New rusty beat up 2 door

[DHale_510]

I live nearby and know a little about 510s. I have a few rusty stock heaters in a box and about 20 L16 and 4speed cores laying about, but no wrong motor options... Remember these are light, nimble cars, 2000# and 100hp. 200hp in a 3000# car is no longer either of these things.

Actually I do have a few spare Buick aluminum 215s laying around, and they are the original wrong motor swap...

Dennis

Edited September 1, 2022 by DHale_510
correct L16

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

15 hours ago, DHale_510 said:

 

Actually I do have a few spare Buick aluminum 215s laying around, and they are the original wrong motor swap...

Dennis

What ever happened to your V8 car? Piggy, wasn't it?

Edited September 2, 2022 by Stoffregen Motorsports

[DHale_510]

The V8 car is in the garage majal collection. We called it The Bluebird and Fat Bottom Girl. I ran it about 5 minutes after the last build from Rebello, maybe you did the build.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

On 9/5/2022 at 9:39 AM, DHale_510 said:

The V8 car is in the garage majal collection. We called it The Bluebird and Fat Bottom Girl. I ran it about 5 minutes after the last build from Rebello, maybe you did the build.

I think Dave built that one last time. Good to hear it's still around.

[sick620]

thoughts on stitch welding seams behind fenders and in engine bay for added rigidity? Not worth it because of added chance of rusting at seams?  

[sick620]

On 8/14/2022 at 9:52 AM, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

I was talking with my brother last night, and he said we took it down to bare metal before paint. I didn't remember that, but I'll take his word for it.

 

The wheels - American Racing and Shelby made "libre" wheels, and they are nearly identical, but with different center cap size and ribs vs no ribs in the spokes. Both are legit.

 

The pic of the two 510s and the 911 was taken about 1991. The light blue 510 was mine, the dark blue my brother's, and the 911 was my mom's. The dark blue car was insanely clean, but my Gulf blue car was super fast, with a 2200 making 210hp.

what motor was in bros car? 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

It had many different engines, but the past one we built for it was a "2150" which was an L18 block with an L20B crank stuffed into it and a 87mm bore (I think, though it could have been bigger). Short rod, long stroke, big bore. The head on it was a novice ported A87, or maybe 219, but we flow tested it and it actually worked really well, so we left it alone.

 

Had tons of off idle power and was hard to keep the tires from spinning. We only ever build a couple of these motors. They took lots of work to build and the juice wasn't worth the squeeze.

 

I would be really surprised if that motor has survived. It was built back when I just started working for Rebello, back in the very early '90s. Probably 1991.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

15 hours ago, sick620 said:

thoughts on stitch welding seams behind fenders and in engine bay for added rigidity? Not worth it because of added chance of rusting at seams?  

Yes. Always when you can. Doesn't hurt and can only help.

[DHale_510]

Since you have wild motor ideas, be very careful with removing metal from a 510. There is no extra. The firewall and tunnel when removed will require lots of heavy caging to replace. The V8 car is a ship in a bottle car. It twisted the roof as well as the engine box. Several cars twisted when subwoofer installs removed the brace behind the rear seat. A 2000# 510 with 200hp and trailing throttle oversteer rear suspension will be plenty methinks....

Dennis

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

I ran with a guy at a track day at Thunderhill once who had an SR20 and a turbo sticking out of the hood, He said it had 450hp to the wheels. He also said it wasn't any fun to drive.

 

I agree with Dennis. 200-250hp is just fine.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Wait, Dennis...weren't you the president of the UFO club at some point?

[DHale_510]

I was always the president of norcal UFO. I dreamed, Peggy made it work.

We were also the ones who started NASA with the Capri Club and low buck track days. I dreamed, Ali and Jerry helped, now Jerry claims he did it all. Sure.

Lots of experience with 150 to 250hp 510s.... 

The 300hp V8 car never could run an autocross with the pink car and was too weird, silly and fragile to actually drive it on a big track or at a hillclimb. And I was younger then.

Dennis

[sick620]

I am not 100% what my plans are in the short term. I have a l20b on a stand that is supposed to be a runner, and everything to put it in the car.. this project is going to be so overwhelming with all the body work then bolting it all together plus sourcing missing parts.. I’m thinking I’m going to focus on the body and getting the car together then run the l20b in it while I slowly stack the parts for the swap… Rome wasn’t built in a day I guess…

 

id maybe stay l20b if it was possible to get 140hp+ at the wheels with the head I have (non peanut) and just bore it out and doing a cam and headwork …but I don’t think that’s a reasonable expectation. 

