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79 210 starting and misfire issues


sunny310

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Get the inner grease seals too. I think you have to pry them out of the hub to get the inner bearing out anyway and a bad, old, dried up one will let water in. This may be why the bearings are shot. I've replaced front wheel bearings and it doesn't take much and they growl. On pavement it sounds like a gravel road. Clean out all traces of the old grease (might be the original from '79) lubricants have come a long way in 40 years. And don't forget to lube the seal lips so it doesn't start up dry on the spindle.

 

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Right is the original '84 Maxima front wheel bearing. The left is a '74 710 bearing.... gotta love Nissan for using the same bearings for all those years and more. I was getting a slight growl on right hand turns, wasn't the tires. Just this much will do it. The grease was contaminated with water. The left ones are used, I slipped them in and away I go. With new seals that is.

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Awesome. Thanks for the info. The wheel was pretty wobbly. That’s how bad they were. Glad I caught that before I started driving it. Wonder why they use roller bearings instead of ball bearings like on my Chevy truck...

Edited by sunny310
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9 hours ago, datzenmike said:

Tapered roller bearings, (there are an inner and an outer) can handle more load and axial (side) thrust with less wear. Ball bearings are not as good for side loading but they are cheaper and run with less friction.

Oh ok gotcha. I ordered the inner seal late last night. Good thing u mentioned that to me. I was thinking that it came with the inner bearing kit I ordered. Hopefully it comes soon. Was thinking while since I got the car jacked up I might as well take cut a coil or 2 off n drop the car. I know this is the engine section so I won’t post more about that stuff

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In a kit? perhaps it will have the seal.

 

Blindly cutting a coil is a bad idea for lowering. Shortening a coil increases it's spring rate, or stiffness. Now generally, increasing the spring rate is a good idea as stock suspensions tend to be a little soft anyway, but the chances of lowering to where you want it AND not be too stiff is very unlikely. You may end up with... "It's lowered just how I like it but geez!!! it's like I have square tires now." On top of this, lower too far and there is the real risk of bottoming out the strut insert inside it and damaging it. You will need to do the same on the rear.

 

There is a simple multiply and divide formula for working out a coil spring's rate. What I did was work out my 710's front coils and increase the rate by a known amount and then trim them. Mine was 50% and I was comfortable with this, yours may be different and I suggest doing this in increments because if you cut too much off you can't put it back. The actual lowering was accomplished by cutting the weld on lower spring mount on the strut so it could be slid down and locked in place using a split collar. (about $20 a pair) All you need is an angle grinder and some wrenches. This method lowers the vehicle regardless of the spring rate.

 

Nick just above the weld

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Grind smooth

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A pair of 2" split collars

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Assemble with the lower spring perch no movable up or down and clamp the split collar below it.

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I used a hydraulic jack and chunk of wood to lift the car by compressing the spring, then tighten the split collar. Measure and then do the other side. Split collars are rated to hold 6,000 pounds each when tightened. If worried get two sets. The firmer the spring the safer it is to lower.  Two-three inches is ok.

facikh7.jpg

 

ANY lowering or raising will cause the toe in setting on the alignment to change. It will also affect the camber. You may need adjustable camber plates to correct it. Correct camber first, then toe. This can also be done at home on a level driveway.

 

One last thing is the steering tie rods. The body ends of the tie rods lowered with the body while the steering knuckle ends at the wheel are now higher. The steering components are designed to sit level to give neutral feel going over a bump. Now, if one wheel goes over a bump or dip in the road you will feel the steering wheel tug to one side. This is known as 'bump steer'. It can be a scary feeling out on the highway at speed. To correct, the steering knuckle can be lowered with spacers to make it level again.

 

Here's the problem. The wheel side (left) is higher than the center of the car.

ERZPjuB.jpg

 

I made these out of 1/4"scrap aluminum. Turned out that 1/2" was enough. Naturally I had to re-set the toe but the difference was amazing and I was glad it did this.ULBN6wC.jpg

 

They go between the bottom of the strut and the steering knuckle to space it downward...

