1971 datsun 510 STRUT HOUSING QUESTION

[Tuan]

HEY GUYS, I HAVE A 1971 DATSUN 510 2 DOOR AND I JUST TOOK APART THE FRONT STRUT TO CLEAN AND LIKELY SEND IT IN TO HAVE COILOVER SYSTEM WELDED ON, BUT I NOTICED THAT ONE STRUT IS SHORTER THAN THE OTHER. IS THIS NORMAL , OR DID PREVIOUS OWNER THREW ON 280ZX/ 200ZX STRUTS??  ALSO THE STRUT NUTS ARE DIFFERENT TOO. =?

 

THE STOCK 510 CALIPERS / SPRINGS/ TOP HATES / ROTORS / HUBS WERE ON THE STRUT AND IDENTICAL. BUT THE HOUSING ONE IS SHORTER THAN THE OTHER.   

 

I'VE NEVER DONE THIS SO NOT SURE IF THIS IS HOW IT IS SUPPOSE TO BE? 

Edited January 25, 2021 by Tuan

[thisismatt]

Not correct.  Likely off another era correct Datsun.  280zx has a different spindle (larger) so stock 510 hubs & brakes would not fit it.  280zx also has a larger spring diameter and thus larger spring perch.  If going to coilovers I would just go ahead and find 280zx struts, or some of the others that will work (200sx 4-lug, maxima, etc).

[Draker]

Yeah this is incorrect. On the tube there will be a part number, find them and post your results. That will help identify them.

[datzenmike]

I WANT TO KNOW WHY YOU ARE SHOUTING!!!!

 

Try a normal voice like this. The caliper bolt spacing for the PL510 caliper is 76mm the 280zx is 89mm so that's not from a 280zx. The much later A10 (HL510) from the late '70 early '80 has the same bolt spacing. The one on the left definitely has a larger diameter spring.

 

 

The 10 digit part number starts with 54302- ?????

 

 

[thisismatt]

16 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

The one on the left definitely has a larger diameter spring

 

 

 

Dunno, I think that's just the camera angle.  The red & blue lines are the same length, respectively.  So, unless you think the tubes are different diameter also...

 

Edited January 25, 2021 by thisismatt

[datzenmike]

Good eye.

 

How about... the spindle looks larger diameter on the left one? That would make it the non 510 one. The PL510 and early 610 uses the smaller wheel bearings.

[Icehouse]

Isn't that just early and late struts?  Remember the raised the front of the 510 for bumper laws.  

[datzenmike]

There were different struts but the wheel bearings were the same. Jeff does the left one, where the wheel bearing rides, look larger diameter to you? If it does it's not the PL510 strut.

 

There is a big change in the part number's last 5 digits for the strut in December '68, or half way into the '69 model year.

26125

26126

26127

26128

then all change to

A2625

A2626

 

As I mentioned earlier the A10 had a similar mounting bolt pattern as the PL510. If the strut last 5 digits start with  W5825

[420n620]

12 hours ago, Tuan said:

 

 

 

from what I can tell, the struts are NOT from a A10 cause the lower spring perch is to large. The A10's had a smaller perch. I'll swing by the shop and get a measurement, pic and see if I can find a part number on the strut tube.

[Icehouse]

1 hour ago, datzenmike said:

There were different struts but the wheel bearings were the same. Jeff does the left one, where the wheel bearing rides, look larger diameter to you? If it does it's not the PL510 strut.

 

There is a big change in the part number's last 5 digits for the strut in December '68, or half way into the '69 model year.

26125

26126

26127

26128

then all change to

A2625

A2626

 

As I mentioned earlier the A10 had a similar mounting bolt pattern as the PL510. If the strut last 5 digits start with  W5825

 

 

The spindle looks the same to me.  I bet it's just an early unit vs. late.  I've seen it quit often.  I know some oldschool guys would hunt for the early struts to lower the car the cheap way.  

