Newbie looking for parts - 1972 PL620

[Dubnut]

HI All

 

I'm the new guy- In Spokane WA - with a fairly new to me 620 that has seen better centuries...

 

The truck is mostly stock, and I would like to keep it that way (And find the Stock parts that it is missing, tho the body might fall off first)

 

I'm trying to find a reliable source for parts.

I've got the number for Datsun Recyclers in Springfield OR - But they aren't picking up the phone lately..  I do not have an email if someone has that.

 

Specifically at this time I'm looking for 4 speed parts (Reverse Gears - not eaten, good Striker Rod) and a good set of upper pivot pins with hardware if anyone has leads.

 

I would appreciate it.

 

Thanks

[datzenmike]

Though the build date may be in '72 the first 620 is considered a '73. If ordering parts and you say a '72 you might be sent 521 parts.

 

 

 

It's usually the reverse idler, the small one, that gets ground up from shifting into reverse while the truck is still moving forward. Have you considered putting the gear on backwards putting the worn teeth to the front?

 

There's not much to wear out on the striker rod but if the shifter feels vague it's likely the bushings that are worn. The shifter is aptly called the 'monkey motion' shifter. The rubber cone washers (8) can be tightened with washers. Clearances can be reduced with washers (thin) at (17 & 19) but not too tight as the linkage must move

 

[Dubnut]

Here's what rolled in...  You don't want to know what it looks like now...  🙂

 

I ripped this apart and cleaned it within an inch of it's life..  still needs a bit but it's serviceable.

 

The Striker rod in question after I removed it.  I've got a few close ups...

 

As you can see from the side view, it's been wearing for some time, Both sides look as such.

 

 

So like I said, I was thinking if I cannot source a know good rod I can plug the pin hole from the other side with a brass drift and lay a bead down either side of the face, then machine/file it back to shape.  Added bonus, the weld will be stronger than the original material.

 

I had already sourced the bushings thinking that was the problem..  got into it and discovered the bushings were fairly new...

The guide shaft that the shift arm sits on is also worn so I will try to source new components there as well..  given time.

 

I do appreciate the fiche though..   OEM part numbers are hard to come by and they help with research.

 

Cheers

 

[Dubnut]

The Reverse idler and the main....  The idler is missing a few chunks as well..  so.... Yeah Let me know if you have sources..  I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[datzenmike]

Well you may not be able to put the idler in backwards, but reverse is the least used gear and as long as it isn't missing any teeth it will work for a long long time.

 

Reverse idler 14 tooth..... 32284-14600

Reverse gear 39 tooth..... 32245-A0950

 

Striking rod....................... 32890-15800

Lever control.................... 32843-A4850 or R3250 (superseded number?) This is the part that moves the striking rod.

 

 

 

[docbainey]

Looks like either of these places have the idler gear and the striking rod. Id start with jp-carparts. I believe you do an inquiry first, they make sure they have parts available then you pay. (I've never used jp) Amayama will say they have the parts, want money up front, then sometimes they cant get the parts and leave you with a credit. (personal experience) Shipping from Japan is not cheap, but hey brand new parts!

 

The last place sells used parts and is in Oregon, never dealt with them.

 

https://jp-carparts.com/

 

https://www.amayama.com/en

 

http://mmerlinn.com/catalog/makeridx.htm

[620slodat]

I'm from Albany, Oregon. Does that last wrecking yard have an Albany address? Going by the link I'm wondering if it does as this is Linn County. There are three yards with an Albany address, and two have other yards within a few miles, and one of those two has at least one yard about 40 to 50 miles away. The other guess is Merlin, which is close to Grants Pass. It has been since the early 70's since I've lived in Grants Pass, but I don't remember a yard in Merlin. However, there has been a lot of time passed since the early 70's.

 

Don

Edited September 30, 2020 by 620slodat

[Dubnut]

Thank You Doc for that website info.  I Have an inquiry in with jp-carparts as I type this...  It is appreciated.

In the mean time, I opened up the valve cover to take a look and make sure nothing was amiss there.  Wouldn't you know it, missing a lash cap, two caps are installed wrong, and found a  chewed up a valve spring keeper as well..  That also is in the inquiry..  Other than poor assembly skills and incorrect valve adjustment, htf does that happen?

