destruction of america

[Str8jacket]

8 minutes ago, BrothersGarage said:

1. First shooting you can argue was self defense - which him shooting the guy chasing him and throwing stuff at him. 

2. Then when he leaves the scene of the shooting - you are not actively committing a crime. 

3. As a criminal and people are chasing to detain you, you have no rights to self defense laws from this point forward. You're only trying to not get caught / hurt by them. Self preservation.

Lets just say you were stuck in traffic. And you watch 2 idiots a couple cars up from you start to road rage and get out of their vehicles. One guy gets out with a tire iron, the other a gun. The tire iron guy charges the guy with the gun with it raised above his head. Guy with a gun shoots him. Self defense right?

Now the guy that shot him gets on the phone, but jumps in his car and tries to drive away. A couple cars block him in and he drives over the curb and runs 2 people over - killing one of them and running over a guy trying to break the window with the butt of a gun.  He drives down the block and pulls into a police station and talks to a cop and that cop drives up towards the scene and the guy with the gun drives home. The next day the guy with the gun is arrested and does not put up a fight. 

Would you make the same arguments for this guy as you would Kyle?
 

Yeah he really should have stuck around and got beat to death by that understanding rabid mob that while in the course of peacefully rioting saw this incedent and were only going to fatally  detain him until the police could arrive and arrest him. 🤪

[BrothersGarage]

22 minutes ago, Mattndew76 said:

 

Not an equivalent argument.

 

One is domestic violence and the other takes place in civil conflict. Legally defined instances matter. 

 

Riot vs Traffic Jam 

 

The Driver was under no attack by other assailants. So there was no reason for him to move from the scene. No self preservation. 

 

Kyle was under attack by more than one individual. He didn't flee the scene to get away from what he did. In the DA filing document has a statement given by the direct witness states that Kyle was chased from the scene of Rosenbaum. Unlike your hypothetical scenario in the quote. 

 

Kyle legally had the right to self-defend and self-preserve since those two words are legally the same under Wisconsin law.

He could have left the "riot" at any point in time. Kyle wasn't under attack before he fled either. No reason for him to leave the scene in like 20 seconds after shooting the guy. 2 videos above show that clear as day.

Self preservation isn't a reason to murder someone when you're actively committing a crime to begin with...

I would like to read the document that has the statement give by the witnesses. Videos show he was chased after he ran - not that he was chased off. 

Sure he did, like I've stated in the first scenario. Though it was illegal for him to have that weapon there he likely used it in self defense when he was being chased by the baled headed dude. Not when he was trying to flee the scene. 
 

Quote

So I say again. STOP making the false assertion he "illegally brandished and fled" from the scene.

K. He was illegally in possession of a firearm. After shooting a man in the head with it, RAN AWAY from the scene without any reason - actively committing a crime. 

Edited August 30, 2020 by BrothersGarage

[Mattndew76]

1 minute ago, BrothersGarage said:

He could have left the "riot" at any point in time. Kyle wasn't under attack before he fled either. No reason for him to leave the scene in like 20 seconds after shooting the guy. 2 videos above show that clear as day. 

So you didn't fully read the comment where someone was trying to break into the vehicle with the butt of a gun? K. 

 

So by definition your hypothetical story is a straw-man fallacy..

 

did you know this? 

 

Keep grasping at your illogical straws muh dude. 

 

The Felons all lived farther away from Kenosha than Kyle, and had NO business being in the city. Kyle actually fucking worked in Kenosha and had reason to be there since he was part of the community. 

 

 

[BrothersGarage]

7 minutes ago, Str8jacket said:

Yeah he really should have stuck around and got beat to death by that understanding rabid mob that while in the course of peacefully rioting saw this incedent and were only going to fatally  detain him until the police could arrive and arrest him. 🤪

Or he could have used that little med kit he was super proud of having to help the guy he shot. Or he could have called an ambulance. Or he could of used his gun again if more people tried to attack him while at the scene. You know, instead of sprinting away like 20 seconds after the shooting. People only started shouting at others that he shot someone after he runs from the scene, and then people give chase. Kid was a dumbass that made dumbass decisions. 

