620KC on 720 bare frame build

[Lockleaf]

I too have failed to find any gaskets for some old sunroofs and have looked at other options for one of my builds.

I am a fan of the roof cut, in spite of the possible warpage issues.  Cut a large piece of roof at the junkyard, but once home you may only need to use the center section but at least you have everything you need.  That leading curve on the tiburon roof may not be an issue if you are only using a couple of inches of sheetmetal in front of the sunroof.

Also, on youtube there is a channel called Fitzees Fabrications.  He is currently do a bunch of body work on a 620 cab.  He builds floor pans and body mounts for it, but he only uses really basic tools.  Mig, hammer, vice, grinder, etc.  Nothing special.  His work quality is amazing though.  I would suggest looking him up.  His other body videos might provide you with further tips that would make the body work you have to do less aggravating.

 

 

 

Edited March 12, 2021 by Lockleaf
added links for convenience

[EDM620]

4 hours ago, Lockleaf said:

other options for one of my builds.

I haven't given up yet and am exploring a few potential alternative methods. Top 2 candidates for a replacement seal presently are:

1) to use a rubber cord and trim to length + bond into the frame. Potential issue is round cord into square channel with risk of leakage. The cord will flow around the corner curve without buckling, so that holds some promise.

2) is to use a pour-in-place material (Vytaflex polyurethane rubber) but the UV stability isn't fully established yet in my conversations. Maybe not a concern if it will suffice for several years as it could be re-made.

 

Neither of these methods will be expensive, so I may spring for both and see how they work. This way I can screw one up and still have a possible solution!

 

I would really like to retain the sunroof and the KC has enough roof to make this work. I have been in touch with Webasto (Hollandia series of sunroofs) but they left the aftermarket business about a year ago - timing is poor - but I'm working with some people hoping to find a dealer that might have some old stock they'd love to get rid of. There are apparently 2 big sunroof dealers in CA who Webasto says moved enough inventory that chances are good. There are also 2 dealers in Spokane that are a maybe, I need to get in touch with and ask.

 

One other diminishing possibility is the roof cut from a 2011 vintage Chevy Malibu, unfortunately there isn't one anywhere near me with the sunroof option for me to even scope out for size, roof curvature, etc.

 

I have already asked Fitzee his opinion on this, he recommends going as large as possible with the patch panel. If he wasn't across the country from me, I'd go see him!

[EDM620]

Rust never sleeps, seems like the more I resolve the more I find, at least I continue to make progress.

Missed this somehow

Right side rocker and floor area is completed to within compliance by my body guy, so now I can focus on completing the Left side.

 

New metal is rough cut to size and ready for bending, then to fit up and weld in.

I intend to get the rocker completed within the next week as I need to get the chassis out of storage and start fitting the cab up.

 

With spring around the corner (was freakin cold here yesterday  -17C/1F) I know that yardwork will be demanding of my available time.

[EDM620]

Seats are fully mounted up (removed since for continued bodywork) and working 100%. These should be pretty comfortable for long trips.

 

On initial assessment, I'm thinking that I might have a minor alignment issue with the 720 steering column, but I'll burn that err I mean cross that bridge when I get there.

 

BTW, I have found my sunroof solution, will share that part soon as I get around to it.

[yenpit]

Did you see that www.kfvintagejdm.com is making 620 King Cab lower cab corners?  Not much else yet, but he acquired an NOS B pillar for the KC, so he was able to 3D scan & make them.  He will be making more 620 panels, but Z car & 510 have been his priority!  Project is looking great! 😎

[EDM620]

On 3/31/2021 at 4:35 PM, yenpit said:

www.kfvintagejdm.com is making 620 King Cab lower cab corners

Thanks for the kind words and for the lead on the panels. I've contacted them as I will be needing all 4 box lowers.

Weekend is rapidly getting eaten up with other tasks so not sure how much I will get done, slipping behind on my schedule though...

[datsunfreak]

On 7/16/2020 at 8:55 AM, EDM620 said:

DUH moment happened, seems that I forgot during the engine teardown that this dizzy cap screw had twisted the head off, and now it really doesn't want to come out.