 

Cheers

 

Jerome

[Draker]

Datsun recyclers stopped advertising parts. Still have a ton of stuff but pretty much got out of the parts game. 4 speed parts should be too hard to come by. Maybe ask @hobospyder. 
 

im local to Datsun recyclers but don’t go there all too often. 

[hobospyder]

i should have an extra 4 speed down in the shop. but i'm not taking it apart, if you want part of it you get the whole thing. just on the other side of the state from you

[Dubnut]

So, Update:

 

I got some of the parts I needed from JP-carparts in Japan, along with some other parts I discovered I needed.

 

The Striker Rod - brand new - (Yeah, we got that...)

They did not have the Rod Bushing - Discontinued - So....  I strolled over to McMaster-Carr and had them make me one for $40. (will be here in two weeks)

They also did not have the Reverse Gears - So I need to source someone with 4 speeds in pieces (not common, I know).

I can't justify the cost of a complete 4-Speed trans that I WILL open up just to inspect when all I need is a gear for the one I already have.  Not to mention I really do not have the storage for another trans ( I do but, lugging around all the spare parts you own when you plan on moving is a serious PITA)

 

Hobo - I might already be E-mailing with you..  there are a few inquiries I've made via Craigslist locally.

 

As I mentioned prior, I found Lash caps and Spring hats damaged and needing replaced..  Sourced a full set of both through JP-carparts in the same order (tho, they get to make the caps).

 

I Definitely appreciate the links to those guys.

 

Mmerlin will not respond to email or phone until the 13th, fingers crossed that they may have a reverse gear set.

[Crashtd420]

On 10/10/2020 at 11:59 PM, Dubnut said:

 

They also did not have the Reverse Gears - So I need to source someone with 4 speeds in pieces (not common, I know).

 

Mmerlin will not respond to email or phone until the 13th, fingers crossed that they may have a reverse gear set.

 

The reverse gear your after is for the 63series 4 spd right?

If things dont work out for you send me private message... I likely have what you need in my basement...

I upgraded to a stumpy 71b 5spd in my 521, I'm keeping my 4spd as a backup but I had bought a parts transmission at one point ... i already sold the one part i actually bought it for... the tail housing... so I have the rest still... I've never even unbolted it from the pallet it was delivered on so I have no idea the condition yet....

 

[Dubnut]

On 10/13/2020 at 7:25 AM, Crashtd420 said:

 

The reverse gear your after is for the 63series 4 spd right?

If things dont work out for you send me private message... I likely have what you need in my basement...

I upgraded to a stumpy 71b 5spd in my 521, I'm keeping my 4spd as a backup but I had bought a parts transmission at one point ... i already sold the one part i actually bought it for... the tail housing... so I have the rest still... I've never even unbolted it from the pallet it was delivered on so I have no idea the condition yet....

 

Yes 63W Prior to September of 72 is correct for the application.  I'll get hold of you by next week if I do not hear from Merlin by then.  Thank you

[mmerlinn]

19 hours ago, Dubnut said:

Yes 63W Prior to September of 72 is correct for the application.  I'll get hold of you by next week if I do not hear from Merlin by then.  Thank you

I have a set a gears out of a 4-speeed W63 built in July 1972. Gears have some small chips, but nothing like what I see in your pictures.

[datzenmike]

The 4 speed is an F4W63. There is a later variant called an F4W63L used from '74 and up. The W is common to almost all Datsun 4 and 5 speeds and only identifies the Warner synchronizers used and does not identify the transmission. The 63 signifies the center to center distance (in mm) between the mainshaft and the counter gear. There are at least two totally different transmissions with a 63 in  the name. The smaller the number the smaller the gear diameters and the thinner the teeth giving a relative strength of the transmission. The FS5W71B in the trucks and six cylinder cars indicates a much stronger transmission.

[mmerlinn]

On 9/29/2020 at 8:58 PM, 620slodat said:

I'm from Albany, Oregon. Does that last wrecking yard have an Albany address? Going by the link I'm wondering if it does as this is Linn County. There are three yards with an Albany address, and two have other yards within a few miles, and one of those two has at least one yard about 40 to 50 miles away. The other guess is Merlin, which is close to Grants Pass. It has been since the early 70's since I've lived in Grants Pass, but I don't remember a yard in Merlin. However, there has been a lot of time passed since the early 70's.