[Str8jacket]

3 minutes ago, BrothersGarage said:

Kid was a dumbass that made dumbass decisions. 

Who shot three even bigger dumbasses, i still dont see any issues? Let the police and legal sort it out. I am surprised anyone is even reporting on it, stupid white kid shot stupid white men. Nothing to see here? 

[BrothersGarage]

Just now, Mattndew76 said:

 

So by definition your hypothetical story is a straw-man fallacy..

 

did you know this? 

 

Keep grasping at your illogical straws muh dude. 

 

The Felons all lived farther away from Kenosha than Kyle, and had NO business being in the city. Kyle actually fucking worked in Kenosha and had reason to be there since he was part of the community. 

 

 

It's called an example . I am not saying they were the same, and I am not trying to use it to 'win' the discussion. I am using it as a way to convey the difference between self defense and self preservation in relation to your question on what the difference between them was. Hence why it was used after answering your questions. Not that difficult to understand the difference between an example and a straw-man. 

Not that it matters that the 3 people that were shot - came from further away than Kyle, but all of them, Kyle included were dumbasses and had no business being there. Kyle worked there, but was out past curfew (because of the riots), and had a firearm on him illegally. But keep making excuses for his poor decisions. 

 

[wayno]

12 minutes ago, BrothersGarage said:

Or he could have used that little med kit he was super proud of having to help the guy he shot. Or he could have called an ambulance. Or he could of used his gun again if more people tried to attack him while at the scene. You know, instead of sprinting away like 20 seconds after the shooting. People only started shouting at others that he shot someone after he runs from the scene, and then people give chase. Kid was a dumbass that made dumbass decisions. 

 

More half truths from you, they said "he shot someone, get him", that is when he ran.

Edited August 30, 2020 by wayno

[john510]

1 hour ago, BrothersGarage said:

Couldn't tell you, because it didn't happen.

But no they couldn't place him under citizens arrest. They could if he fled though. Various weapons the protesters were carrying with them? What are you even talking about? The plastic bag with junk in it that the first guy threw at him or the skateboard one person had? Be more sensational? 

Come on man,i know you've seen many of these videos that show the things these people carry.They aren't breaking windows with their fists.The guy missing his bicep had a gun,is that a weapon ? A skateboard isn't much but used just right could be pretty harmful.And then we have clubs,sticks,rocks,knives etc.I guess we do agree that those involved are/were stupid.My biggest question is who's responsible to put an end to all this ? There seems to be a lot of irrationality from those causing most of the damage.I don't even know what it is they want anymore.Maybe no police force ? Imagine what these people would do without any law enforcement.

[BrothersGarage]

17 minutes ago, wayno said:

More half truths from you, they said "he shot someone, get him", that is when he ran.

They sure did yell "he shot someone, get him" wayno, - as he was running down the street away from the scene of a shooting. What would you expect to happen with that many people around when someone shoots someone and runs away? The clip happens right as your video you shared starts - which occurs after the 2 videos I shared and the initial shooting.

Edited August 30, 2020 by BrothersGarage

[thisismatt]

I can't wait for this argument to be settled so we can send it over to the judge for consideration

[BrothersGarage]

16 minutes ago, john510 said:

Come on man,i know you've seen many of these videos that show the things these people carry.They aren't breaking windows with their fists.The guy missing his bicep had a gun,is that a weapon ? A skateboard isn't much but used just right could be pretty harmful.And then we have clubs,sticks,rocks,knives etc.I guess we do agree that those involved are/were stupid.My biggest question is who's responsible to put an end to all this ? There seems to be a lot of irrationality from those causing most of the damage.I don't even know what it is they want anymore.Maybe no police force ? Imagine what these people would do without any law enforcement.

