Project Redemption - 1964 Datsun 312 Bluebird

[twistedimages]

So... I went and did a thing.

 

A thing I tell everyone NOT to do.  A thing I've done several times before, yet here I go again.  I brought another project car home when I already have plenty here to work on!

But when a car calls out to you, it would be heartless to ignore that call, right?  Right?

 

There I was, minding my business, hanging out with my wife on the couch and cruising through Instagram, when a message pops up.  A friend had sent a Facebook Marketplace listing for a rusted old Datsun, and it was actually close to where I live!  Ever since I moved to Oklahoma last year I've been going through Datsun withdrawals- aside from a couple of Zs at shows I haven't seen a whole lot out here.

 

I tried to stay strong, but the more I looked at those pictures in the listing the more intrigued I became.  I tried to put those old familiar feelings aside- I really did! 

"I know- I'll show my wife this listing.  She'll shut the whole idea down in a heartbeat and I can go back to my normal life," I thought.  

So imagine my surprise when she said, "That's really cute- you should buy that!" - what an enabler!  I messaged the seller, drove out with my wife the next day to check it out, and now I've got another project on my hands!

 

Here are the original pictures from the listing:

 

 

 

 

 

 

The seller, Ray, bought this car from his sister in law when he moved from Indiana down to Oklahoma in 1976.  Once he got down here, he drove the car for a couple of months, until it needed a valve adjustment.  Apparently he adjusted things a bit too tightly and damaged the cam, so he pulled the cam out to replace it.  But he couldn't find a replacement, and the car sat exactly where it was from 1976 until 2020!

 

Here are the pictures I took when we drove up to look at it for the first time:

 

This is Ray, the fella that sold the car to us.


And this is my wife Victoria, checking out the only door I was able to get open!

 

 

 

 

Here's the grille that he kept inside the car- check out that badge!

 

In my next post I'll show you what we've done so far, and outline my plans for this little 'Bird!

 

[twistedimages]

A few days after Victoria and I drove up and left a deposit with Ray, I headed back up with a buddy with my truck and trailer to dig this car out of the ground.  Based on the rust in the rockers and floors I was worried that there wasn't going to be much left underneath, but I brought shovels and my trailer has a winch so I was hopeful I wouldn't leave empty handed.

 

After some maneuvering through his property we got the trailer lined up, and thankfully the ground was soft enough that I was able to dig around the front end enough to get a couple of straps around the front frame horns.  30 or so minutes later and the deal was done- I was the proud owner of a 1964 Datsun 312!

 

 

We headed from Ray's house to a nearby gas station, and while I filled the truck's tanks I started taking actual inventory of the car.

 

 

The floors and rocker panels are toast of course, but the frame is actually really solid- it seems the dirt/mud preserved it rather than rotting it out.  The trunk floor is even completely intact- at least from the outside!  The main draw with this car, though, is how original and complete it is.  So far I think the only missing part is one hubcap- all of the trim, every light and lens, and all of the interior parts are there- they all need a lot of love, but at least I won't have to hunt down a bunch of rare pieces!

 

We dragged the car home, and I shuffled the other cars around to make room for the car and trailer inside my shop.

 

 

I HAD to put the grille back where it belongs, just to see what the car looks like with a proper face!

I also started working on getting the doors open- with the car stuck on the trailer I couldn't do much, but I was able to get everything but the driver door and trunk.

 

I found a new set of whitewalls online and got to work pulling the wheels off.

 

I used heat and PB blast, but a few studs decided to play dirty anyway.  I'll be going through all of the brakes and suspension anyway, so as long as I had two working studs per wheel I was OK.

 

The passenger front wheel wouldn't turn, so I pulled the whole hub apart and cleared it of mud, dirt, spiders, and the brake hardware.  The bearings on both front wheels stayed sealed through the years, so once I got all of the debris cleared out it's rolling nice and smoothly for now.

The rears are still being a bit stubborn, and I wasn't able to get the drums off of the axles, but they rolled well enough to get the car off the trailer once I get some tires on those wheels...

 

Yeah, these old tires aren't going to get me anywhere!

 

I started putting my only other set of 4x114.3 wheels on the car, but the rears wouldn't quite clear the leaf springs... so you'll just have to settle for this glamour shot of the front!

