours of daylight (and neighbor grace) that I can work on projects. 

 

The found metal is still a blessing but there has been some bane, in customizing the dana 44 spindle into spacers. They were about 1/16 smaller than needed and drilling the hardened spindle steel was a fight. The step bit in the picture was pretty useless, but it did serve to start the cutting and a final cleanup pass through.

The HB hole saw bit carried the majority of the workload, but after cutting both spindles and cutting a hole in each square tube, they are pretty shot. I am going to try to squeeze two more holes out of it. That will make 1/2 dozen steel holes, which isn't bad for the life of a HB bit.

I didn't get to try the Amazon (Iceman) bits, because the wrong size arrived. 

The spindle pieces are the smaller crude looking things, in the picture. The smooth professional looking pieces are extra steering wheel adapter plates that I made with my father on the mill. I found I needed more space than the spindle pieces provided, not to make it work, but to move the retaining pin hole away from the edge of the square tube steel for strength. 

 

[frankendat]

Updated sketchup to reflect recent changes in hoist development. The 3 vertical lines that intersect the horizontal steel pieces are 7 inch 3/8 carriage bolts that I had on hand. I think there are 6 of them, but there may only be 4.  The bolts will be centered and through the top of the tubes, they are being shown in the picture as if the tubes were see-thru.

The top square steel tube is longer than I envisioned, but it is the result of cutting the found steel in half (and not wanting to contend with a small leftover chunk. 

 

The tube pinion section where the wheel connects is actually in the square tube. The connection is being shown in the picture as if the tubes were see-thru.

[frankendat]

All the work put into those Dana spindle spacers and I don't think I will be able to use them after all. I cut them too thin (width). I bought a piece of used tube off ebay to make another set, as the diameter and thickness desired were neither found in retail or recycle at any shop in my area. 1 Damn. 

 

Realized that I forgot to add in the cost of the hydraulic ram. The engine hoist was free but didn't come with a ram. I bought one off a surplus site 4-ton for $30 including shipping. I would have gone with a 2-ton, but the surplus  4-ton was cheaper. Adding the hydraulic ram, the $30 HB holesaw bit and the $20 in steel today brings the total, of my "Free" engine hoist to $350 and 10 days of work (very part time, but still). 2 Damn.

 

BUT, If I value my time at 0$, then I am sure I could sell it for less than I have into it. (not a typo) 3 Damn

With the new prices, I am still under the cost of a new HB non-offroad engine hoist. If mine works they way I intend it to work and I stop spending money, there is a chance, this hasn't been documentation of wasting time. 

[frankendat]

To clarify my cost analysis: HB 1 ton folding shop crane-$269.99, HB 2 ton folding shop crane-$369.99 (online price with current promotions March 2026) The comparison includes some self delusion, while I am confident that my "improvements" will handle a 1-ton load without worry, a 2-ton load would bring anxiety. 

Outsourcing the machine work on the 1 inch steel blocks, remains the budget killer. If off-roading your HB engine hoist, find a workaround for that step.  

[Rustbuster78]

I think in a lot of scenarios a gantry with tires might make more sense, as I've noticed that even with the small stock casters on engine hoists I run into clearance issues on some vehicles where the 2 legs hit the crossmember or the lower control arms. If you could build a gantry crane with tires that also fit through your garage door that might be more ideal.

[wayno]

18 hours ago, Rustbuster78 said:

I think in a lot of scenarios a gantry with tires might make more sense, as I've noticed that even with the small stock casters on engine hoists I run into clearance issues on some vehicles where the 2 legs hit the crossmember or the lower control arms. If you could build a gantry crane with tires that also fit through your garage door that might be more ideal.

 

Unfortunately, that would likely be another thing for the complainers to complain about unless it could be rolled to a hiding spot like in the garage, it is a very good idea, it would not likely have to be a tall one, put it on 4 tires like the wrecking yards had years ago no taller than a cherry picker engine hoist, just wider.

 

Hummm, I am getting ideas, this is bad for me.

Edited March 15 by wayno

[frankendat]

6 hours ago, wayno said:

 

Unfortunately, that would likely be another thing for the complainers to complain about unless it could be rolled to a hiding spot like in the garage, it is a very good idea, it would not likely have to be a tall one, put it on 4 tires like the wrecking yards had years ago no taller than a cherry picker engine hoist, just wider.

 

Hummm, I am getting ideas, this is bad for me.

Thanks Wayno, you accurately assessed my situation

[frankendat]

On 3/14/2026 at 11:24 PM, Rustbuster78 said:

I think in a lot of scenarios a gantry with tires might make more sense, as I've noticed that even with the small stock casters on engine hoists I run into clearance issues on some vehicles where the 2 legs hit the crossmember or the lower control arms. If you could build a gantry crane with tires that also fit through your garage door that might be more ideal.