People are using crap they find around. I've seen them use signs, bricks, tons of crap, but again. It's all hypothetical isn't it? None of that happened. Sure that dumbass felon medic had a gun, but it's not like he would have walked up and executed Kyle while he was standing at the scene of the first shooting either. Sure skateboards fucking hurt. Getting trucked fucked is a super serious thing, and if home came at Kyle - or anyone else while he remained at the first scene I would argue he was still acting in self defense - but he fled the scene and actively committed a crime. After already breaking curfew, and illegally possessing a firearm? I'm not going to give the kid the benefit of the doubt in this scenario when he shows the ability to make bad decision after bad decision. 

All of that said does NOT excuse the actions of the rioters. Every single one of the people that fucked up the community and set fires to shit should ALSO see charges. I hope the book is thrown at them. That said I know WHY that it is happening - it's because a bunch of hurt people don't feel they are being listened to so they are acting out in violence, and there are outside forces that want to stir that up and make it worse. 

That also said I understand why Kyle felt he had a responsibility - but how many big fuck-ups are you going to excuse for a kid that had shown he can't act responsibly? Does that mean he deserves the chair, or 80 years in prison? No. But he deserves the repercussions for his poor actions - whatever a judge or jury may convict him of. 

Edited August 30, 2020 by BrothersGarage

[Mattndew76]

3 minutes ago, BrothersGarage said:

They sure did wayno, as he was running down the street away from the scene of a shooting. What would you expect to happen with that many people around when someone shoots someone and runs away? 

 

He didn't run away!! McGinnis states that Kyle ran to the middle of the road as he (McGinnis) began first aid on Rosenbaum. He then states he heard shots.

 

The videos all show Kyle staying within Rosenbaum's vicinity until the audio of people calling out to "beat him up!!" or to "get him!!", and shots being fired at Kyle.

 

Kyle then tries to escape the mob of people trying to get him. 

 

 

[wayno]

10 minutes ago, BrothersGarage said:

They sure did wayno, as he was running down the street away from the scene of a shooting. What would you expect to happen with that many people around when someone shoots someone and runs away? 

 

That lawyers video said it was clear in the video that they said "get that guy" before Kyle ran.

You obviously have an agenda here as if you were not been spewing half truths at best none of us would be posting about this anymore.

[BrothersGarage]

7 minutes ago, Mattndew76 said:

 

He didn't run away!! McGinnis states that Kyle ran to the middle of the road as he (McGinnis) began first aid on Rosenbaum. He then states he heard shots.

 

The videos all show Kyle staying within Rosenbaum's vicinity until the audio of people calling out to "beat him up!!" or to "get him!!", and shots being fired at Kyle.

 

Kyle then tries to escape the mob of people trying to get him. 

 

 

 

He wasn't there for 20 seconds after the initial shooting, turns and RUNS while on the phone - straight at the guy filming. I can't hear any shots being fired, and the only thing I do hear is "Get that motherfucker" happens when Kyle runs. Followed by "get the fuck outta here". 

Again, I would like to see the statement if you have them please. 

Then the 2nd video picks up with people chasing him trying to detain / kick his ass. 
 

Edited August 30, 2020 by BrothersGarage

[Mattndew76]

READ  McGinnis's own account on the DA filing you posted dude.

 

The only thing your video shows is him doing exactly as McGinnis said he did!! Running to the middle of the road toward the hospital. That just on the back side of who was filming. 

 

Jesus its like i'm discussing things with a brick.

Edited August 30, 2020 by Mattndew76

[thisismatt]

http://www.antifa.com

 

lol

Edited August 30, 2020 by thisismatt

[BrothersGarage]

1 minute ago, wayno said:

 

That lawyers video said it was clear in the video that they said "get that guy" before Kyle ran.

You obviously have an agenda here as if you were not been spewing half truths at best none of us would be posting about this anymore.

Please point me to where that's said I would like to hear it. Would shed more light as to why he would have ran, but still doesn't mean he should have. 

But again - my agenda? I am literally posting links to the court documents and to videos of it happening - stuff that you're ignoring. 

[Mattndew76]

1 minute ago, BrothersGarage said:

Please point me to where that's said I would like to hear it. Would shed more light as to why he would have ran, but still doesn't mean he should have. 