[banzai510(hainz)]

510 had 3 strut lengths

68 69 were short

then the Longest  70/71

theen a mid size late 71 72

 

cut the tubes the same then your fine. but make sure the spring seat perch is high enough to put the tire on and not hit it if you run a +25 rim  15x7 rim

Means perch welded in the right spot as 510 want more + off set rim  I went with a 7in spring instead of common 8in.

 

 weld for a 280zx strut cartridge

 

maybe best to have someone do it and have your wheel selection with it.

Edited January 25, 2021 by banzai510(hainz)

[datzenmike]

4 hours ago, Icehouse said:

 

 

The spindle looks the same to me.  I bet it's just an early unit vs. late.  I've seen it quit often.  I know some oldschool guys would hunt for the early struts to lower the car the cheap way.  

 

Old eyes.

[Tuan]

THE HEIGHT OF THE TUBES IS WHAT BOTHERS ME.  

 

ALL OTHER DIMENSIONS SEEM TO BE THE SAME. 

 

SAME CALIPERS (510 CALIPERS)

SAME HUBS 

SAME ROTORS

SAME BACKING PLATE

SAME SPRINGS

SAME TOP HATS. 

 

IM NOT SURE IF THESE CAME ON THE CAR BUT CAME ON THE CAR WHEN I GOT THEM. 

Edited January 26, 2021 by Tuan

[demo243]

27 minutes ago, Tuan said:

THE HEIGHT OF THE TUBES IS WHAT BOTHERS ME.  

 

ALL OTHER DIMENSIONS SEEM TO BE THE SAME. 

 

SAME CALIPERS (510 CALIPERS)

SAME HUBS 

SAME ROTORS

SAME BACKING PLATE

SAME SPRINGS

SAME TOP HATS. 

 

IM NOT SURE IF THESE CAME ON THE CAR BUT CAME ON THE CAR WHEN I GOT THEM. 

 

There are a number of potential reasons for this... The most likely is that at some point under a prior owner the car was in a small accident, bumped a curb or something and bent a spindle. The owner went to the local junk yard and grabbed a spare strut without giving it a second thought - as Hainz pointed out there are 3 different lengths depending on what year. The owner probably never took the other side off to even compare. With how old these cars are and how many hands they have changed through its not too surprising to see this. 

 

9 hours ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

510 had 3 strut lengths

68 69 were short

then the Longest  70/71

theen a mid size late 71 72

 

The easy solution is to cut them as hainz said. Either convert it to a coil over with a T3/Ground control kit, or go the cheap route and re-weld the stock perch on. 

 

9 hours ago, banzai510(hainz) said:

cut the tubes the same then your fine. but make sure the spring seat perch is high enough to put the tire on and not hit it if you run a +25 rim  15x7 rim

Means perch welded in the right spot as 510 want more + off set rim  I went with a 7in spring instead of common 8in

The other option is to ditch them and go 280zx set up which gives you a brake upgrade at the same time. Just don't trash em! At the very least give them away to someone. Some of us still run 510 strut housings and havent gone the 280zx route. 

[datzenmike]

37 minutes ago, demo243 said:

The easy solution is to cut them as hainz said. Either convert it to a coil over with a T3/Ground control kit, or go the cheap route and re-weld the stock perch on. 

 

 

You don't have to weld them. For $20 get 2" split collars and clamp under the spring perch. If you don't like the height, loosen reposition and tighten them again... in other words they are adjustable for $20. Each split collar is rated at 5,000 pounds. That's 2 1/2 510 weight per strut.

 

[demo243]

5 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

 

You don't have to weld them. For $20 get 2" split collars and clamp under the spring perch. If you don't like the height, loosen reposition and tighten them again... in other words they are adjustable for $20. Each split collar is rated at 5,000 pounds. That's 2 1/2 510 weight per strut.

 

 

 

^^^ this is true. Thats actually how my car was set up when I bought it. I swapped to coilovers for more adjustability, but I am still running the clamps - I got lucky and my housings were already shortened.