 

You make a valid point, depending on your vehicles. I am confidently, hopeful, that the reach of the offroad engine hoist will be sufficient for my Datsun and my Suzuki. The off road engine hoist will function, as both a gantry crane and an engine hoist. 

[frankendat]

I can see the finish line, but want to cross it without spending much more. Even using motor oil as lubricant/coolant when drilling through the steel, I have shithammered (term of art) all my 3/8 bits. To drill 3/8 holes today, I double drilled, with one drill with fresh 5/16 bits (I bought a dozen for cheap at a close out either 1 or 5 years back) a second drill with a step bit to open the holes to 3/8 and Bob's my uncle.

[frankendat]

Mocked up. Online package tracking places the steel, to cut the metal "sleeves" that attach between the end of the tube square steel around the exposed front caster wheel leg, arriving tomorrow. Now to attach the hoist of the engine hoist, confidence remains high.

[frankendat]

The work of Monday and Tuesday has been shelved. I was considering mounting 4 inch casters where there was originally  2 inch casters. The casters mount at the intersection of the section with the lawn tractor tires and the "Pittsburgh" portion of the straight extending leg. The reason for this was ability to move the hoist about when the extending arms are folded in the up position. 

Here is the concern: The extending arms, in section with the lawn tractor tires, are big U-channels. The square tube "Pittsburgh" portion of the extending arms sit into these U-channels.  If the casters are bolted into that location, then the caster would hang down and fit without worry, but the bolt head, which anchors the caster to the extension arm would stick up in the bottom of the U-channel. The U channel would no longer sit flush with the square tube at the back of the section with the lawn tractor tires. 

Is this problem? Anyone who has assembled one of these HB hoists provide additional information? Was there originally flat head screws or bolts to address this issue or is it not an issue even with  regular bolt heads?

[datzenmike]

I don't think that would fit under most Datsuns. Front? black wheels are going to hold a LOT or weight on a very narrow contact point on soft lawn grass.

 

Would not the top square tubing slide into the bottom? That would remove 2" or 3" and stronger than bolts.

[frankendat]

22 hours ago, datzenmike said:

I don't think that would fit under most Datsuns. Front? black wheels are going to hold a LOT or weight on a very narrow contact point on soft lawn grass.

 

Would not the top square tubing slide into the bottom? That would remove 2" or 3" and stronger than bolts.

Damn. A full redesign at the final hour? That's rough. The top square tubing is the exact size of the tubing on the bottom, but it is .25 in wall, so sanding and squeezing is an option. The only two engines that I have ever pulled, the vehicles were on ramps or blocks, but your point has weight.

The bolts are for mock up and to add a mechanical connection to areas that I will weld (my welding remains suspect) but double tubing would be stronger no doubt. 
The casters were chosen because of price/wheel diameter/weight rating. The larger diameter wheels are necessary for ease of rolling. If they roll and keep momentum then hopefully the lawn crossing will be possible. With the small wheels,it was not possible. I even put wood down, but weight broke the wood.  Wide wheel casters with the required weight rating were not cost friendly; lawn or general tractor front tire setups require incorporation of additional front end assemblies, increasing time and complexity. 
If I can slide one tube into the other, then top of the top extending bar will be 10 inches, the inside width of the top extending bars is 36 inches. Tube inserting rather than stacking makes total top extending bar height drop 2  inches not 2 1/2 (the width of the additional top bar), because of the rise needed to clear the bearing platform on the front casters. It might be necessary to make an angled spacer to fit the caster bearing platform.

If sliding one tube into the other is not workable, then I will finish as originally designed,with the caster stem terminating inside the top extending bar and a M12-1.75 grade 10.9 bolt put horizontally through the top extending bar and through the caster stem, AI certified as proper stout. 

[frankendat]

Idea. If I drill the top of the top extending bar with a 1-1/4 inch hole, then the top extending bar will drop down the caster stem and onto the caster bearing platform (full contact may require use of one of the Dana 44 spindle spacers, as the caster bearing platform has a slight angle toward the stem.) This would drop the height of the top extending bar 1-1/2 inches, but would maintain the 9 inches of elevated open space between the caster wheel an the main Pittsburgh hoist platform. The elevated open space allows the turning of the front caster wheels without impact of the caster wheel locking lever on the hoist platform. 
The caster wheel bearing platform is at 9 inches, height of hoist platform at rear wheels is 9 inches. This modification would put the top of the top extending bar at 11 1/2 inches. Both vehicles intended to use this engine hoist run tires in excess of 30 inches.
I am having trouble rectifying the angle of the top extending bar, relative to the caster bearing platform in models where I incorporate the top tube inserted into bottom tube option. The caster bearing platform is horizontally level, vertically stationary and unable to be modified. 

According to AI steel strength calculations, a 1-5/8 thick, 2-1/2 wide steel bar would have strength similar to 3 x 3 square tube under 1/8 wall (The tube of the engine hoist) Therefore, best case height of the top of the top extending tube is 10 5/8.
A surprising outcome, even to me as I have been typing stream of consciousness, stacking the top square tubes, as is currently the case and drilling the additional hole, is the most favorable option. It sacrifices less than 1 inch. It requires purchase of no additional steel. It maintains turning ability of engine hoist.