 

Don

I am in Douglas County near Roseburg.

 

There are 7 wrecking yards in/near Albany (97321 & 97322 zip codes), two on Queen St, one on north side of Hwy 20 (they have 8 locations open to the public and  2 storage locations), one further out on south side of Hwy 20 (seldom open), one on Goldfish Farm Rd (they have 19 locations), one in Millersburg, and one on Oakville Rd south of town.

 

Merlin, Oregon, near Grants Pass, had a wrecking yard 20 or so years ago, but it is long gone.

[620slodat]

Just out of curiosity, where did you get your information? There are not two wrecking yards on Queen St, only one. The wrecking yard on Queen, although quite small, is the first place I check when I am looking for something. There used to be a yard (several years ago it closed) on the very west end of Queen, but small and very messy, and located between the old OE Line railroad and the end of Queen. It actually fronted on Riverside Drive, and close to where the east end of Riverside ended Queen crossed the Calapooia River, turned south and became Oakville Road. The rest of the yards in the area (that I did not include) may have Albany addresses, but are several miles out of town. Also, if there is a yard in the Millersburg area I would like to check it out as I live about a half mile north of the north edge of the "town". It is a very spread out, and rural, "town" that has the  north/south main railroad as it's eastern boundary.

 

Don 

[mmerlinn]

Don, there is a Mustang yard (very small) just west of AA Towing on same side of street.

 

Riverside auto wrecking closed several years ago when the owner (can't remember his name) retired.

 

The Millersburg yard is mostly a scrap yard and typically closes by 3pm if he even opens at all. Take the road west past city hall and the yard is on the left just before the RR tracks.

 

I know all of this because I very frequently, many times per year, visit all of them looking for transmission cores.

 

In my estimation, the only ones several miles out of town are the Millersburg and Oakville road yards. Goldfish Farm Rd is barely East of I-5, the next yard (used to be Harris AW if I remember correctly) is one block further. A mile further at Scravel Hill road is the other one on Hwy 20 that is seldom open.

[620slodat]

14 hours ago, mmerlinn said:

Don, there is a Mustang yard (very small) just west of AA Towing on same side of street.

 

Riverside auto wrecking closed several years ago when the owner (can't remember his name) retired.

 

The Millersburg yard is mostly a scrap yard and typically closes by 3pm if he even opens at all. Take the road west past city hall and the yard is on the left just before the RR tracks.

 

I know all of this because I very frequently, many times per year, visit all of them looking for transmission cores.

 

In my estimation, the only ones several miles out of town are the Millersburg and Oakville road yards. Goldfish Farm Rd is barely East of I-5, the next yard (used to be Harris AW if I remember correctly) is one block further. A mile further at Scravel Hill road is the other one on Hwy 20 that is seldom open.

 

I didn't know about the Mustang yard. I knew about the Mustang place, but I never knew they had a yard also. Of course, I don't have a vintage Mustang either (my brother had two back when they didn't have much value). The Millersburg yard is one I never even thought about. In my mind it is only a scrap yard. It was there when I was in Millersburg Grade School back in the late fifties and early sixties. The Paul family actually lived on site at the time. The older son (deceased now) was about my age. We live on the property I grew up on, just north of the Grange Hall.

 

The Goldfish Farm yard was there when I was in high school. It was family owned at the time, and I went to high school with the son of the owner. That yard is now owned? by a guy that is friends with somebody I used to work for (he has several throughout the Willamette Valley). There is another yard less than half a mile away (also several other yards), fronting on Hwy 20. It has also gone through at least one hand in my time. The yard at the end of Scravel Hill Rd used to be open as a wrecking yard, but has been a scrap yard for many years. So it is open only once in a while? It doesn't even look like it is open any more.

 

Albany has gone through some MAJOR changes since I was in school.

 

Don

[Dubnut]

I just received the Gears purchased from Merlin in the mail today.

The Bushings I ordered from McMaster-Carr arrived Tuesday.