 

I don't think 17s really suit the car anyway haha

 

Tires came in a couple days later, so I ran down and got them mounted with some new valve stems.  I think I'm going to refinish the wheels in an off-white color, but for now I just need round things that hold air.

 

Wheels bolted back up to the car, and I pulled the trailer back out front so I could sweep up all of the dirt that fell out while I was beating on those hubs

 

Ramps down, winch out, and the car was in the shop on all four wheels!

 

I was able to get the driver door open, and I got inside to get more work done.

 

First, I pushed up on the roof to undo the "goat damage" from sitting in that field:

 

Then I pulled the driver door panel off to get the lock cylinder out- it's off at the locksmith so I can finally get into the trunk!

 

 

So far things are coming apart smoothly with a bit of penetrating oil on the more stubborn parts.  I don't have high hopes for this engine, though!

 

So that's where we're at as of today.  I REALLY need to set this one aside for a bit to wrap up a couple of other projects, but I'll sneak over and throw some time at this one as I can.

 

Gonna call her "Redemption" - the plan is to keep this one mostly stock mechanically and cosmetically.  Maybe a mild drop, but maybe not even that.  Repair the rust and body damage, keep the patina, get everything working, and enjoy a rare little piece of Datsun history.  Hopefully this will be my redemption for basically doing the exact opposite with my 510!

[twistedimages]

510 and 312 sitting side by side in the shop- identical cousins!

 

[wayno]

You certainly have yourself a project.

 

Whats ya going to do about the engine?

 

Be careful bending that grill badge back into position as it is slightly bent.

 

 

[twistedimages]

2 minutes ago, wayno said:

You certainly have yourself a project.

 

Whats ya going to do about the engine?

 

Be careful bending that grill badge back into position as it is slightly bent.

 

 

I really want to keep the column shift manual, so it looks like I'll be hunting down some form of J-series motor since they're a bit more available than this E1 that's in here.  My research shows they went up to a J18 in Mexico and I've seen a couple for sale, so maybe that will be the way to go.  

Thank you for pointing out the bend in that badge- I may just leave it rather than take a chance on breaking it!

[wayno]

As far as I know the J13/15 will bolt into a 320, but some J series engines have different engine motor mount mount points, so before you buy make sure it will except your mounts, I have seen/heard of things going sideways in the past, I cannot tell how your engine mounts into the frame, I have never seen the engine compartment in a 312.

 

I put a A15/5spd into a 1965 Datsun 320 in the past, it was a lot of work for someone that had never done anything like that before, it was fun to drive.

The shift pattern on the column shift 4spd is interesting.

[twistedimages]

2 minutes ago, wayno said:

As far as I know the J13/15 will bolt into a 320, but some J series engines have different engine motor mount mount points, so before you buy make sure it will except your mounts, I have seen/heard of things going sideways in the past, I cannot tell how your engine mounts into the frame, I have never seen the engine compartment in a 312.

 

I put a A15/5spd into a 1965 Datsun 320 in the past, it was a lot of work for someone that had never done anything like that before, it was fun to drive.

The shift pattern on the column shift 4spd is interesting.

 

While I'm not afraid to fabricate new mounts (and may have to, if I can't find stock originals), I'd like to avoid any frame-side modifications to keep this as original as possible.  I'm going to start with suspension and brakes before I worry about the engine- If I can't find brake hardware, bushings, etc. I may have to ditch my original plans and swap modern components in.  I never realized how spoiled I was working on 510s and trucks before this- information is hard to come by!  But it's exciting starting back at square one on a car.

 

[wayno]

Mike Klotz used to make a disc brake bracket that allowed the use of 1985 Nissan 720 vented rotor disc brakes on the 320, but he sold everything he had and said he was going to stop making them, well recently I heard he may start making some parts again.

Personally I would deal with the sheet metal first myself, there is a lot of work there, it might give Mike enough time to decide if he wants to make more brackets, as his stuff is the best stuff out there in my opinion.

[wayno]

By the way, it is likely that you can use more modern brake components that will bolt right in except for brake lines, the 620 stuff will work except the brake lines are metric while everything before is SAE, 521 brakes should work on your 312 and they are SAE.