[banzai510(hainz)]

21 hours ago, DHale_510 said:

Capri Club

Loved Capris. I had a 1978 3.litre Mk3 when I was in germany

Edited November 7, 2022 by banzai510(hainz)

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

17 hours ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

Lobved Capris. I had a 1978 3.litre Mk3 when I was in germany

Gerwaiian

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

20 hours ago, DHale_510 said:

I was always the president of norcal UFO. I dreamed, Peggy made it work.

We were also the ones who started NASA with the Capri Club and low buck track days. I dreamed, Ali and Jerry helped, now Jerry claims he did it all. Sure.

Lots of experience with 150 to 250hp 510s.... 

The 300hp V8 car never could run an autocross with the pink car and was too weird, silly and fragile to actually drive it on a big track or at a hillclimb. And I was younger then.

Dennis

Apologies. It's been a long time.

 

My brother Nick ran into Ali a while back. Apparently they are still going strong.

[sick620]

I just picked up some dual mikuni carbs, and an L series intake for a steal of a deal. A guy came by my house after seeing the Datsuns sitting in the driveway, said he had some old race parts laying around he'd sell. Ended up getting a jdm bigger valve 1200 head with 290 duration cam, completely rebuilt and never ran to put in my b210. And the mikuni carbs. He says the mikuni carbs are rare 48mm jdm market only carbs. He really knows his stuff so I want to believe this but I can't find info on a 48mm mikuni, maybe they are 44mm or 50 and he is mistaken? Either way these carbs have determined that I won't be swapping the engine in this car and just running a mild build L20b. Can anyone help Identify a vintage set of mikuni carbs?

 

@Stoffregen Motorsports I don't want to source z22 or z20 parts or anything fancy. Could you help me plan or give me some recommendations for a reasonable L20b build that can handle these carbs? I just want to make like 140-150hp. If they are in fact 48mm or 50mm will that be too much carb for an l20b? I thought maybe 2.1 long rod, but the only z20 rods I can find are $600. So probably just bore the block over with oversized l28 pistons like 87mm total size or something. Then probably just spend a lot of time porting an open chamber head with bigger valves and a cam. I don't know if this will be enough engine for these carbs though. 

Edited February 25, 2023 by sick620

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Almost all the power is in the cylinder head, so go as big as you can with L20B pistons to maximize the bottom end, and then focus on building a nice head.

 

You should also do some engine math and get yourself a burette and make or buy a cc plate so you can get accurate piston volume and combustion chamber numbers. It's not as important if you're going to leave the chambers alone, but removing material from the chamber for power gains, then yes, you should cc the head to make sure that the volume is where you need it.

 

10:1 CR is ideal.

 

In terms of cam and valvetrain, you can buy an off the shelf cam from Schneider or Isky or others, but in my opinion, Rebello has cam grinds that beat them all. As a matter of fact, those other guys use very old cam designs. Rebello's are newer and have found power and reliability where the others left off. You'll also need a valvetrain capable of handling whatever cam you decide to go with.

 

Get your distributor re-curved or learn how to do it yourself.

 

A good exhaust system and header will round out the package. Get or make a long header with either 2-1 or 4-2-1 collector, and a 2.5" exhaust and a turbo muffler are good enough, but a lazy-S style straight through muffler may give you a couple more ponies.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Post a pic of the carbs. I am not aware of 48mm Mikunis. Maybe they are 50's with 48mm chokes.

[datzenmike]

1 hour ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Almost all the power is in the cylinder head, so go as big as you can with L20B pistons to maximize the bottom end, and then focus on building a nice head.

 

You should also do some engine math and get yourself a burette and make or buy a cc plate so you can get accurate piston volume and combustion chamber numbers. It's not as important if you're going to leave the chambers alone, but removing material from the chamber for power gains, then yes, you should cc the head to make sure that the volume is where you need it.

 

10:1 CR is ideal.

 

 

 

 

 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

...and?

[iceman510]

50 Mikunis would really be too much for a street L20B.  As mentioned previously, 44 or 50 is normal.  I have never heard of 48's either.

 

48 is a common size for Webers, but downdraft not normally side draft.

 

 

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

The really big L fours can use 50s, but for a mild L20B, they are way too big. Which is why I wanted pics. I'm betting they aren't actually 50s. Some of the early 44s looked like 50s.

[sick620]

I'll have pics tomorrow or next day fingers crossed we have 44's. 

[Dime Dave]

Quickest way to tell the size of a Mikuni is to look on the thottle plate for a number. 180 is 50mm, 175 =44 and 165 =40mm. Or just measure the on the manifold side of the carb bore.