And got an email this morning that my parts shipped from Japan via FedEx last night.

 

So..  It shouldn't take much longer before I can put the transmission back together.

 

Thanks Merlin for finding those for me.  Better than the ones that I'm replacing for sure.

 

I'll keep you posted - But nice to see another source for info/parts...

[Dubnut]

So, thread re-jack:

 

Got the machining done on the shift linkage, and all new parts from Japan have arrived.

Slowly putting the machine back together.

 

 

The oil impregnated brass bushings were off the shelf items, the Steel bushing had to be made.

 

That was the old one                                                                       The new one looks much better and I don't need the lube hole because of the new bushings.

 

 

The Shift Linkage arm before any machining was done...            After the machining the brass bushing is pressed in with an arbor, one on each side..  simple right?  the brass bushings also needed 0.2mm honed from the I.D. in order to have the proper sliding fit I wanted for the steel shaft.

 

Still do not have everything together - I got busy with the holidays - But I can say for sure that it will no longer have any play in the shifter after this goes in.  The brand new Striking rod from japan will go a long way toward solving the problems as well..  The only thing I haven't found that I would like to would be two wave/spring washers proper size to go either end of the shift linkage to prevent or minimize walk..  but...  I might come up with some before it gets pressed, who knows.

[Dubnut]

So finally managed time to put the transmission back together.  The shift pattern was so tight together I had to put the stick in it and make sure I hadn't messed anything up internally.  Shifting the arm by hand it was too hard to tell if I was in between gears or not.  It is much improved over what it was.  There is still some wobble in the stick but that is from the other linkage arm that is discontinued.  It's minimal, but it's there.

 

It's in the truck and together - managed to replace the old nasty bullet connectors on the trans switches with one Deutsch connector while I was at it..

 

And just got the cylinder head off(I like to go through things).  Not terrible in there and even managed to find the missing lash cap floating around in the valve train while I was at it.  So that is on the bench and being inspected now.

 

This may wind up having to be moved to Projects...

 

 

I will post pics when I can

 

 

[Dubnut]

So I was worried about lateral movement of the linkage when putting this thing together - i cut these with a heat knife until I got the right thickness to put one either side of the linkage before pressing in.  I had this poly kit form a suspension off an older VW.  These components were for another model and just sitting in my box o' goodies for years...  Figured it couldn't hurt.

You can see they barely fit in there - but I couldn't find wave washers the right I.D. for it....

There is no play - at all...

Normally these have an o-ring in them to prevent oil seepage from the lube hole.  Seeing as I no longer needed them I thought I'd try something...

Yes, that is an old pressure ring from a 3/4" brake master cylinder...

They fit beautifully inside the steel ring for the striking rod - however the rod itself did NOT want to go through the I.D.without serious stretching - Got them in and then the steel ring was too thick to press properly.  I figured if I trimmed them to fit it would work way better than an o-ring, but these were in great shape so I erred on the side of caution and just used the standard o-ring.  If anyone has problems with leakage at this spot and you have a set of older seals from a brake master cylinder and want to trim to size, it's an option.

All back together and ready to go in...  I pulled the clutch to inspect before I re-installed.  Glad I did so because the rear main was not installed correctly by whoever was in there last..

Fixed that and re-installed everything.  There is maybe one inch of side to side play at most in the stick now..  mostly from the linkage piece that the stick bolts into - that part is unobtanium new...

 

Then I tore into this....  another story entirely - and yes, I pulled the bushings - there was unusual wear in two and three from the cam - the whole thing is in the cylinder head shop now getting hot tanked, tested, machined and inspected as I type.  It was fun carrying it there on my back..  Alice pack frames are a good thing to have laying around.  I did manage to find the missing lash cap as I said earlier, it was in the rear corner of the cylinder head buried in old oil buildup - that could have been really bad.

[MikeRL411]

The "wavy washers" are called Bellville washers.

[mmerlinn]

On 12/28/2020 at 11:44 AM, MikeRL411 said:

The "wavy washers" are called Bellville washers.

 

In my neck of the woods, bellville washers are coned, usually with inner fingers, and not wavy. Never heard a wavy washer being called a bellville washer before.