 

I've soaked it with penetrating oil and even with some vise-grips on the shaft it won't budge. I'm thinking I'll have to try to drill it out from the underside as there is I think just enough recess for the bit to center correctly. Not sure if I should try heating the dizzy body as I don't want to risk any warping.

 

FWIW, you can simply and add lightness by switching to an L20b distributor? Then just use 4 plugs. 

Edited April 16, 2021 by datsunfreak

[datsunfreak]

 

 

On 10/8/2020 at 6:07 PM, klam07 said:

edit: Im now wondering, since many have used these VW rads successfully yet they were intended for a ~1.6/1.8L engine.. if an aluminum half-rad for a Honda would work after all (1.6-1.8L as well). They're compact, no plastic tanks, and can be found with 2-3 rows for pretty inexpensive. Outlets are also 32mm and right-side biased. Not to mention have a fill point, but no temp sensor provision.
Still debating between these two options after all, lol

 

This radiator may have been designed for a 1.6L/1.8L Volkswagen, but the VR6 version is basically identical, only 4" wider. Both of those will cool any L/Z/KA just fine. If it works in Texas, it'll damn sure work in Canada.  😁

 

The Honda ones are a bit too small, I think? A Honda engine is a lot more thermally efficient than an L/Z. The aftermarket all aluminum Honda radiators work great on an A14/A15, and are thicker core than a stock Honda radiator. One of those may be worth a try?

 

Also, another thing I didn't see mentioned is if you use a Scirocco (or early Rabbit) radiator, they have an integrated fill cap.  👍

 

Early Scirocco versus later VR6 for comparison...

 

 

Edited April 16, 2021 by datsunfreak

[klam07]

1 hour ago, datsunfreak said:

This radiator may have been designed for a 1.6L/1.8L Volkswagen, but the VR6 version is basically identical, only 4" wider. Both of those will cool any L/Z/KA just fine. If it works in Texas, it'll damn sure work in Canada.  😁

 

The Honda ones are a bit too small, I think? A Honda engine is a lot more thermally efficient than an L/Z. The aftermarket all aluminum Honda radiators work great on an A14/A15, and are thicker core than a stock Honda radiator. One of those may be worth a try?

 

Also, another thing I didn't see mentioned is if you use a Scirocco (or early Rabbit) radiator, they have an integrated fill cap.  👍

 

Early Scirocco versus later VR6 for comparison...

 

So the VR6 is just a larger version of the previously mentioned VW rad, and the scirocco's had the fill cap? I'm having difficulties finding any with the fill cap on rockauto.

 

I've heard that Hondas were better with cooling and therefore got away with smaller rads, but my thinking was that a 2 or 3-core aluminum might 'double' the cooling potential and work for a 2.4.. but I have no science to back this up. They're just cheap, easy to source and quite small - the 'half-rads' that is.

But if an OE VW rad works for a KA in Texas, then I'm sold!

[datzenmike]

There are in line fill caps.

 

[datsunfreak]

23 hours ago, klam07 said:

So the VR6 is just a larger version of the previously mentioned VW rad, and the scirocco's had the fill cap? I'm having difficulties finding any with the fill cap on rockauto.

 

They've been a little tough to find the last few years. Several companies do make an all aluminum version?

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/3-ROW-Aluminum-Radiator-For-VW-GOLF-MK1-Jetta-SCIROCCO-GTI-SPEC-1-6-1975-1981-MT/264086184778?fits=Model%3AScirocco&hash=item3d7cc3634a:g:ACsAAOSw7z1ezxj~

 

On 4/16/2021 at 4:09 PM, klam07 said:

I've heard that Hondas were better with cooling and therefore got away with smaller rads, but my thinking was that a 2 or 3-core aluminum might 'double' the cooling potential and work for a 2.4.. but I have no science to back this up. They're just cheap, easy to source and quite small - the 'half-rads' that is.

 

FWIW, we used one of the aftermarket all aluminum Honda radiators on an A15-powered track car and it cooled just fine. In fact, we ended up going up to a 192F thermostat because it always ran too cold. It may be worth a shot?

[EDM620]

On 3/31/2021 at 4:35 PM, yenpit said:

www.kfvintagejdm.com is making 620 King Cab lower cab corners

I reached out seeing as he has a box lower panel, but presently just the one, I'll be looking for all 4.