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Just some things to consider when lowering. A lowered car should handle better with the firmer springs and lower center of gravity but you can easily upset the handling if you don't correct some introduced problems.

 

Work out the rear spring rate and trim to more or less match the fronts. These won't be adjustable so if too low you will need to make rubber spacers to put between the top of the spring and the body to 'shim' it upward where you want it. If not low enough perhaps buy coil springs the correct rate and shorter? Maybe someone here has an idea that has done this?

 

None of the above is rocket science.

 

 

 

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Wow Man U really know ur stuff. Wish I lived close by...I’d probably be at ur place all da time lol. As long as it doesn’t involve welding i suppose I can try it. I was looking into 280zx struts that’s everyone’s talking about but i can’t weld. So I was just going to cut a coil n a half out for now until I get something better. 

My 83 Chevy truck is lowered the right way with spindles n drop coils n drop shocks n it rides n handles pretty good. Still have to get proper shocks for the rear(just has flip kit). My old 74 c10 just had cut coils and it rode like shit so I understand the importance of doing stuff that right way n not half assed. Wish i had more fabrication skills or else I would do a lot more myself. 

I read a post from PumpkinDave about using 510 springs and cutting em to lower the rear. Is that a good option?

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No welding needed!!! 6" angle grinder and some wrenches to take the strut out. I didn't even use a spring compressor to get the coil out. I braced the top against a concrete wall and undid the nut. The spring kicked the rest of the strut (with the caliper and rotor on for added weight) about a foot and a half onto the lawn. It's one way so no need to compress to assemble with split collars, the spring goes in loose and is adjusted with a jack on the car.  If you can multiply and divide, the rate can be worked out in advance of actually cutting the spring. All you need are a few measurements on the spring and plug them into the formula.

 

The formula is.... 11,250,000 X wire thickness  4  /  8 X number of free coils X coil diameter 3  

 Simple multiply and divide

 

280zx struts are even better as they are already shorter than the 210 struts plus there is a monster caliper and larger rotor. Probably you will need 14" rims to clear the caliper. You will need to use your 210 top hats, springs and bottom perches as the 280zx springs are really too large a diameter anyway. This will probably get you an inch or two plus you can go another 2 inches safely.

 

 

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18 minutes ago, sunny310 said:

 

I read a post from PumpkinDave about using 510 springs and cutting em to lower the rear. Is that a good option?

 

It might, but the variable is what is lowering to you? Will his lowering be acceptable to you? Will it be too stiff? or not low enough? or both? Best to do your own.

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I think I’m leaning towards the 280zx struts. Seems like a better option for me. Also want to get a set of 280zx snow flake wheels which I see will be a challenge to find(also looking at 300zx z31 wheels). 

 

I think imma concentrate on getting the car running n driving first before I do all this. I’m just getting excited n thinking about everything. Just gotta take everything in stride. 

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Oh hey, I hear ya. I call that visualizing. Go over and over something and try to anticipate problems with an idea. It also keeps the interest and momentum up on rainy days. Well you can practice on your 210. here's something else...

 

While you have the struts out you can check to see if the original oil bath dampers (shocks) are still inside the strut tube. If they are, you can drain out the thin hydraulic oil and replace with 20W motorcycle fork oil. Thicker oil resists being pushed through the valves much more that the original oil. This will increase the shock firmness and re-new them. I used 20W Belray for oil about $15 US? a liter enough for 3 struts. Naturally a previous owner may have already replaced them with universal strut inserts.

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Well I had a good look under the car today and it looks like they might have replaced all the rear shocks n front struts. Under the car is pretty tidy. I'm glad I got a Cali car. I drained the gas and holy smokes it was really nasty...there wasn't any rust or debris but the gas was really yellow and smelled putrid. Looked like urine straight up lol. Never seen anything like that. We blew out the gas lines too with compressed air.