[twistedimages]

55 minutes ago, wayno said:

By the way, it is likely that you can use more modern brake components that will bolt right in except for brake lines, the 620 stuff will work except the brake lines are metric while everything before is SAE, 521 brakes should work on your 312 and they are SAE.

 

I'm planning to keep this 4 lug, so none of the truck stuff will work for me.  I have a few ideas, but I'll know for sure what works once I dig in.

 

Sheetmetal will probably wait until I get the chassis dialed- I may just pull the body off and work on both at the same time though.

[wayno]

I forgot about that being 4 lug, but he also did a lot of tinkering with Roadster/411 stuff also.

 

Again I believe the 521 brake stuff is likely the same, Nissan/Datsun used a lot of the same stuff back in the 60s on all models, and the 620 stuff is the same also except for it is metric, and even the SAE bleeder housings can be bolted onto a 620 brake cylinder as long as you use the Metric banjo type bolt to hold the SAE bleeder housing on the new brake cylinder.

[twistedimages]

4 minutes ago, wayno said:

I forgot about that being 4 lug, but he also did a lot of tinkering with Roadster/411 stuff also.

 

Again I believe the 521 brake stuff is likely the same, Nissan/Datsun used a lot of the same stuff back in the 60s on all models, and the 620 stuff is the same also except for it is metric, and even the SAE bleeder housings can be bolted onto a 620 brake cylinder as long as you use the Metric banjo type bolt to hold the SAE bleeder housing on the new brake cylinder.

That's good information- thank you!

[mklotz70]

Thank Wayne!
Yes, I'm making stuff again....for now.  Yes, I've done some 4 lug stuff for the 311 and 411.....but I've never been able to find anything that will work behind 13" rims.  14" is the smallest I've been able to make work.  Some of datsun's really old car stuff had 6 lugs and king pins.  The kingpins look like they would allow truck spindles to be swapped in.  I have no clue at this point if your 312 has joints or pins.  Post up some pics of the front end when you get that far.  As Wayne was saying.....some of the later stuff might be able to swap in.....so if you need or want to keep the drums, you may be able to bolt on backing plates and hardware from something slightly newer like a 411. If so, at least there will be more donor parts available even if you can't get new.  BUT.....I think OTT's Friction in Portland will still reline brake shoes and might even have the rubber to rebuild the cylinders.  I'm sure almost any m/c will work.  Anyway.....Nice project!

 

[wayno]

I am not sure if  OTT's Friction exists anymore, I went there and left thinking that was too bad.

[mklotz70]

Hmmm....you might be right....it's been years since I've even driven past that area.  

 

.....dangit....I just googled them and they're closed permanently. 😞

[twistedimages]

11 hours ago, mklotz70 said:

Thank Wayne!
Yes, I'm making stuff again....for now.  Yes, I've done some 4 lug stuff for the 311 and 411.....but I've never been able to find anything that will work behind 13" rims.  14" is the smallest I've been able to make work.  Some of datsun's really old car stuff had 6 lugs and king pins.  The kingpins look like they would allow truck spindles to be swapped in.  I have no clue at this point if your 312 has joints or pins.  Post up some pics of the front end when you get that far.  As Wayne was saying.....some of the later stuff might be able to swap in.....so if you need or want to keep the drums, you may be able to bolt on backing plates and hardware from something slightly newer like a 411. If so, at least there will be more donor parts available even if you can't get new.  BUT.....I think OTT's Friction in Portland will still reline brake shoes and might even have the rubber to rebuild the cylinders.  I'm sure almost any m/c will work.  Anyway.....Nice project!

 

This one has ball joints, which is nice.  I definitely want to keep the 13" wheels on there, so repairing the factory drums is preferable to making a disc brake conversion.  I don't mind swapping the rear axle for a newer one if it makes that end of the brake equation easier- I imagine a later 1200 axle would be similar in width and easy enough to fit in there, but I'll have to look into it more as I get there.

 

There is a 411 parts car in Arkansas that I may go pick up- it's been sitting for years too, but if the engine turns it would make for a nice easy upgrade, and maybe the brake stuff would be usable too.