If he needs to have someone cut and weld his housings though to shorten them, might as well have them weld those perches back on if going that route... 

[datzenmike]

The point is, once welded you can't adjust so you better have it where you want it..

[Tuan]

Thank you GUYS! you all answered my question. i thought there would be a zenki / chuki / and kouki version.  

okay, Well, guess i'll looking into either 280zx or 200sx V6 and running Z32 calipers. 

Thank you! 

[420n620]

The 79/80 510 A10 is on the left, right 82 280zx. 

On the A10 struts the part numbers found were, left 54303-W5800, right 54302- W5800.

Hope it helps others later down the road. 

 

 

Edited January 28, 2021 by 420n620

[yenpit]

On 1/25/2021 at 9:46 AM, banzai510(hainz) said:

510 had 3 strut lengths

68 69 were short

then the Longest  70/71

theen a mid size late 71 72

 

cut the tubes the same then your fine. but make sure the spring seat perch is high enough to put the tire on and not hit it if you run a +25 rim  15x7 rim

Means perch welded in the right spot as 510 want more + off set rim  I went with a 7in spring instead of common 8in.

 

 

Think it was 68-69 short, 70-72 mid, then 73 only tall for the raised bumper ride height.  The short MIGHT be a 68-69 & the tall might be the 73.........those two are noticeably different, so I doubt either one is a 70-72...............🙄

 

You might be better off buying a matched pair of strut tubes..............pretty sure I have all three versions.  I also have a pair of complete 280ZX (NOT the 70-78 Z car!) strut assemblies with brakes, but not cheap anymore & VERY heavy to ship.........but I can!  PM me if interested!

 

TJ

[jbirds510]

Go get rabbit struts, drop them in and then adjust tube length to suit. If you intend to run coilovers i like to make my strut tube cut where youd be welding the ring that supports the new coilovers on the tube thus putting the tube weld under the weld on ring. Just my .02.

[Tedman]

For the PL510:

 

Years          "A" in inches

'68-'69         10 1/2

'72-'73            11

'70-'71          11 1/2

 

 

[banzai510(hainz)]

great drawing seen this before

now if your going to shorten the dtruts to a 280zx length  then if doenst matter if the 2 you have are different sizes as long as they are 510 structs brakes

[ByStickel]

Now that the question has been fully answered, I'll ask a semi-off-topic question:

 

How far off the ground is the front crossmember when the stock-length struts bottom?

 

How far off the ground is it when the shortened struts bottom?

 

I can't help but think that shortening the struts only lets the chassis hit the ground when bottomed. Is this mod for folks running tires more than 23" in diameter?

[datzenmike]

 All struts have a range of motion over uneven roads. This allows the 'shock absorber' inside to resist compression and rebound. Lowering the body on a stock strut places the extreme compression stroke dangerously close to bottoming out. If it bottoms out the suspension as we know stops working and it now becomes the tire and the air in it. Basically a bouncing rubber ball. A shortened or shorter strut allows the body to be lower and still have a range of motion that allow the built in 'shock absorber' to do it's job.

 

All struts have a rubber rebound under the top spring seat to mitigate actual metal to metal bottoming out. It's still not good to bottom out the compression/rebound valves inside.

 

Anyone serious about vehicle handling improvements from lowering the center of gravity would also include a stiffer spring rate which would also go a long way to prevent bottoming the struts or the chassis.

 

 

 

Is there a chassis measurement for a bottomed out strut? Not that I know.  The exhaust system is probably the lowest part of the car and if you are 'rubbing' the exhaust on the ground then you are either too low or you need stiffer springs.

 

No, lowering is not for using larger diameter tires. Larger diameter tires should be avoided to prevent rubbing the chassis during chassis movements, and turning. In addition a larger diameter tire affect the over all differential gearing making performance more sluggish and throwing the speedometer/odometer out.  You can always go to a wider tire and a 14 or 15 inch rim and still maintain the stock over all diameter.