Hey btw the thing I want to do more than anything else is swap the auto trans for a manual. I've been looking for a 5 speed box but no luck so I'll have to settle for a 4 speed. Also can't seem to find a pedal box...can I just swap out the pedals themselves or do I need the whole pedal box? N can a b210 pedal box work in a b310? Trying to make a list of what I need for the swap

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True but it'll be more fun with a manual. I was actually looking for a manual car but got this one anyway. Thought to myself I could alway convert it to manual. Don't mind just getting  a 4 speed box. 

Edited by sunny310
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Easiest is to find a junk car with a manual trans. Everything needed is in it. Such as...

 

Manual drive shaft may be different length, I don't know.

Transmission mount/cross member

Pedal box

Master cylinder (and push rod)

Hard line

Flex line

Slave cylinder (and push rod.

Clutch arm and dust boot

Shifter and dust boot.

Flywheel

Clutch and pressure plate (though a good ides to replace them)

Release bearing collar.

Wiring for the reverse lights.

 

Need to get a pilot bearing for the end of the crankshaft.

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10 hours ago, datzenmike said:

Easiest is to find a junk car with a manual trans. Everything needed is in it. Such as...

 

Manual drive shaft may be different length, I don't know.

Transmission mount/cross member

Pedal box

Master cylinder (and push rod)

Hard line

Flex line

Slave cylinder (and push rod.

Clutch arm and dust boot

Shifter and dust boot.

Flywheel

Clutch and pressure plate (though a good ides to replace them)

Release bearing collar.

Wiring for the reverse lights.

 

Need to get a pilot bearing for the end of the crankshaft.

Yeah that’s a lotta stuff. Even worse for me is here in South Dakota these cars are pretty much non existent lol. Almost positive it’s the only 210 in the whole state. So finding a parts car here is almost impossible. I’ll have to get stuff piece by piece til I have everything. The guys at the local NAPA had no idea what a Datsun 210 is. Had to show em a pic lol

Edited by sunny310
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You may have to travel some but find one and strip all the stuff you need off of it. There'll be one in a back yard or behind a barn or something. I had friends looking for me. Often as not it ended up being a Toyota or something else.

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Update... so we put in the pushrods and adjusted all the valves n everything. When we cranked over the engine the same pushrods were trying to come out from under the arms again. So we adjusted the valves again on those cylinders but the same thing happened n one of the pushrods got bent. So looks like we gotta dig deeper and see what’s going on. At this point I just feel like shoving another engine in there

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On 10/18/2018 at 7:07 PM, datzenmike said:

remove the push rods and take a look at the tops of the valve springs. Are they all the same height??? Is one noticeably lower than the others?

 

If one or more tops are lower then a valve seat may have fallen out and the valve can't close. So if you re-set the lash you will be extending the valve lift deeper into the engine and when the piston comes up to TDC it hits the valve and forces it towards closed (which it can't) and the the push rod bends

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56 minutes ago, datzenmike said:

 

If one or more tops are lower then a valve seat may have fallen out and the valve can't close. So if you re-set the lash you will be extending the valve lift deeper into the engine and when the piston comes up to TDC it hits the valve and forces it towards closed (which it can't) and the the push rod bends

Well definitely gotta pull the head n see if that’s what happened. So if a valve seat fell out how do I put one back there? Has to go to a machine shop then?

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Something is not right. See if one or more valves are sitting lower than the others. This would indicate they are not closing properly. This could mean they are bent or the seat fell out. Seats usually fall out from severe over heating.

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I decided to turn over the engine by hand n check out those 2 valves n looks to me like they’re stuck. I can see that the rocker arms take long to go back in the up position. Haven’t had time to get the head off cuz of work but hope to have it off by this weekend

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Well good news. Turns out the valves were  indeed stuck. My neighbor had his mechanic buddy come n tap on em a couple times n they freed up. Adjusted the valves cold then she fired right up n purred like a kitten. We let it warm up n adjusted the valves hot. No valve train noise or anything. Finally running like it should. Didn’t drive it yet cuz still gotta finish up the wheel bearing job. I’m a happy boy tonight??

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