But again - my agenda? I am literally posting links to the court documents and to videos of it happening - stuff that you're ignoring. 

 

documents you don't even critically read by the look of it.

[datzenmike]

At trial all you need is one juror that sees him as being attacked and defending himself. One juror who is a property owner and fed fucking up with this shit. One juror who sees the dead rapist and other felon and wounded as human garbage deserving of what they got. One juror who has seen antifa fucking shit up and someone willing to do something about it. One juror who is possibly a racist or just sick to death of BLM and their shit. One juror who is a trump supporter. One juror who is willing to disregard the judge when he tells them to ignore what they feel. One juror who....well the list is endless. They'll try to throw the book at him for chickenshit gun violations but even then all you need is one juror who.... 

[Mattndew76]

2 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

At trial all you need is one juror that sees him as being attacked and defending himself. One juror who is a property owner and fed fucking up with this shit. One juror who sees the dead rapist and other felon and wounded as human garbage deserving of what they got. One juror who has seen antifa fucking shit up and someone willing to do something about it. One juror who is possibly a racist or just sick to death of BLM and their shit. One juror who is a trump supporter. One juror who is willing to disregard the judge when he tells them to ignore what they feel. One juror who....well the list is endless. They'll try to throw the book at him for chickenshit gun violations but even then all you need is one juror who.... 

 

Kyle walks. BLM idiots get what was handed to them. 

[wayno]

On 8/28/2020 at 11:24 PM, Mattndew76 said:

 

 

Watch the video link above.

7 minutes ago, BrothersGarage said:

Please point me to where that's said I would like to hear it. Would shed more light as to why he would have ran, but still doesn't mean he should have. 

But again - my agenda? I am literally posting links to the court documents and to videos of it happening - stuff that you're ignoring. 

 

[datzenmike]

2 minutes ago, Mattndew76 said:

 

Kyle walks. BLM idiots get what was handed to them. 

 

Well he may limp for a few months but probably can recuperate at home with no time in hospital.

[BrothersGarage]

4 minutes ago, Mattndew76 said:

documents you don't even critically read by the look of it.

Again, please point it,, because that's not what the document says 
 

Quote

McGinnis stated that after the defendant shot he ran back towards the hospital towards the middle
of the road. McGinnis stayed and turned his attention to Rosenbaum. McGinnis stated that he then
heard other shots really soon after.

The third video that your complainant reviewed shows the defendant running northbound on
Sheridan Road after he had shot Rosenbaum. The street and the sidewalk are full of people. A
group of several people begin running northbound on Sheridan Road behind the defendant. A
person can be heard yelling what sounds like, “Beat him up!” Another person can be heard yelling
what sounds like, “Hey, he shot him!” Your complainant reviewed a fourth video that showed a
different angle of the defendant running northbound. In this video a person can be heard yelling,
“Get him! Get that dude!” Then a male in a light-colored top runs towards the defendant and

So Again, Kyle flees the scene 20 seconds after shooting him, people go after him, apparently there were some shots really soon after, and then the 3rd video picks up where someone swings at him, he runs and trips, the guy does the flying kick at him, skaterboard comes in and takes one to the chest, and the felon medic takes on to the arm for pulling a pistol.

What the fuck am I pushing as my agenda?

[thisismatt]

20 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

At trial all you need is one juror that sees him as being attacked and defending himself. One juror who is a property owner and fed fucking up with this shit. One juror who sees the dead rapist and other felon and wounded as human garbage deserving of what they got. One juror who has seen antifa fucking shit up and someone willing to do something about it. One juror who is possibly a racist or just sick to death of BLM and their shit. One juror who is a trump supporter. One juror who is willing to disregard the judge when he tells them to ignore what they feel. One juror who....well the list is endless. They'll try to throw the book at him for chickenshit gun violations but even then all you need is one juror who.... 

That's only 7 jurors. You need 12

[datzenmike]

I said the list (jury pool) is endless.....