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Car Bogging, need advice with tuning and timing the engine.


Nate.a.v

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this matchbox come with the the mount???????? the one with the tang for the 10mm head bolt?  if you got this matcbox w/o the dist mount that bolts to the front cover then it could be off as there was 2 versions.  one will be like the one you have shown(fits the point and a Matchbox) and there was another Matchbox where the tang come out at more a 90deg angle.

 

you got it right you just turn the dist till it runs and youll be able to use a timin light and get it to say 10-12deg BTDC . but you wont be able to screw it down to hold it. because youDONT  have the right mount. Most Dtsunguys get excited to grab the dist but forget to get the matching mount.

 

now you could time the pump correctly 11/28 see if that works then if the timing plate is with in spec then you have the correct mount.

if not then you have to move the spindal back and make a plug wire number9move the wire 90deg then start your 1 3 4 2 fire order one that is close enough to use the timing slot movement. I cant explain it anybetter maybe Mike can but this is a 15min fix.

 

 

like I said before he said this was running good at one point and hasnt changed anything really inside the front cover(oil spindal)  you sure your on TDC?

 

look thru the oil cap hole that intake lobe will be in like 10 oclock poistion when its at TDC

Edited by banzai510(hainz)
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2 hours ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

this matchbox come with the the mount???????? the one with the tang for the 10mm head bolt?  if you got this matcbox w/o the dist mount that bolts to the front cover then it could be off as there was 2 versions.  one will be like the one you have shown(fits the point and a Matchbox) and there was another Matchbox where the tang come out at more a 90deg angle.

 

you got it right you just turn the dist till it runs and youll be able to use a timin light and get it to say 10-12deg BTDC . but you wont be able to screw it down to hold it. because youDONT  have the right mount. Most Dtsunguys get excited to grab the dist but forget to get the matching mount.

 

now you could time the pump correctly 11/28 see if that works then if the timing plate is with in spec then you have the correct mount.

if not then you have to move the spindal back and make a plug wire number9move the wire 90deg then start your 1 3 4 2 fire order one that is close enough to use the timing slot movement. I cant explain it anybetter maybe Mike can but this is a 15min fix.

 

 

like I said before he said this was running good at one point and hasnt changed anything really inside the front cover(oil spindal)  you sure your on TDC?

 

look thru the oil cap hole that intake lobe will be in like 10 oclock poistion when its at TDC

 

Okay guys, today I pulled the oil pump and the spindle. The dimples were way off from where they were suppose to be, i think almost 90 degrees clockwise. Lined up the dimples and tossed it back into the engine. Now the tang is at 11:28. Found the first plug and redid the firing order. Tried starting the car and still no dice, did the same thing as yesterday, would have to keep on the throttle to prevent it from dying and would backfire and die, it would also be smoking a bunch through the exhaust (when the car ran and drove it would also be smoking a bunch outta the exhaust). Then we put it back to where we did yesterday, past the allowed space on the base, and it started right up and idled/revved perfectly and no smoke or backfires.

 

Now I really have no clue other then it being the wrong mount. We reused the old mount on the points distributor onto the matchbox. I think the next plan is to get a timing light and see where we are at degrees wise when the mount is past the bolt. Any other suggestions would be great! Thanks guys!

 

Dimples Lined Up

IMG-8770.jpg

 

Tang at 11:28 

IMG-8771.jpg

 

 

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You should have used  the timing light first..... that would've have shown exactly where your timing is....

Your picture to me still seems like it's off one tooth....

When the the spindle is inserted and it engages the crank gear it slightly rotates ( cant remember forward or backward) .....  you could always try to get the spindle in the correct orientation first.... hold onto the spindle from the top and then install the oil pump......

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IMG-8771.jpg

 

This is correct now. The distributor will no turn the rotor to a new position. Look on the cap where the rotor points and that is the new number 1 plug wire. Move all wires counter clockwise on cap 1 3 4 2 firing order. This will be close to correct timing but you will have to turn the adjustment. You can set the timing with a lamp even using just the starter.

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I plan on using a timing gun later today to see where we are at when the car is running smoothly. Once i get the results ill report back to you guys. I'm thinking that we need a mount with more play as seen below. 

 

Hopefully theres another option, since the plate alone cost $40. If there isnt i'll just bite the bullet and purchase it. Thanks!

datsun-240z-280z-510-620-e1280-electroni

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never seen a timing plate like that before

 

 

whe you had the spindle in the 11/28 was the rotor pointing on a plug wire directly when the dist lock down and have the timing plate on and its in the middle of the movement . You dont need a timing light but it helps. But you said in the very early post you could not get it below like 12 crank all the way retard. so that is obvious. So now you say you need a timing light so this gets confusing

 

ps someone told me maybe you could flip the timing plate opside down and get it in the right direction

 

 

this is EZ  whell hopefully before  you put the spndle in the motor was at Zero on the crank and 10oclock on intake and 2 oclock on exhaust then you have TDC

Edited by banzai510(hainz)
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Hainz- When I dropped the spindle and oil pump the engine was at TDC (0 degrees at the timing mark) and the cam lobes were 10 and 2, made sure it was correct and pulled the valve cover off. When we reinstalled the distributor after repositioning the spindle the rotor was pointing directly at the plug, which we then put as the 1st plug and redid the firing order.

 

Started the car past the bolt on the timing plate today, car fired right up . We used a timing light and when the distributor's timing plate was past the bolt it was at 0 degrees. When we went a bit farther clock wise we got around 15 degree so if we have more adjustability as shown in that aftermarket timing plate then we could bolt down the distributor at 12 degrees and have it stay there. Thanks! (see videos below for reference) (white mark on crank is the notch) (the timing bracket goes 20, 15, 10, 5, 0)

 

At 0 Degrees

 

At 15 Degrees

 

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If I remmeber right   one should go between - up to 25 BTDC with the light and means the dist is pretty much on correct.

 

remember the 8mm bolt under the dist to get more or less movent in the direction you need if possible from the timing plate

 

 

all elase fails get a small tiny winnie vise grap and get the timing what you need and drive it hard and adjust the carb. then get the right parts what you need if you really think soemthing is mismatched.  Othesr move the spindal one way or the other to get it right if the parts didnt match up.

 

the 11/28 is the factory setting with the factory supplied mount and distributor

 

 

its like timing a clock you can move the face of the clock or the arms  or even rotate the plug wires off one when starting out from 1 3 4 2 ccw to get with in the timing plate slot movment

 

most time i can come up to a car put on TDC and I pop the cp and if the rotor is between 1 and 3 I know its off esp if the dist is cranked to one side all the way. cuae if you put if in the middle of the timing plate it will be more towards 3 if noton it thus not starting or hard to start

Edited by banzai510(hainz)
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