720 z24 engine replacement and timing help needed

[Ab1997]

I am new to the forum but we have started a big project on a 1983 Nissan 720 with a z24 engine. We recently ordered a crate engine to replace the worn out one we had, we are not mechanically inclined enough for a full rebuild and thought we could handle the rest to a crate engine. So far we have had no real issues. My main question is timing and if I should be checking anything prior to installing the distributor? The oil pump and didrributer tube was already installed, and my old crank pully does not have a timing mark that I have been able to locate .... I haven't set timing on a vehicle like this in 20 years but have researched and got my mind remembering somewhat what to do. Do I need to pull the oil pump or can I just find top dead center and drop the distributer in? Or am I so far off its not funny? Any help is appreciated

[datzenmike]

 

Look for the timing scale on the alternator side. Turn the crank slowly looking for the TDC notch on the pulley edge near it.

 

Look in the hole for the distributor and it should look like this...

 

 

Note that there is a small and large side half moon. Make sure the small side is on the left or to the front of the vehicle.

 

There are two TDCs so if it doesn't look like this turn ONE full turn clockwise and see if this is what you see. Should be at about 11:25. If it is, install the distributor.

[bottomwatcher]

That little blade sticking up is slightly offset and the distributor can only go on one way. Just wanted to point that out. Not obvious in the photo. Ha just saw the small side in print. Anyways that's what it means 

Edited April 24, 2020 by bottomwatcher
Mistake

[Ab1997]

Thanks to you both.  I apologize for being so ignorant. I think I found the "notch", what number on the scale am I setting it to.Or should it be obvious? I will attach a couple pics if I can figure out how. But I believe I have it!

[datzenmike]

Ignorance can be fixed.

[datzenmike]

The notch is the TDC position. If you place the notch at the ZERO on the scale, then the engine is at TDC. Mark the notch and use a timing light and adjust so the notch is at 5 ⁰ on the scale. Ignition timing is now 5⁰ before the TDC position.

[Stinky]

Set it at TDC...pull your valve cover off.  The rocker arms on the #1 cylinder show have a tiny bit of play in them and everything above applies.

 

If #4 rockers have play in them...your cam is 180 degrees out.  If that is the case, turn your crank 1 turn and...you have work ahead of you, because everything that they have told you to look for will be in the wrong sequence.

 

It should be TDC on #1.  It will take you about 5 minutes to verify it.  If you put it in 180 out...it will take hours to fix it.  You are probably OK, but it is a lot easier to check it now....and again, it will only take 5 minutes.  Although, if it is 180 out, you could just move your plug wires, but the motor would be installed wrong.

[Ab1997]

Ok, got it and thanks. I checked the number one cylinder by inserting an extension bar to make sure it was tdc and the timing mark is on zero. Also did the placing my finger over the pug hold to make sure it was on the compression stroke. Once we get the engine installed will time it to 5 degrees. I will still check the play in #1 just to make sure... Thanks and I will let you know how it goes! I feel much more confident now it isn't wrong. 

 

Last thing, on much of the research I have done everyone says make sure the rotor Is pointing to number 1 cylinder, but on my rotor button it doesn't look like the ones I have seen in the past, this one is just a plastic rotor with no metal piece that I would usually point, what is the front of the rotor?

 

Thanks again

[datzenmike]

The rotor is round and there are two contacts through the cap (for two coil wires) and two contacts to direct the spark to the wires. The 'rotor' for the intake plugs is on the under side (bottom right below) the exhaust rotor is on top (upper right) At ot neaar TDV the intake rotor will be pointing to 9 o'clock or forward to the rad and the exhaust rotor to 4 o'clock, as viewed from the driver's side fender.

 

 

 

The intake contacts on the distributor cap are farther out from the center than the exhaust.

 

 

[Charlie69]

22 hours ago, datzenmike said:

Ignorance can be fixed.

Not always!  LOL

[Stinky]

The cap may be marked w/the plug wire numbers that should connect at that spot....a stock one is.  At least mine is.  And, the wires are not 180 apart.  The 2nd plug is 10 degrees later.

[datzenmike]

 

 

Ahhh you see you must remember that the #1 intake (1I) rotor is at 9 o'clock or to the left and towards the rad (above picture) while the exhaust (1E) is around 4 o'clock. They both fire together and the rotor turns counter clockwise 90⁰ to get into position to fire cylinder #3. That would place the intake(3I) rotor at the 6 o'clock position and the exhaust (3E) at the 2 o'clock as in the picture above, then rotate 90⁰ for #4 plugs. Intake (4I) @ 3 o'clock and exhaust (4E) @ 10 o'clock, rotate 90⁰ for the final #2 plugs. Intake (2I) @ 12 o'clock and exhaust (2E) @ 8 o'clock..... done.

[jagman]

Mike, I have been following this thread to see if it applies to my problem.  On my distributor the intake ignition is coming from the inner ring of the dizzy and number one plug wire is at the 9:00 o:clock position to the front.  Do you think I may be out 180?

Steve 

[datzenmike]

 

Yes, the intake coil fires the inner circle of plug wires all marked I for intake. The exhaust coil fires all the ones marked E. My thumbs are on the intake1 on the left and  exhaust side 1 on the right. If the coil wires are reversed you can just move them on the cap, or not... both fire together so it doesn't matter at all..

 

Above the inner rotor points to 9 and the outer (exhaust) should be about 4.

[Ab1997]

Ok, I have the engine back in and tried to fire it up. But now i can't get the truck to fire up. Grrr. Previous to replacing the old engine with the new it would crank and run. So I assume that everything was working as in coils etc. Now it appears no spark at all. Getting gas to carb. Any ideas. I have checked and rechecked that everything is connected. Could when I transfered the dizzy I did something wrong causing this? Timing? Thanks for any help

[Ab1997]

Also, where is the camshaft position sensor located? Or is there even one?thanks again for the helo

[datzenmike]

Pull a coil wire off the distributor and hold near a grounded surface. Have someone try to start the engine. Got spark???

 

 

[Ab1997]

Yes, we did that and no spark. I don't believe it's coils or anything with the distributer as I direct swapped everything from the engine that was running but was on it's last leg. Most of the parts were new and the engine was running. Moved everything to the new engine and no spark. I think is prob something stupid I am missing. I read back about grounding the dizzy. I don't see where I would do that, do you have any pictures of the grounding for this? I may have missed a wire somewhere. Thanks as always. 

[datzenmike]

Normally it grounds through the mounting bolts but some have a dedicated wire.

 

Get a volt meter and check for 12v on the positive coil terminals. You also need 12v on the module (I think the red wire under the rotor) the other two go to the coil negative terminals. No 12v to the proper wire on the module... no worky.

[Ab1997]

Ok. There is 12 v to the coil but not at the distributer. 

[datzenmike]

Well check all 3? wires one should have 12v.

 

 

 

 

I have an '84 FSM and there should be a Brown wire that goes to the intake coil + and also to the terminal block that the distributor connects to. I don't have the color code for the distributor end but I think to the middle or B terminal on the module under the rotor. B should have 12v. The terminals on either side are to the coil negative terminals.

[Ab1997]

Just had time to get back on this. So, no there is no power to any of the wires on the distributer. 

[Rat-a-tat-Dat]

Did you check for a blown fuse?

[datzenmike]

There should be +12v on both the coil + terminals, Is there?

[Ab1997]

There is power to the distributor on 1 of the wires. Sorry for the misstatement earlier