[mklotz70]

If it's a SSS 411, the motor might not work for you since it will have the roadster motor in it.....but....it will have factory disc brakes that may fit behind 13" rims.  Part of the reason I've never found a disc option that fits 13" rims is because I've never looked at solid rotors.  It seems like a waste to not at least use vented rotors......but a solid rotor that fits 13" rims would still be a big upgrade for you 312.  I doubt you're going to be bombing down the highway much with it, so drums ought to be adequate. :)

 

[wayno]

Interesting, it has a ball joint front end, I just assumed it had king pins.

 

[twistedimages]

6 hours ago, mklotz70 said:

If it's a SSS 411, the motor might not work for you since it will have the roadster motor in it.....but....it will have factory disc brakes that may fit behind 13" rims.  Part of the reason I've never found a disc option that fits 13" rims is because I've never looked at solid rotors.  It seems like a waste to not at least use vented rotors......but a solid rotor that fits 13" rims would still be a big upgrade for you 312.  I doubt you're going to be bombing down the highway much with it, so drums ought to be adequate. :)

 

That was my thought as well.  I also heard that those little discs are the same as stock 510 parts, which would mean that replacement parts actually exist- a big plus in my book.

But that car in Arkansas isn't an SSS, so although I may still go look at it the probability is that I'd only want to use the engine.  Maybe the rear axle if it's in better condition than mine.

Still plenty of other projects to reassemble before I properly dig into this one, but I'm collecting as much knowledge as possible for now!

[]2eDeYe]

If it is a lot like the 411 and has a H series rear axle, you should be able to use 510 pads in the rear. Might even be the same for the front? 

[mrbigtanker]

Where is my motocompo ? Looking good, how is the red state treating you. Guns with big magazines.

[wayno]

If your interested.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/DATSUN-320-312-Bluebird-Front-Grille-EMBLEM-Badge-GENUINE-NOS-JAPAN-RARE/252696150218?hash=item3ad5dd40ca:g:L3cAAOxyoExSB6FN

[Marts310blbrd]

@twistedimages I've got one of these cars and live in the pacific northwest. I've owned my Bluebird 45 years! It is an older version '60/'61 1200 Bluebird PL310. A massive project regards rust repair that I've been doing for the last couple of years. Tons of metal work. My left side floorpan and rocker (posts, sill inner and outer) repairs are complete and I'm now working on the right side. No new or reproduction sheet metal repair panels are available of course and it's been a somewhat time consuming and skill building job to make everything from flat sheet stock. I've reused almost nothing of the original metal - too badly rotted and gone. When you get around to working your PL312 rust repairs send me a message if you have any detail questions about the task specific to the Bluebird construction (or deconstruction). I started posting a project build thread on the old school NZ site to describe my PL310 if you're interested.

PL310 Bluebird build on old school NZ:

https://oldschool.co.nz/index.php?/topic/60267-marts-pl310-61-datsun-bluebird-sedan/

[Eric]

7 hours ago, Marts310blbrd said:

@twistedimages I've got one of these cars and live in the pacific northwest. I've owned my Bluebird 45 years! It is an older version '60/'61 1200 Bluebird PL310. A massive project regards rust repair that I've been doing for the last couple of years. Tons of metal work. My left side floorpan and rocker (posts, sill inner and outer) repairs are complete and I'm now working on the right side. No new or reproduction sheet metal repair panels are available of course and it's been a somewhat time consuming and skill building job to make everything from flat sheet stock. I've reused almost nothing of the original metal - too badly rotted and gone. When you get around to working your PL312 rust repairs send me a message if you have any detail questions about the task specific to the Bluebird construction (or deconstruction). I started posting a project build thread on the old school NZ site to describe my PL310 if you're interested.

PL310 Bluebird build on old school NZ:

https://oldschool.co.nz/index.php?/topic/60267-marts-pl310-61-datsun-bluebird-sedan/

 

Just been reading your entire derusting project topic, nice metalwork fabrication skills!

 

[Charlie69]

On 3/10/2020 at 8:52 PM, mklotz70 said:

Thank Wayne!
Yes, I'm making stuff again....for now.

 

That is great news Mike!  The Datsun community is still going to be able to source Quality custom parts, unlike the shit some others sell!