[EDM620]

On 4/16/2021 at 1:14 PM, datsunfreak said:

FWIW, you can simply and add lightness by switching to an L20b distributor? Then just use 4 plugs.

I'll be sticking with the dual plugs, as I fully ported the head and am optimistic of future turbo - the dual plugs at least on paper should squeeze even more power out.

Worst case is engine swap...

 

The Honda rads I suspected of inadequate cooling based on displacement OEM tasked with and real estate of cooling area. I'll be shrouding the fans and those will be on electric thermostats to optimize cooling as demands require. I have a small recovery tank that provides me with the fill, and once everything is in if needs demand + space is available, I can upsize.

 

Thanks for the suggestions - Sadly this engine isn't going to be churning out amazing power, but should breathe well for a normally aspirated basic mill, maybe 10-15% over stock. Not worth the cost to dyno it.

[datsunfreak]

On 4/17/2021 at 11:46 PM, EDM620 said:

the dual plugs at least on paper should squeeze even more power out.

 

Unfortunately, they are designed for emission reduction purposes, not increased power. You'd need to figure out how to make them fire at the same time as each other to see any power benefit from it.  👍

[EDM620]

On 4/19/2021 at 5:56 AM, datsunfreak said:

not increased power

that's based on theory anyway, longer range plan is to swap in something more powerful anyhow - my target is to have about 300 HP on tap. And NO to an LS swap,  I'd go with many other choices before Bow-Tie, it's a thing with me.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

Are you guys sure that radiator cap is a pressure relief cap? I thought Europeans used header tanks with a separate pressure relief cap on the tank, and a simple fill cap on the radiator.

 

 

[datsunfreak]

4 hours ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Are you guys sure that radiator cap is a pressure relief cap? I thought Europeans used header tanks with a separate pressure relief cap on the tank, and a simple fill cap on the radiator.

 

 

 

If you mean the Scirocco radiator, yes it is. There are grooves in the cap that allowing venting around the threads.

 

However, because of that, the Scirocco cap is not track legal because it dumps coolant on the ground. For a track legal set-up, you need the Vanagon cap.

 

[datsunfreak]

On 4/23/2021 at 11:50 PM, EDM620 said:

that's based on theory anyway, longer range plan is to swap in something more powerful anyhow - my target is to have about 300 HP on tap. And NO to an LS swap,  I'd go with many other choices before Bow-Tie, it's a thing with me.

 

A Ford 302 is smaller and lighter, so...   😁

[datzenmike]

Distributor is at the front, a big plus.

[EDM620]

3 hours ago, datsunfreak said:

 

A Ford 302 is smaller and lighter, so...   😁

I would be more inclined that way, time and whatever drops in my lap will tell 😁

[EDM620]

8 hours ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

Are you guys sure that radiator cap is a pressure relief cap? I thought Europeans used header tanks with a separate pressure relief cap on the tank, and a simple fill cap on the radiator.

 

 

The cap/fill solution I have takes that into account.

And because if it's smaller size I will have more options on positioning.

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

On 4/23/2021 at 9:50 PM, EDM620 said:

that's based on theory anyway, longer range plan is to swap in something more powerful anyhow - my target is to have about 300 HP on tap. And NO to an LS swap,  I'd go with many other choices before Bow-Tie, it's a thing with me.

I'm with you. While the LS is perfect for many swaps, the cool factor is different. My '57 Willys wagon is not getting an LS. It's going to have early Hemi power.

[datsunfreak]

20 hours ago, EDM620 said:

I would be more inclined that way, time and whatever drops in my lap will tell 😁

 

Also, to pile on, if you want a manual trans then the LS gets a lot more expensive. Ford 5 speeds are much cheaper (and easier to find) than Chevy 5 speeds.

[EDM620]

10 hours ago, Stoffregen Motorsports said:

I'm with you. While the LS is perfect for many swaps, the cool factor is different. My '57 Willys wagon is not getting an LS. It's going to have early Hemi power.

Then you'll definitely appreciate this

[Stoffregen Motorsports]

There are plenty of 5 speed options for the LS. It's just that they all cost about $5000. You can get adapters for many other 5 speeds, but none of them are very good options. The early Hemi is adaptable to a Toyota 5 speed, and they only make about 250hp, so that's the trans I will use in the Willys.