If this is not workable, then I have two more lawn tractor tires that I will install the same as the ones currently mounted. 

[datzenmike]

I guess measuring the under vehicle ground clearance and building it to more than clear this would help. Jacking the vehicle up to clear is bullshit as you now have to lift even higher to clear the radiator support getting anything out. 

 

Pallet truck front wheels to spread the weight and the swivels moved to the rear?

 

 

[frankendat]

54 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

I guess measuring the under vehicle ground clearance and building it to more than clear this would help. Jacking the vehicle up to clear is bullshit as you now have to lift even higher to clear the radiator support getting anything out. 

 

Pallet truck front wheels to spread the weight and the swivels moved to the rear?

 

 

Pallet trucks...I had not looked into those. A quick search proves, once again, with money the "problem" is easily solved. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IrT8niSFmVg

The Pallet truck in the link is a few thousand. They list very similar on Ali Babba for $500, add a detachable mount for the engine hoist and you're cooking with gas. If I had $500 (+taxes and shipping) And if I had some bacon, then I would have bacon and eggs, if I had some eggs. 

I am thankful for your input. This project already has some hard parameters. As I enter the later stages, based on your observations, I will continue to seek ways to lower the overall height, every little bit should help. 

Yes, both engines I have removed from raised vehicles, required extra jacks lifting and lowering of both the vehicle and the engine during removal for clearance, in other words--bullshit. 

 

[Rustbin]

I just thought of the most economical method to move something heavy across the lawn would be to have about 4 or more round sticks (like those round wood fence post pieces) or chunks of pipe, top with a piece of 3/4" plywood, put the engine on the plywood and roll till a stick come out from under the trailing edge put it under the leading edge and repeat till you get it to where you want it. Best if you have a friend help. A buddy of mine and I moved his big compressor that way, and I have used it to move large rocks in my garden. Maybe I should have thought of it when you started this thread.

[frankendat]

I've been thinking and nothing good ever come of that. Trying to grind/sand a 32nd off of all sides of my .25 wall 2-1/2 steel square tube, so that it would fit into the 3 inch (maybe 2-7/8) HB engine hoist tube proved ill advisable and was abandoned. I picked up some 2-3/8 x 1/2 wall round steel tube with an ID the same as the OD of the stem on the caster wheels. 

I cut down the round steel tube, so the hoes in the caster stem were accessible. (I didn't want to try to bore a hole through the round steel tube without a mill) Even getting it to line up and clear the teeth of the caster brake (using the round bushing in the picture + the spindle spacers formed earlier) was a time suck. Trying to do millimeter work with 1/4 inch equipment is a bitch. 

[frankendat]

Holy upside down Batman! Here is the latest of the hoist platform. Wheel base is 5-1/2 feet, width at the end is 32 inches (inside to inside) Top of the top beam is 11 inches at the front (at the casters) 10 inches at the top of the beam in the back (tires are higher than the beam in the back. 

 

[frankendat]

What I should do, it drill (4) 3/8 holes through the HB engine hoist tube and centered in the width of the steel round tube at 12 o'clock, 3, 6, and 9 o'clock, and plug weld the steel round tube in place. But, I might just risk it, the Miata engine and the Datsun engine are light engines.  

[frankendat]

A spent a good deal of time with Claude and Grok, they still make mistakes, which is both concerning and annoying, but I trust computers for math. Ran strength and rigidity computations and compared with standard harbor freight engine hoist. The upshot: Nesting the 2.5 inch square tube inside the harbor freight engine hoist boom increases the strength of the boom. Further nesting a 1.5 inch 1/8 wall tube within the 2.5 inch square tube increases the strength a bit more. Nesting both square steel tubes inside the harbor freight boom increases the strength to the point a 1.5 ton load can be held, without worry, at the farthest hole out on the boom, which I have modified to be at 48 inches. The total length of the boom is 50 inches and the distance from the end of the bottom extending legs to the "rear axle" is 60 inches.

To recap: The original harbor freight boom tube will be cut down to 36 inches. The 2.5 inch tube nested within the harbor freight tube, will run the entire length of the harbor freight boom tube. A 38 inch 2.0 tube will nest within the 2.5 tube. It will protrude into the 2.5 tube 24 inches and extend out of the 2.5 tube 14 inches. There will be a 36 inch 1.5 inch tube nested within the 2.0 tube. Mounting holes for the chain/hook will follow the pattern on the original harbor freight boom tube with the addition of a hole at the 48 inch mark. 

With penetrating oil, sledgehammer and the 4-ton hydraulic ram, I nested the 2.5 inch tube within the original harbor freight boom tube. I am trying the same trick with the other tubes, they are bit tighter. I knocked off for the night.